I think she could possibly be preggers .... and for some reason, I think Pete really does like her.
But not forgetting that decade .... that would be very bad news for Peggy. She'd be ostracised (for being caught out)
Do I think Roger has seen the light? Dunno, next week will tell.
What will fascinate me, if she is, is seeing which way Pete will jump. The point of the fight was to show that his feelings run deep towards Peggy and that will make him want to stand by her but at the same time there's a spoilt competitive little boy in there who is going to look for the main chance and let her manage as best she can on her own. Few social issues have turned around so much in so short a time. It really was a different world.
This is one of the best, if not best, shows on air. The way Don just totally opened up at the end about his background, mother etc. took me completely by surprise. For someone who takes great care to keep his past hidden this was quite a shock. I'm not clear though if his wife knows all this, I have a feeling she doesn't.
I think when he looked at Roger and his wife together he perhaps thought that he had had enough of living a lie. As he said to Rachel, this is all there is. I think Rachel is serious about him too. Her sort of woman would not have allowed him in and given in to him in that era if she wasn't.
If his wife doesn't know the fact that he has opened up to Rachel will hurt her more than anything else if she finds out.
Do we think Don really loves Rachel? Or was she someone he thought was unobtainable and now his interest will wear off?
Don does love his wife, but he seems to have forgotten the reason he married her in the first place (her looks, sweet personality, chance to start an American dream style family) and just concentrated on her more negative aspects, hence sending her to a shrink.
Now he has lost the other bit on the side (forgotten her name, the one who was very arty), he has in Rachel someone who is at his level intellectually, beautiful, and a little mysterious and intriguing - traits which seems to appeal to Don.
I also love this show and agree with all that has been said about it. haven't watched last night's ep. yet - have V-plussed it - but no-one has mentioned the time Pete exchanged his wedding present for a rifle - I wonder if that rifle will be seen again?.......
For someone who takes great care to keep his past hidden this was quite a shock. I'm not clear though if his wife knows all this, I have a feeling she doesn't.
I don't think Don has told anyone ever, what he told Rachel.
Loved the how much Joan looked like Shirley Maclaine in 'The Apartment' when she had to push the buttons in the lift!
A nice nod to the conversation Roger and Joan had earlier. I also loved when the senior partner Cooper told Joan she could do better than Roger or any of the other creeps she brings home.
A good piece about Mad Men by Alison Graham in next week's Radio Times .....
"For flawless perfection of a beautifully cut diamond look no further than Mad Men. It's the most exquisite piece of television I have ever seen.Right from it's Saul Bass-inspired title sequence Mad Men is peerless.But it isn't a thriller,not in the car chase,government-conspiracy sense.
It's about the personnel of a Madison Avenue advertising agency in the early 1960s.Nothing much happens-my favourite episode so far was set at a children's birthday party where the children played and the increasingly drunk adults hypnotically revealed themselves. It was like watching a lovely ballet.
This is what Mad Men does every week...peels away layers. Everyone dresses immaculately,smokes endlessly and drinks far too much.Yet there are corrupted souls beneath those crisp white shirts and cinched dresses. The traffic-stoppingly handsome (isn't he just.?..my own words there ) Jon Hamm is ad exec Don Draper,a war hero with a perfect wife and perfect kids living in the perfect suburbs. yet slowly and quietly week after week, the real Don(if that is even his name) is being shown to us,bit by bit. I'm not sure I can describe how utterly fascinating this is.
Really, it sounds like nothing ,and yet Mad Men is everything.
Only recently got into this and now hooked !. Don Draper is dishy looking and so epitomes the 'man' of the time, but it breaks my heart when he cheats on his sweet model wife !.
Also i like the way it ends subtely every week, yet is a fantastic drama of the time.
A good piece about Mad Men by Alison Graham in next week's Radio Times .....
"For flawless perfection of a beautifully cut diamond look no further than Mad Men. It's the most exquisite piece of television I have ever seen.Right from it's Saul Bass-inspired title sequence Mad Men is peerless.But it isn't a thriller,not in the car chase,government-conspiracy sense.
It's about the personnel of a Madison Avenue advertising agency in the early 1960s.Nothing much happens-my favourite episode so far was set at a children's birthday party where the children played and the increasingly drunk adults hypnotically revealed themselves. It was like watching a lovely ballet.
This is what Mad Men does every week...peels away layers. Everyone dresses immaculately,smokes endlessly and drinks far too much.Yet there are corrupted souls beneath those crisp white shirts and cinched dresses. The traffic-stoppingly handsome (isn't he just.?..my own words there ) Jon Hamm is ad exec Don Draper,a war hero with a perfect wife and perfect kids living in the perfect suburbs. yet slowly and quietly week after week, the real Don(if that is even his name) is being shown to us,bit by bit. I'm not sure I can describe how utterly fascinating this is.
Really, it sounds like nothing ,and yet Mad Men is everything.
What a fabulous description - Absolutely loving this show... Jon Hamm is amazing ...but so is everyone really.
Each character is conflicted, with an outer shell that protects or smothers them....but occasionally stealing moments which allow their "hidden selves" to leak out.
Top Five Overblown American Imports:
The trailers are slick, the casts are strewn with A Listers and TV staples, the cinematography is of the highest calibre...Doh!-Someone forgot to include a decent storyline...
And last of all - Mad Men.
This is an artful case of style over content for me. Matthew Weiner, at best, seats somewhere between decent dialogue-driven writing, and plain old ponderous navel-gazing punctuated only by uneventful guff. Judging by the damage done with the last season of The Sopranos- its easy to see which side of that fence he's falling.
There is something inherently 'pleased with itself' in the style of American drama's these days. In much the same way as actors like Glen Close try to fill a screen with their presence and hushed approach- 'look at me...I'm acting- I'm commanding your attention...watch me...ACT- observe my talent'.
Equally, whenever I watch something like Mad Men, I can almost hear the cogs in the writers brainstorm room clicking and whirring away, sending us the perceptible message - "yes...this is genius....my sociological wit....watch me write...look...Im WRITING...I can say so much in just a few lines of dialogue".
Ever watched an old episode of The Rockford Files or Ironside, and marvelled at how they can cover all this social commentary and STILL fit an engaging storyline in there? If not, perhaps its time you did.
I agree with a lot of what is being said. For such a slow-burning program, 45 minutes flies by.
Does anyone know what the ratings were like for this in America? I fear if they weren't good, it could be cancelled. We all know that US networks have no patience and often don't give programs a chance to build an audience base.
Top Five Overblown American Imports:
The trailers are slick, the casts are strewn with A Listers and TV staples, the cinematography is of the highest calibre...Doh!-Someone forgot to include a decent storyline...
There were no A-listers in Mad Men and John Hamm was plucked from obscurity.
Have to agree with you on Dirty Sexy Money, though. It's appalling.
Does anyone know what the ratings were like for this in America? I fear if they weren't good, it could be cancelled. We all know that US networks have no patience and often don't give programs a chance to build an audience base.
Luckily, this airs on cable on a channel called AMC. It has been renewed for a second season, which starts in July in the US.
Top Five Overblown American Imports:
The trailers are slick, the casts are strewn with A Listers and TV staples, the cinematography is of the highest calibre...Doh!-Someone forgot to include a decent storyline...
And last of all - Mad Men.
This is an artful case of style over content for me. Matthew Weiner, at best, seats somewhere between decent dialogue-driven writing, and plain old ponderous navel-gazing punctuated only by uneventful guff. Judging by the damage done with the last season of The Sopranos- its easy to see which side of that fence he's falling.
There is something inherently 'pleased with itself' in the style of American drama's these days. In much the same way as actors like Glen Close try to fill a screen with their presence and hushed approach- 'look at me...I'm acting- I'm commanding your attention...watch me...ACT- observe my talent'.
Equally, whenever I watch something like Mad Men, I can almost hear the cogs in the writers brainstorm room clicking and whirring away, sending us the perceptible message - "yes...this is genius....my sociological wit....watch me write...look...Im WRITING...I can say so much in just a few lines of dialogue".
Ever watched an old episode of The Rockford Files or Ironside, and marvelled at how they can cover all this social commentary and STILL fit an engaging storyline in there? If not, perhaps its time you did.
Well that is your opinion, but I think Mad Men is almost as good as Six Foot Under of which the last series was class !
I have to agree with Pushing Daisies though, could only watch 20 mins of it before I gave up. Too twee, too sweet and quirky for my tastes !!
Top Five Overblown American Imports:
The trailers are slick, the casts are strewn with A Listers and TV staples, the cinematography is of the highest calibre...Doh!-Someone forgot to include a decent storyline...
And last of all - Mad Men.
This is an artful case of style over content for me. Matthew Weiner, at best, seats somewhere between decent dialogue-driven writing, and plain old ponderous navel-gazing punctuated only by uneventful guff. Judging by the damage done with the last season of The Sopranos- its easy to see which side of that fence he's falling.
I have to say that I agree with you in relation to Dirty Sexy Money/Pushing Daisys/ and the last few Desperate Housewives - In these shows the "look" seems/ feels like a superfluous add on... not in anyway integral to the drama....I really don't think that criticism is true of Mad Men.
If I had to compare Mad Men to any recent US imports I'd be more likey to say something like Dexter.....which might seem odd at first....but for me both shows are very specfic examinations of place and character. The visual look and environment are integral.
(Eg. Mad Men there's the scene were Don is having flashbacks after getting high with his beatnik girlfriend and friends....the police are outside and they can't leave but Don can because he wears the costume of succesful middle america...which is a facade he has created which has freed him form his past in a sense.....oops I could blether on for hours ...so I'll just shut up now:D:D)
You all ignored my thread Shame on you!
*shakes fist at forum*
I agree with a lot of what is being said. For such a slow-burning program, 45 minutes flies by.
Does anyone know what the ratings were like for this in America? I fear if they weren't good, it could be cancelled. We all know that US networks have no patience and often don't give programs a chance to build an audience base.
I came to the series late as I'd sky plussed it and then watched about 5 in a row really quickly. I fell in love with the show and was desperate to talk someone about it (I know no one in real life who watches!) I tried using the search facility to find a forum but none appeared. I thought about starting my own thread but this one got started.
Someone linked your thread and I had a read, but compared to this thread it seemed very negative - lots of people giving up on Mad Men because it was too slow etc so I stuck to this one - more kindred spirits here!
(Eg. Mad Men there's the scene were Don is having flashbacks after getting high with his beatnik girlfriend and friends....the police are outside and they can't leave but Don can because he wears the costume of succesful middle america...which is a facade he has created which has freed him form his past in a sense.....oops I could blether on for hours ...so I'll just shut up now:D:D)
I loved that. It said so much so simply. You certainly could go on picking out examples like that!
In total agreement with all positive comments, but no-one's mentioned my fave bits of the series.
The jaw dropping moment when you realise Pete Campbell intended for his wife to shag her ex so he could get in The New Yorker.:eek:
When Sterling hits on Betty, Draper blames her but when he realises it was Stirling gets him wrecked and sweaty so he vomits in front of the Nixon team, Stirling never suspects, but Draper never apologises to poor Betty. Both:D and :mad:
In total agreement with all positive comments, but no-one's mentioned my fave bits of the series.
When Sterling hits on Betty, Draper blames her but when he realises it was Stirling gets him wrecked and sweaty so he vomits in front of the Nixon team, Stirling never suspects, but Draper never apologises to poor Betty. Both:D and :mad:
And of course it's perfectly alright for Don to have who he wants when he wants. :mad: Indeed.
I came to the series late as I'd sky plussed it and then watched about 5 in a row really quickly. I fell in love with the show and was desperate to talk someone about it (I know no one in real life who watches!) I tried using the search facility to find a forum but none appeared. I thought about starting my own thread but this one got started.
Someone linked your thread and I had a read, but compared to this thread it seemed very negative - lots of people giving up on Mad Men because it was too slow etc so I stuck to this one - more kindred spirits here!
LOL, yes, I think I posted about it too soon. People hadn't got into the programme at that stage.
For those of you who might not want to wait, episodes 10-12 are on Sidereel and 13 is on 56.com, thats not downloading by the way, its online streaming, youtube-esque screens, i think its not legal to upload, but its not illegal to watch!
I Love Mad Men the attention to detail is phenomenal. It reminds me of a detective show that is occassionally on BBC - I've totally forgotten what it's called!
I think when he looked at Roger and his wife together he perhaps thought that he had had enough of living a lie. As he said to Rachel, this is all there is. I think Rachel is serious about him too. Her sort of woman would not have allowed him in and given in to him in that era if she wasn't.
If his wife doesn't know the fact that he has opened up to Rachel will hurt her more than anything else if she finds out.
Agree. Rachel isn't the sort of woman to give herself lightly, unlike a certain secretary. Don had nothing but got the American dream for himself, the job, wife, house, children, complete lifestyle. I think he loves Betty but she doesn't engage his heart or soul. If he continues to see Rachel I think it will become a serious relationship for him, possibly for the first time in his life. There's no doubt that Rachel is in love with him.
Agree. Rachel isn't the sort of woman to give herself lightly, unlike a certain secretary.
I wonder if we will see the layers peeled away from Joan's character ..my thoughts about her changed when we saw her crying when she was called in to the office after Roger had his heart attack..perhaps she feels she only good enough for the men in the office to have affairs with her... rather than settle down with her.
Oh and I agree about Rachel and Don.....something special there
Comments
What will fascinate me, if she is, is seeing which way Pete will jump. The point of the fight was to show that his feelings run deep towards Peggy and that will make him want to stand by her but at the same time there's a spoilt competitive little boy in there who is going to look for the main chance and let her manage as best she can on her own. Few social issues have turned around so much in so short a time. It really was a different world.
I was thinking you go girl when she was shooting those birds!
I think when he looked at Roger and his wife together he perhaps thought that he had had enough of living a lie. As he said to Rachel, this is all there is. I think Rachel is serious about him too. Her sort of woman would not have allowed him in and given in to him in that era if she wasn't.
If his wife doesn't know the fact that he has opened up to Rachel will hurt her more than anything else if she finds out.
Don does love his wife, but he seems to have forgotten the reason he married her in the first place (her looks, sweet personality, chance to start an American dream style family) and just concentrated on her more negative aspects, hence sending her to a shrink.
Now he has lost the other bit on the side (forgotten her name, the one who was very arty), he has in Rachel someone who is at his level intellectually, beautiful, and a little mysterious and intriguing - traits which seems to appeal to Don.
I don't think Don has told anyone ever, what he told Rachel.
A nice nod to the conversation Roger and Joan had earlier. I also loved when the senior partner Cooper told Joan she could do better than Roger or any of the other creeps she brings home.
"For flawless perfection of a beautifully cut diamond look no further than Mad Men. It's the most exquisite piece of television I have ever seen.Right from it's Saul Bass-inspired title sequence Mad Men is peerless.But it isn't a thriller,not in the car chase,government-conspiracy sense.
It's about the personnel of a Madison Avenue advertising agency in the early 1960s.Nothing much happens-my favourite episode so far was set at a children's birthday party where the children played and the increasingly drunk adults hypnotically revealed themselves. It was like watching a lovely ballet.
This is what Mad Men does every week...peels away layers. Everyone dresses immaculately,smokes endlessly and drinks far too much.Yet there are corrupted souls beneath those crisp white shirts and cinched dresses. The traffic-stoppingly handsome (isn't he just.?..my own words there
Really, it sounds like nothing ,and yet Mad Men is everything.
Also i like the way it ends subtely every week, yet is a fantastic drama of the time.
What a fabulous description - Absolutely loving this show... Jon Hamm is amazing ...but so is everyone really.
Each character is conflicted, with an outer shell that protects or smothers them....but occasionally stealing moments which allow their "hidden selves" to leak out.
The trailers are slick, the casts are strewn with A Listers and TV staples, the cinematography is of the highest calibre...Doh!-Someone forgot to include a decent storyline...
Starting from the top-
1 : Dirty Sexy Money
2 : Pushing Daisys
3 : Deadwood
4 : (Season 3) Desperate Housewives
And last of all - Mad Men.
This is an artful case of style over content for me. Matthew Weiner, at best, seats somewhere between decent dialogue-driven writing, and plain old ponderous navel-gazing punctuated only by uneventful guff. Judging by the damage done with the last season of The Sopranos- its easy to see which side of that fence he's falling.
There is something inherently 'pleased with itself' in the style of American drama's these days. In much the same way as actors like Glen Close try to fill a screen with their presence and hushed approach- 'look at me...I'm acting- I'm commanding your attention...watch me...ACT- observe my talent'.
Equally, whenever I watch something like Mad Men, I can almost hear the cogs in the writers brainstorm room clicking and whirring away, sending us the perceptible message - "yes...this is genius....my sociological wit....watch me write...look...Im WRITING...I can say so much in just a few lines of dialogue".
Ever watched an old episode of The Rockford Files or Ironside, and marvelled at how they can cover all this social commentary and STILL fit an engaging storyline in there? If not, perhaps its time you did.
*shakes fist at forum*
I agree with a lot of what is being said. For such a slow-burning program, 45 minutes flies by.
Does anyone know what the ratings were like for this in America? I fear if they weren't good, it could be cancelled. We all know that US networks have no patience and often don't give programs a chance to build an audience base.
There were no A-listers in Mad Men and John Hamm was plucked from obscurity.
Have to agree with you on Dirty Sexy Money, though. It's appalling.
Well that is your opinion, but I think Mad Men is almost as good as Six Foot Under of which the last series was class !
I have to agree with Pushing Daisies though, could only watch 20 mins of it before I gave up. Too twee, too sweet and quirky for my tastes !!
I have to say that I agree with you in relation to Dirty Sexy Money/Pushing Daisys/ and the last few Desperate Housewives - In these shows the "look" seems/ feels like a superfluous add on... not in anyway integral to the drama....I really don't think that criticism is true of Mad Men.
If I had to compare Mad Men to any recent US imports I'd be more likey to say something like Dexter.....which might seem odd at first....but for me both shows are very specfic examinations of place and character. The visual look and environment are integral.
(Eg. Mad Men there's the scene were Don is having flashbacks after getting high with his beatnik girlfriend and friends....the police are outside and they can't leave but Don can because he wears the costume of succesful middle america...which is a facade he has created which has freed him form his past in a sense.....oops I could blether on for hours ...so I'll just shut up now:D:D)
Someone linked your thread and I had a read, but compared to this thread it seemed very negative - lots of people giving up on Mad Men because it was too slow etc so I stuck to this one - more kindred spirits here!
I loved that. It said so much so simply. You certainly could go on picking out examples like that!
The jaw dropping moment when you realise Pete Campbell intended for his wife to shag her ex so he could get in The New Yorker.:eek:
When Sterling hits on Betty, Draper blames her but when he realises it was Stirling gets him wrecked and sweaty so he vomits in front of the Nixon team, Stirling never suspects, but Draper never apologises to poor Betty. Both:D and :mad:
And of course it's perfectly alright for Don to have who he wants when he wants. :mad: Indeed.
LOL, yes, I think I posted about it too soon. People hadn't got into the programme at that stage.
And Christina Hendricks is hot
Agree. Rachel isn't the sort of woman to give herself lightly, unlike a certain secretary. Don had nothing but got the American dream for himself, the job, wife, house, children, complete lifestyle. I think he loves Betty but she doesn't engage his heart or soul. If he continues to see Rachel I think it will become a serious relationship for him, possibly for the first time in his life. There's no doubt that Rachel is in love with him.
I wonder if we will see the layers peeled away from Joan's character ..my thoughts about her changed when we saw her crying when she was called in to the office after Roger had his heart attack..perhaps she feels she only good enough for the men in the office to have affairs with her... rather than settle down with her.
Oh and I agree about Rachel and Don.....something special there