It doesn't seem as stupid as people passing judgement on the contents of a web page they haven't even read then declaring the authors of the page biassed.
Press TV is pure propaganda - if you know this already then you're deliberately linking to lies, if you didn't know it was propaganda then you're a cretin.
Trying hard to deflect the issues arn't you, but it wont work.
You create a topic called "Israel a Rogue nation?" Post links to news stories about Israels actions, then have the audacity to say in response to my reply,
Now you are coming out with another stupid counter comment designed to pass the buck to myself.
And then we have the link to that bastion of the truth PressTV.
Mouthpiece for Am A Dinnerjacket!
Cheerio Fred.
and DGSx replied:
Press TV is the PR wing of the Iranian government, an organisation that is not exactly fond of Israel and one who are profoundly anti semitic. I am not surprised you were able to find two anti Israel stories there to enable to to further your anti Israel quest here.
and you replied:
Sorry, but your claim that Israel is rogue nation and to use a Iranian PR source is just a joke.
If any of you had read the link you would have seen that it was to an announcement made by the Iranian government that they intended to open an oil bourse, an announcement made before the cutting of the data cables happened, the page made no reference to Israel at all.
Yet you accuse others who base their opinions on facts of bias and prejudice.
If any of you had read the link you would have seen that it was to an announcement made by the Iranian government that they intended to open an oil bourse, an announcement made before the cutting of the data cables happened, the page made no reference to Israel at all.
Yet you accuse others who base their opinions on facts of bias and prejudice.
If you quoted Josef Goebbels, you'd leave yourself open to similar criticism.
If you quote liars, expect to be called a liar or a fool.
Not sure which you are yet, though fool is looking like the winner.
They are a rogue nation. How dare they give women equal rights to men! How dare they give their people in general Western style human rights! How dare have free and fair elections! That isn't how things are done in the Middle-East, and I think they need to be told.
However this is not the first time Israel has apologised for forging British passports, it happened in 1987 too and they gave us their solemn word it would never happen again then. How are we to believe them this time?.
The trouble is this is not unique the CIA have been accused of using false passports before.....
I'm not in anyway making excuses for what Mossad were accused of doing but lets be honest I doubt any intelligance service operates an "ethical foreign policy".
The other is that an Israeli spy captured in Egypt has confirmed that it is, indeed, Israel who has been cutting under sea data cables to the Middle East.
All society, even global society, is based on trust. Israel has shown time after time that they can not be trusted.
Again in the modern world it seem data comms is now a valid front line either directly, as you have suggested, or in surpressing free speech as we have seen of late...
Offline, some efforts by the U.S. government and its allies to punish the website dedicated to publishing secret documents landed in court or headed to one. Judicial authorities in France foiled the French government's effort to boot WikiLeaks from its French computer servers, while supporters in Switzerland and Germany threatened lawsuits against U.S. financial companies who have cut their ties to WikiLeaks.
.
If it was in there interest to cut links to Wiki Island (if such a place existed) do we doubt for a moment that CIA trained dolphins would be on there way
Is Israel a rogue nation ? Compared to what standards ? Compared to the US or Russia I dare say Israel is 'mid table' at best. Show me a nation with modern and far reaching intelligence service and I will show you a nation that engaged in dirty tricks. Alas its the natire of the world we live in. We should condemn Isreal when they do wrong, but lets not pretend they are the only bad boys on the block.
This is so threadbare and lame .Is this the best the anti Israel posters can come up with .
You speak of being anti-Israeli as if it was a crime for anyone in the planet to have an issue with another country.
I've yet to see ANYONE on this thread accept that Israel may have done some heinous deeds with the passport fraud and the possible cutting of internet cables.
Rather than show a little humility and maturity as FMs, you'd rather just deflect from the OP's original point and complain to them.
I have seen those who argue from a pro-Arab perspective admit the issues like both with the Arabs and the Israelis.
I have never ever seen anyone on this forum with pro-Israeli arguments admit or concede their complicity over the years in the region.
That is why I despair of these debates because it's extremely one sided.
They are a rogue nation. How dare they give women equal rights to men! How dare they give their people in general Western style human rights! How dare have free and fair elections! That isn't how things are done in the Middle-East, and I think they need to be told.
I take it this passed you by :
Jewish settlers move into house after Israeli police evict Palestinian family
Israeli police have evicted nine Palestinian families living in two houses in occupied East Jerusalem.
Jewish settlers moved into the houses almost immediately. The US has urged Israel to abandon plans for a building project in the area.
Israeli police have evicted nine Palestinian families living in two houses in occupied East Jerusalem.
Jewish settlers moved into the houses almost immediately. The US has urged Israel to abandon plans for a building project in the area.
It doesn't seem as stupid as people passing judgement on the contents of a web page they haven't even read then declaring the authors of the page biassed.
I read the link you provided, it had no relevance to what you were spouting off about. I them commented that Press TV is about as truthful as a Tory MP's expense claims. You then kicked off on one.
Yes Israel may have used forged British passports and assassinated a terrorist scumbag. So they did a small wrong and a huge right. It all weighs even at the end of the day the world is a better place without him in it.
Tensions are rising on Israel's border with the Hamas-ruled Gaza Strip.
Israeli troops spotted several Palestinian militants whom the army said were trying to plant a roadside bomb on the Gaza border. Helicopters and an armored force opened fire on the gunmen, and Palestinian officials say two members of the Islamic Jihad group were killed.
The Israeli army said militants in Gaza have fired 25 rockets or mortar rounds into Israel since Sunday, and Israel has responded with air strikes against what it said were tunnels, militant training sites and weapons facilities in Gaza.
One rocket struck just metres (yards) from a kindergarten in a southern Israeli kibbutz, wounding a teenage girl.
DGS, which claims to be a democracy ? - Hamas or Israel ?
I do not think democracy comes into it. The simple fact is Hamas are waging an indiscriminate attack against the nation of Israel and you refuse to acknowledge the fact that it is wrong.
However this is not the first time Israel has apologised for forging British passports, it happened in 1987 too and they gave us their solemn word it would never happen again then. How are we to believe them this time?
The other is that an Israeli spy captured in Egypt has confirmed that it is, indeed, Israel who has been cutting under sea data cables to the Middle East.
All society, even global society, is based on trust. Israel has shown time after time that they can not be trusted.
Yet more bias from the Iranian regime's lackey on Digital Spy. Because you are unwilling to criticise the gross human right abuses (such as the stoning to death of women and the hanging of teenagers), election fraud and the support of terrorists by Iran, your posts have no credibility whatsoever because of your own complete hypocrisy and total double standards on these issues.
I do not think democracy comes into it. The simple fact is Hamas are waging an indiscriminate attack against the nation of Israel and you refuse to acknowledge the fact that it is wrong.
You don't accept that for every action, there's a re-action ? - Israel attacks, the Palestinians defend themselves, yet they're (the Palestinians) are to blame
Give the Palestinians basic human rights; stop abusing those rights, and maybe there'll be peace.
This really does show your lack of intelligence and ignorance. They already have those human rights, for years Israel has left Gaza to its own devices with no single tank or solider occupying Gaza. Gazans had all the cards and oppertunity to flourish, allow peace to rule with open borders and free trade. But no, that will never happen as there will be no more anti-Israel propaganda to sell the world.
The Gazans have right to vote , they even held an election a few years ago but that ended up in civil war with Fatah and Hamas slaughtering hundreds of people in weeks of open war, with babies and children starving to death in their homes as stepping outside would result in being killed in cross fire.
Eventully Gazans elect Hamas , a recognized terrorist organization to rule over them. Another round of killings begin with police rounding up remainder of Fatah members who are then executed.
Hamas then go on to continue waging war against Israel, using schools and playgrounds to fire their weapons from, then calling upon groups of women and children to surround them as they make their escape into the residential areas, knowing full well that IDF seldom shoot back when human shields are used. Is this use of the population in accordance with human rights? no of course not.
How dare you speak about human rights, when the Palestinian Authority are the biggest abusers of human rights, especailly when it comes to persecuting and murdering Christians and Jews.
This really does show your lack of intelligence and ignorance. They already have those human rights, for years Israel has left Gaza to its own devices with no single tank or solider occupying Gaza.
Let's take a deeper look shall we :
(from 2007 but relevant today) :
Israel's 'invisible hand' in Gaza
Although Israel withdrew from Gaza more than a year ago, its control over the lives of Palestinians there is in some ways even tighter than before, a new report by an Israeli human rights organisation says.
The disengagement plan states: "Israel will hold sole control of Gaza airspace and will continue to carry out military activity in the waters of the Gaza Strip." Therefore, Israel continues to maintain exclusive control of Gaza's airspace and the territorial waters, just as it has since it occupied the Gaza Strip in 1967.
And if you are now trying to tell everyone that you were not aware of the funding for PressTV, then I must call you out on it Fred.
You were told time and time again on the thread you started about Journalists being attacked by teenagers under the control of the Met during the student protests.
OH dear this is so pathetic. Yet again you fail to acknoweldge why Israel has to keep on going back into Gaza. Hamas have hardly been good neighbours have they. There could be open borders and peace tommorow, but that is not in the interest of all the Arab nations, so no matter what concession Israel makes, such us complete withdraw, allowing elections and letting Gazans get on and rule and police themselves, there will always be attacks against Israel, which of course continue the never ending spiral of events.
DGS, which claims to be a democracy ? - Hamas or Israel ?
Israel claims to be a democracy. I understand that's the reason that you so often criticize Israel. I understand this because it's the reason you actually said.
Pakistan claims to be a democracy. I don't understand then why you apply a rule of "their country, their rules" to Pakistan.
Your logic doesn't make sense. It's almost as though there's actually another reason why you ignore one country's faults while highlighting another.
I appreciate you might say this thread is about Israel and if you would prefer I could ask the real reason for your double standards in the thread about Pakistan. It would bring it back up the boards too.
So, what's the real reason as it's clearly not about which country claims it is a democracy as you've previously stated.
I know I've asked this before but you always seem to go offline and refuse to answer.
As mentioned in another thread, BB, Pakistan is anything but a democracy. It's highly corrupt and regarded as a failed state by the majority of countries.
To call Islamabad a 'democracy', you might as well apply the same to countries like Afghanistan (or Iraq).
As mentioned in another thread, BB, Pakistan is anything but a democracy. It's highly corrupt and regarded as a failed state by the majority of countries.
To call Islamabad a 'democracy', you might as well apply the same to countries like Afghanistan (or Iraq).
Oh do stop trying to divert. I said Pakistan CLAIM to be a democracy. I said it as you said Israel CLAIM to be a democracy and that claim is the reason you criticize Israel. They both CLAIM to be democratic.
Why not just answer the question instead of failing to wriggle out of it?
Comments
It's certainly not for the want of trying.
Its like they have run out of material and are somehow surviving on inedible scraps
Press TV is pure propaganda - if you know this already then you're deliberately linking to lies, if you didn't know it was propaganda then you're a cretin.
I think that about wraps it up.
It's a fair question.
This is the link in question.
http://edition.presstv.ir/detail/37468.html
That is the link to which duckymallard replied:
and DGSx replied:
and you replied:
If any of you had read the link you would have seen that it was to an announcement made by the Iranian government that they intended to open an oil bourse, an announcement made before the cutting of the data cables happened, the page made no reference to Israel at all.
Yet you accuse others who base their opinions on facts of bias and prejudice.
If you quoted Josef Goebbels, you'd leave yourself open to similar criticism.
If you quote liars, expect to be called a liar or a fool.
Not sure which you are yet, though fool is looking like the winner.
Both.
The trouble is this is not unique the CIA have been accused of using false passports before.....
CIA ‘used fake British passports’ in kidnap operation or...
Spanish prosecutors want 13 CIA agents arrested
I'm not in anyway making excuses for what Mossad were accused of doing but lets be honest I doubt any intelligance service operates an "ethical foreign policy".
Again in the modern world it seem data comms is now a valid front line either directly, as you have suggested, or in surpressing free speech as we have seen of late...
Protests, cyber-skirmishes rage over WikiLeaks .
If it was in there interest to cut links to Wiki Island (if such a place existed) do we doubt for a moment that CIA trained dolphins would be on there way
Is Israel a rogue nation ? Compared to what standards ? Compared to the US or Russia I dare say Israel is 'mid table' at best. Show me a nation with modern and far reaching intelligence service and I will show you a nation that engaged in dirty tricks. Alas its the natire of the world we live in. We should condemn Isreal when they do wrong, but lets not pretend they are the only bad boys on the block.
You speak of being anti-Israeli as if it was a crime for anyone in the planet to have an issue with another country.
I've yet to see ANYONE on this thread accept that Israel may have done some heinous deeds with the passport fraud and the possible cutting of internet cables.
Rather than show a little humility and maturity as FMs, you'd rather just deflect from the OP's original point and complain to them.
I have seen those who argue from a pro-Arab perspective admit the issues like both with the Arabs and the Israelis.
I have never ever seen anyone on this forum with pro-Israeli arguments admit or concede their complicity over the years in the region.
That is why I despair of these debates because it's extremely one sided.
I take it this passed you by :
Jewish settlers move into house after Israeli police evict Palestinian family
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/23/jewish-settlers-arab-area-palestinians-evicted
Another Palestinian family :
Palestinians evicted in Jerusalem
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8180413.stm
How fair Israel is to other minorities
I read the link you provided, it had no relevance to what you were spouting off about. I them commented that Press TV is about as truthful as a Tory MP's expense claims. You then kicked off on one.
Yes Israel may have used forged British passports and assassinated a terrorist scumbag. So they did a small wrong and a huge right. It all weighs even at the end of the day the world is a better place without him in it.
How fair Hamas is to other humans
I do not think democracy comes into it. The simple fact is Hamas are waging an indiscriminate attack against the nation of Israel and you refuse to acknowledge the fact that it is wrong.
Yet more bias from the Iranian regime's lackey on Digital Spy. Because you are unwilling to criticise the gross human right abuses (such as the stoning to death of women and the hanging of teenagers), election fraud and the support of terrorists by Iran, your posts have no credibility whatsoever because of your own complete hypocrisy and total double standards on these issues.
You don't accept that for every action, there's a re-action ? - Israel attacks, the Palestinians defend themselves, yet they're (the Palestinians) are to blame
Yes, a completely outdated document (and statements); even those running Gaza know it was wrong to say that.
Give the Palestinians basic human rights; stop abusing those rights, and maybe there'll be peace.
This really does show your lack of intelligence and ignorance. They already have those human rights, for years Israel has left Gaza to its own devices with no single tank or solider occupying Gaza. Gazans had all the cards and oppertunity to flourish, allow peace to rule with open borders and free trade. But no, that will never happen as there will be no more anti-Israel propaganda to sell the world.
The Gazans have right to vote , they even held an election a few years ago but that ended up in civil war with Fatah and Hamas slaughtering hundreds of people in weeks of open war, with babies and children starving to death in their homes as stepping outside would result in being killed in cross fire.
Eventully Gazans elect Hamas , a recognized terrorist organization to rule over them. Another round of killings begin with police rounding up remainder of Fatah members who are then executed.
Hamas then go on to continue waging war against Israel, using schools and playgrounds to fire their weapons from, then calling upon groups of women and children to surround them as they make their escape into the residential areas, knowing full well that IDF seldom shoot back when human shields are used. Is this use of the population in accordance with human rights? no of course not.
How dare you speak about human rights, when the Palestinian Authority are the biggest abusers of human rights, especailly when it comes to persecuting and murdering Christians and Jews.
Let's take a deeper look shall we :
(from 2007 but relevant today) :
Israel's 'invisible hand' in Gaza
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6270331.stm
Israel's control of the airspace and the territorial waters of the Gaza Strip
http://www.btselem.org/english/gaza_strip/control_on_air_space_and_territorial_waters.asp
(when Israel was bombing Gaza in 2008/9) :
War and Natural Gas: The Israeli Invasion and Gaza's Offshore Gas Fields
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=11680
The above is in addition to the illegal Israeli Blockade; the IDF control what (and who) leaves and enters Gaza.
You were saying about 'opportunity' for the Palestinians, TM ?
And if you are now trying to tell everyone that you were not aware of the funding for PressTV, then I must call you out on it Fred.
You were told time and time again on the thread you started about Journalists being attacked by teenagers under the control of the Met during the student protests.
Israel claims to be a democracy. I understand that's the reason that you so often criticize Israel. I understand this because it's the reason you actually said.
Pakistan claims to be a democracy. I don't understand then why you apply a rule of "their country, their rules" to Pakistan.
Your logic doesn't make sense. It's almost as though there's actually another reason why you ignore one country's faults while highlighting another.
I appreciate you might say this thread is about Israel and if you would prefer I could ask the real reason for your double standards in the thread about Pakistan. It would bring it back up the boards too.
So, what's the real reason as it's clearly not about which country claims it is a democracy as you've previously stated.
I know I've asked this before but you always seem to go offline and refuse to answer.
To call Islamabad a 'democracy', you might as well apply the same to countries like Afghanistan (or Iraq).
Oh do stop trying to divert. I said Pakistan CLAIM to be a democracy. I said it as you said Israel CLAIM to be a democracy and that claim is the reason you criticize Israel. They both CLAIM to be democratic.
Why not just answer the question instead of failing to wriggle out of it?