Alex Parks Dumped By Polydor & She Can't Understand Why.

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  • SystemSystem Posts: 2,096,970
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    He still writes with Robin and has been very busy writing a new album its the new material that I meant very much hope it gets a chance to be heard by more than his diehard fans :p
    Judely wrote:
    Alistair certainly hasn't disappeared!

    He hasn't been doing so many live gigs recently because he's been busy in York and Liverpool working on the new songs for his next album. He's been writing and recording with several different people, including Chris and Tony Griffiths (ex Real People) and singer/songwriter Richard Chance. He's also been putting a new band together, so we're hoping for a few more gigs soon!

    If the previews we heard at The Bedford and at the 'Spectacular' Christmas gig in York were anything to go by then you should be hearing a lot more of him in the near future. :)
    Cool! Good luck to Alistair. Please keep us posted. :)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 215
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    Ruby_ wrote:
    Thank you for doing so. It's a shame you couldn't have improvised an answer in the first place, instead of throwing insults.

    With respect Ruby, its hardly fair to say i threw insults at you. Pompous and daft were two words i used - mere adjectives to describe what i felt about what you were SAYING not who you ARE. No need to be so precious.

    I also notice my eventual answering of your question hasn't advanced the debate any. Then, what WAS the point in asking?

    Perhaps I should have mentioned that I love KT Tunstall, and respect Aphex Twin. Obviously I was wrong to assume you'd recognise them both as widely respected artists!

    I am absolutely perplexed by this. What are you on about?
  • jamesdeanukjamesdeanuk Posts: 3,868
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    Can't say I'm shocked. She hasn't got a very commercial voice. It's like a fog horn.
  • SystemSystem Posts: 2,096,970
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    Trem Two wrote:
    With respect Ruby, its hardly fair to say i threw insults at you. Pompous and daft were two words i used - mere adjectives to describe what i felt about what you were SAYING not who you ARE. No need to be so precious.

    I also notice my eventual answering of your question hasn't advanced the debate any. Then, what WAS the point in asking?
    Sorry about being precious. I lost my rag when I was called a tosser by someone else.

    I wasn't trying to have a debate because there isn't any debate. It's art, and we've all got our own opinions and perceptions of it. It's worth engaging in these discussions out of curiosity and the pleasure of conversation, not because anybody 'wins'! And of course there's also the benefit of exchanging recommendations with people with similar tastes.

    I am interested in Alex's career and therefore, out of curiosity, I am interested to find out what kind of people like or dislike her music, or rate it as mediocre, as the case may be... i.e. their personal taste in music and their level of interest in music. I find that recent albums bought provides a far clearer and vivid sense of that than simply "I like jazz" - although if anyone asked me the question I'd probably tag a long list of genres on the end for good value as well. I find it somewhat amazing that you don't understand why I asked! It's a simple and highly relevant conversational question AFAIC.
    Trem Two wrote:
    I am absolutely perplexed by this. What are you on about?
    You accused me of asking you the question in order to 'advance my argument'. By implication you thought I was trying to dismiss your argument. I wasn't, I was just trying to evaluate yours (nb that's the 4th time I've explained that I was trying to evaluate your argument!). The evaluation I wanted to make is purely of informational value to me.

    I mentioned the fact that some people who share my admiration for KT Tunstall (for example) view Alex very differently to me, in an attempt to make it clear that I was not trying to understand your taste in order to dismiss you.

    If you still don't get it, then never mind, just please forget it! and write me off as some oddball you met on the internet.

    Incidentally I'd just like to make one thing clear: whatever people on DS say about Alex's music and her prospects does not impact my personal opinion in any way. After 40-odd years of following popular music, and never having changed my mind about any artist I liked since childhood, I have solid confidence in my own assessment of what's good. I also have personal contact with people knowledgeable about the industry. You can wear yourself out telling me that Alex is mediocre and insignificant, but to me that's just your opinion. As far as I'm concerned, the only question mark now is over what Alex wants for herself.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 215
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    Ruby_ wrote:
    Sorry about being precious. I lost my rag when I was called a tosser by someone else.

    No need to be sorry. You can say and feel exactly what you want.
    I wasn't trying to have a debate because there isn't any debate. It's art, and we've all got our own opinions and perceptions of it. It's worth engaging in these discussions out of curiosity and the pleasure of conversation, not because anybody 'wins'! And of course there's also the benefit of exchanging recommendations with people with similar tastes.

    I can't disagree with a word of that. Not that i am looking to, of course. ;) Whilst i fully accept what you are saying, and art appreciation is unquestionably a subjective instinct, i still find debate possible without the need to fall back on the 'well thats just my opinion' remark. That may be entirely true but forgive me if i'd rather not spend my time online giving forth personal opinions only for them to go unchallenged. I like 'debate' on music - even if resolution is neither achievable nor desired. All just a bit of perverse fun i suppose - even if we don't admit it.

    I find that recent albums bought provides a far clearer and vivid sense of that than simply "I like jazz" - although if anyone asked me the question I'd probably tag a long list of genres on the end for good value as well. I find it somewhat amazing that you don't understand why I asked! It's a simple and highly relevant conversational question AFAIC.

    I understand, now knowing your perspective, why you asked. I still don't merit it with the relevance you do but thats why we are in this mess.

    You accused me of asking you the question in order to 'advance my argument'. By implication you thought I was trying to dismiss your argument. I wasn't, I was just trying to evaluate yours (nb that's the 4th time I've explained that I was trying to evaluate your argument!). The evaluation I wanted to make is purely of informational value to me.

    Fine. Perhaps. I understood that you wanted to 'evaluate' my argument the first time you said it and that is what i found to be pompous - that you should feel that by knowing what i listen to you could assess the value of my opinion. If it was 'purely of informational value' to you then i'm sorry for being so stubborn but surely you can see that it was a fair assumption to make in the course of a divergence of opinion that such knowledge would serve as more than just a curiosity.
    If you still don't get it, then never mind, just please forget it! and write me off as some oddball you met on the internet.

    Not at all. You seem pretty sensible to me despite your resolute defence of any criticism of Alex. Incidentally, you have to remember i have been a sideline supporter of Alex since Fame Academy. I really wanted to see her do well and have her potential realised. I think she is very talented. But as they say in the industry - you are only as good as your last record - and on that front its nothing but disappointment i feel.
    Incidentally I'd just like to make one thing clear: whatever people on DS say about Alex's music and her prospects does not impact my personal opinion in any way. After 40-odd years of following popular music, and never having changed my mind about any artist I liked since childhood, I have solid confidence in my own assessment of what's good. I also have personal contact with people knowledgeable about the industry. You can wear yourself out telling me that Alex is mediocre and insignificant, but to me that's just your opinion. As far as I'm concerned, the only question mark now is over what Alex wants for herself.

    Quite right. As i see it Alex is Alex. The potential to be great is there, as is equally the potential to be mediocre. As it stands i feel she has slipped to the latter. Whatever the reasons for that - its far from a complete write-off. I wish her well.
  • thenetworkbabethenetworkbabe Posts: 45,600
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    Lots of oddities here. Alex leaving Polydor tells us nothing about Alistairs qualities as a Richard Park impersonator or less importantly a nasal singer. Carolynne who was a deserving third or second has had even more trouble being noticed despite being a more mainstream singer and an accomplished song writer. James singing on stage tells us nothing either - it wasn't a competition for musical theatre or Lorna would probably have won it. Singing someone elses words and music without invention or adding emotion in tune with an orchestra actually fits Park's description of his singing - it just means his acting seen from a distance is improved and as we knew from the outside shows on FA 2 he can sing to an auditorium.

    Actually the Alex story just leaves unanswered he big question of how big a star she could or can be. All it tells us is that she didn't or wouldn't sing the big hit Polydor wanted for her and everyone on FA knew she could sing. All we know is she hasn't sung it and so we don't know if she can and Polydor are not going to try and make her any more.

    The real flaw in the equation is that FA2 produced the best singer by several miles but the format gave no one any certainty who would actually write/produce hit music. The best they could do was judge from ability to sing other people's big hits and there was only one winner at doing that.

    People at the time pointed this out. It seems a flaw that can't be closed. You can't produce songs on the show or police that they are created on the show or even by the artist or produce a quality show with guaranteed variety You can't even predict what way a singer will develop from a few songs on the show. In Alex's case it was perfectly obvious that going the MTWIT route would produce far more sales with a bit less orchestra than Not Your Average kinda Girl. Predicting a big selling future on the basis of MTWIT was as logical as predicting problems if she kept to the style and themes of NYAKG. As Alistairs simple offerings beat NYAKG on the show and Alistair's album sank sans trace, its not even clear that what they did do in the way of song writing on FA2 was worthwhile.

    Basically nothing said on finals night has been disproved - it just a potentiality that hasn't happened - largely it seems because the artist put credibility and control over mass appeal or big impact .
  • SystemSystem Posts: 2,096,970
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    The real flaw in the equation is that FA2 produced the best singer by several miles but the format gave no one any certainty who would actually write/produce hit music. The best they could do was judge from ability to sing other people's big hits and there was only one winner at doing that.

    Basically nothing said on finals night has been disproved - it just a potentiality that hasn't happened - largely it seems because the artist put credibility and control over mass appeal or big impact .

    Honestly.......I do not think I'm thick.
    I really don't have a clue what all of the above is about though. :confused::confused:
  • SystemSystem Posts: 2,096,970
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    Saw Alex Parks at the Shepherd's Bush Empire the other night (gf likes her). She was OK, but didn't play too many songs (guess she doesn't have much of a back catalogue) and you had to wait around for about 2 1/2 hours to see her.
  • thenetworkbabethenetworkbabe Posts: 45,600
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    fannianni wrote:
    Honestly.......I do not think I'm thick.
    I really don't have a clue what all of the above is about though. :confused::confused:

    The claim was that she was overhyped on the final night. The point is that there is a difference between someone like Richard Parks predicting what someone can do and them doing it. You can only predict on what you see at the time - its an assessment of ability. You can't predict how they will use that skill.

    Gordon Brown looks like he may be a great PM but he could be awful. You can't tell because he hasn't been PM.

    Alex ticked all the boxes to make big hits but hasn't sung a big hit so she hasn't had one. That doesn't mean it was wrong to predict she could sing big hits. The story seems to be that Polydor gave her one and she wouldn't sing it.

    The song writing point is more obvious. If Alex had written and sung songs like Imagine or Baby its Cold or Mad World she might be a mega star because the show showed she could sing them. If she had whispered all her songs in Cornish she wouldn't.
  • thmsthms Posts: 61,005
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    The claim was that she was overhyped on the final night. The point is that there is a difference between someone like Richard Parks predicting what someone can do and them doing it. You can only predict on what you see at the time - its an assessment of ability. You can't predict how they will use that skill.

    Gordon Brown looks like he may be a great PM but he could be awful. You can't tell because he hasn't been PM.

    Alex ticked all the boxes to make big hits but hasn't sung a big hit so she hasn't had one. That doesn't mean it was wrong to predict she could sing big hits. The story seems to be that Polydor gave her one and she wouldn't sing it.

    The song writing point is more obvious. If Alex had written and sung songs like Imagine or Baby its Cold or Mad World she might be a mega star because the show showed she could sing them. If she had whispered all her songs in Cornish she wouldn't.

    alex could have a monster hit with a cover of alistair griffin's
    you and me (tonight). although i slated alistair during
    his time in fa2 (sorry alistair) his single is one of my all-time
    favourite songs..i'm not kidding :D
  • catspawcatspaw Posts: 1,273
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    thms wrote:
    alex could have a monster hit with a cover of alistair griffin's
    you and me (tonight). although i slated alistair during
    his time in fa2 (sorry alistair) his single is one of my all-time
    favourite songs..i'm not kidding :D

    That's interesting... :D I AM an Alistair fan despite being a hater (generally speaking) of romantic ballads (and he was forced to do a fair number of those in FA). But I also love You and Me (Tonight). I wouldn't say it's one of my all-time favourites, but there's a certain something about it that gives me goose bumps. I'm sure Alex would have made a very good fist of it, and it IS a song that merited a success that it didn't achieve - even with Alistair singing it! :p . Alex, with her higher profile (back then, anyway) might well have had a huge hit with it........if she'd seen fit to sing it, of course. :)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 309
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    catspaw wrote:
    That's interesting... :D I AM an Alistair fan despite being a hater (generally speaking) of romantic ballads (and he was forced to do a fair number of those in FA). But I also love You and Me (Tonight). I wouldn't say it's one of my all-time favourites, but there's a certain something about it that gives me goose bumps. I'm sure Alex would have made a very good fist of it, and it IS a song that merited a success that it didn't achieve - even with Alistair singing it! :p . Alex, with her higher profile (back then, anyway) might well have had a huge hit with it........if she'd seen fit to sing it, of course. :)

    I remember hearing Alistair and Alex sing some beautiful impromptu duets on the FA live streaming - much better than the ones they did on the actual show. Unfortunately most of the public never got to hear them as they weren't shown on the highlights programmes - perhaps they should team up again? :p

    (For a really 'goose bumping' live acoustic version of 'You and Me' try HERE - just ignore the giggles at the beginning!)
  • catspawcatspaw Posts: 1,273
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    Judely wrote:

    (For a really 'goose bumping' live acoustic version of 'You and Me' try HERE - just ignore the giggles at the beginning!)

    Thanks, Judely; I was there! I remember it well........ :o thms might enjoy it, I think! :D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,204
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    Memories I was there too :p forgot about the giggles made me laugh all over again love him :)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,923
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    Trem Two wrote:
    Shame. She WAS the correct winner of FA2

    Was she?

    Was she actually the winner anyway? The jury's still out on that one ;)

    Trem Two wrote:
    Not one of the other contestants would have done ANY better.

    Actually I think at least 3 of them could have done a lot better than Alex, whether as winner or not, if they had been given half the media attention and adulation and promotion that Alex was given.


    She has nothing and no one to blame. She wasn't given a raw deal by the record company (they produced the debut album viewers of the show would have expected and pulled out all the stops in getting her the best possible production and collaboration for her second album and they didn't rush her) or the media (they couldn't have been more supportive, I was wondering when they were going to start calling for her canonisation). She just didn't have it and that's all it comes down to. She was an unlikely and unjustifiable "winner" of this type of show. All hype and no subtance and, due to her slightly unconventional appearance and voice, reluctant attitude and "unique selling point", a novelty act of the highest order. Her career was doomed oast her first single. Quite honestly, I think Chico has more chance of a career. At least no one has ever tried to hide what he is under the veil of being a "credible artist".
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,923
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    thms wrote:
    alex could have a monster hit with a cover of alistair griffin's
    you and me (tonight). although i slated alistair during
    his time in fa2 (sorry alistair) his single is one of my all-time
    favourite songs..i'm not kidding :D

    OMG! I can't imagine anything much worse than Little Miss Foghorn destroying that beautiful song.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 3,923
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    Ruby_ wrote:
    Incidentally I'd just like to make one thing clear: whatever people on DS say about Alex's music and her prospects does not impact my personal opinion in any way. After 40-odd years of following popular music, and never having changed my mind about any artist I liked since childhood, I have solid confidence in my own assessment of what's good. I also have personal contact with people knowledgeable about the industry. You can wear yourself out telling me that Alex is mediocre and insignificant, but to me that's just your opinion. As far as I'm concerned, the only question mark now is over what Alex wants for herself.


    I can't claim to have followed music for 40 years as I have only been alive for 21 but I do have musical tastes that are generally what you could call "mature" for my age.

    I do however have contact with people with years of experience in the music industry, whether as performers or behind the scenes, and unfortunately the vast majority of them share my opinion of Alex and of what went on in FA2.
  • TiffaniTiffani Posts: 5,444
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    Alistair and James were the true talents to come out of that show not Alex Parks. I am glad James has managed to acheive so much more than people expected of him and hope that Alistair eventually gets to release another album in the near future.
  • yellowlabbieyellowlabbie Posts: 59,081
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    Tiffani wrote:
    Alistair and James were the true talents to come out of that show not Alex Parks. I am glad James has managed to acheive so much more than people expected of him and hope that Alistair eventually gets to release another album in the near future.
    If Alistair and James were the true talents to come out of the show, where are they now, OK, James is singing in the theatre, not what he wanted to really do I'm sure, and, Alistair, well he's really famous isn't he. He hasn't proved he is better than Alex, has he?
  • Candy StoreCandy Store Posts: 5,125
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    If Alistair and James were the true talents to come out of the show, where are they now, OK, James is singing in the theatre, not what he wanted to really do I'm sure

    Firstly, a theatre/stage/musical singer needs by nature to be far better trained and far more consistently close to note perfect than a recording artist just by the nature of their work.

    Secondly, it's better than doing nothing, isn't it, which is very clearly what the immediate future holds for the dearest darling over-rated one.
    Alistair, well he's really famous isn't he. He hasn't proved he is better than Alex, has he?

    He didn't win though, did he, and he didn't have the support and hype throughout the series or after that Alex undeniably did. On the contrary, he was vilified and ridiculed throughout the series and beyond to the point where anyone who dared to mention his name in the media in a complimentary way was made to feel embarrassed for doing so.

    If James and Alistair can be sixth placed and runner-up, as well as being ritually humiliated week after week for three months and then have the same attitude continue beyond, but one of them can come off with a chart single and a stage career, the other with a couple of chart singles and album, and both earn the praise of some of the biggest names in the industry in the process, while the winner is given all the promotion the allocated budget can buy and yet can't get beyond a flop second album, what does that tell you about where the real talent lies?

    Alistair, James and Carolynne (for their voices, songwriting and - like it or not, they're important in the pop industry - looks) would have been far more appropriate winners of FA and I'm sure far more successful than Alex, had any of them had the same level of promotion and hype.

    FA, Endemol, Polydor and to an extent the BBC shot themselves in the foot with the farce that they turned FA2 into. The very limited return on their substantial investment in Alex (both to ensure her victory and after she won) means they got everything they deserved and I for one am ecstatic.

    I think Alex will have a career. However she needn't have cast her net as far as London to find it. The obvious career for her is crying out closer to home. There are many lighthouses off the cost of Cornwall that could do with a new fog horn.
  • yellowlabbieyellowlabbie Posts: 59,081
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    Firstly, a theatre/stage/musical singer needs by nature to be far better trained and far more consistently close to note perfect than a recording artist just by the nature of their work.

    Secondly, it's better than doing nothing, isn't it, which is very clearly what the immediate future holds for the dearest darling over-rated one.



    He didn't win though, did he, and he didn't have the support and hype throughout the series or after that Alex undeniably did. On the contrary, he was vilified and ridiculed throughout the series and beyond to the point where anyone who dared to mention his name in the media in a complimentary way was made to feel embarrassed for doing so.

    If James and Alistair can be sixth placed and runner-up, as well as being ritually humiliated week after week for three months and then have the same attitude continue beyond, but one of them can come off with a chart single and a stage career, the other with a couple of chart singles and album, and both earn the praise of some of the biggest names in the industry in the process, while the winner is given all the promotion the allocated budget can buy and yet can't get beyond a flop second album, what does that tell you about where the real talent lies?

    Alistair, James and Carolynne (for their voices, songwriting and - like it or not, they're important in the pop industry - looks) would have been far more appropriate winners of FA and I'm sure far more successful than Alex, had any of them had the same level of promotion and hype.

    FA, Endemol, Polydor and to an extent the BBC shot themselves in the foot with the farce that they turned FA2 into. The very limited return on their substantial investment in Alex (both to ensure her victory and after she won) means they got everything they deserved and I for one am ecstatic.

    I think Alex will have a career. However she needn't have cast her net as far as London to find it. The obvious career for her is crying out closer to home. There are many lighthouses off the cost of Cornwall that could do with a new fog horn.
    You still haven't got over it have you, still bitter and twisted. Alistair did have help from Robin Gibb, and I'm sorry, if anyone in the music business thought he had talent, they would have snapped him up by now, you only have to look at Lemar. Alex was the favourite with the GBP from the beginning, and Alistair nearly snatched it at the end, not through his musical talent but by his Big Brother tactics. But all this is old news and even Carolynne, who I personally think should have been 2nd, hasn't been snapped up.
  • Candy StoreCandy Store Posts: 5,125
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    I personally think Carolynne should have won.

    The fact remains that the winner has been proven to be all hype and no substance. If you can't accept that fact and accept that despite all the hype she still bombed, who's not just bitter and twisted but also deluded?
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,108
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    Alex was the favourite with the GBP from the beginning.

    I think the voting figures for all but one week in the middle of the competition would suggest the she was very much not.
  • yellowlabbieyellowlabbie Posts: 59,081
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    I personally think Carolynne should have won.

    The fact remains that the winner has been proven to be all hype and no substance. If you can't accept that fact and accept that despite all the hype she still bombed, who's not just bitter and twisted but also deluded?
    The fact remains that nobody has picked up Carolynne or Alistair means that they are in the same boat as Alex. I have no reason to be bitter and twisted because my favourite act won and I am certainly not deluded.
  • Candy StoreCandy Store Posts: 5,125
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    I have no reason to be bitter and twisted because my favourite act won and I am certainly not deluded.

    Ahem .................. "won" ................
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