Do you know nothing, for example, about the subjugation of women in the Muslim world?
Come on! It's no wonder Bill Maher loses his rag!
Not just Bill it seems. Why do you need to be so personally attacking with fellow FM's?
Once again I will ask you a simple question which others have asked too, without success. Please don't reply again with watch the video, there's nothing new or enlightening to see there for most people. I think most Muslims are aware of the views expressed.. Tell me what do you intend doing about this? Or what we all should do about this? I take it you don't have any need for oil? (Even your hero Bill acknowledges that fact of life)
There are massively more Muslims who do not commit atrocities than those who do. That I even have to make such an obvious statement to you is a bit embarrassing and insulting. What Muslims actually 'think' based on surveys is meaningless because you haven't got the same information about non-Muslims. If thought crimes are a thing now, then maybe we should be extending that to all humans.
ridiculous statement.
No one ever made the argument that, when slavery was around, that many supports of slavery were peaceful people.
The argument 'there are so many peaceful muslims' is not a valid argument, precisely because virtually every country in the middle-east with a majority muslim population experiences extreme human rights issue's, socially and government, all stated to be inspired by Islam, by them themselves.
When you have entire countries suffering oppression due to this in a variety of way's, perpetrated by Muslims, you no longer get to play 'its a minority' card.
If All of europe was oppressing blacks horribly, not a single person would try and say 'but theres alot of peaceful white people'.
They would do everything they can to combat the idealogy that justifies oppressing black people.
'peace' is a bankrupt argument, in any form or fashion, because the major reason why people are peaceful is not because they are good people, but because they are people of self-interest that simply want to get through the day without hassles.
There is just a valid argument that the vast majority of peaceful people would support horrible horrific practices if these practices were mandated and enforced by a group in power, because they don't want trouble with this group.
The very existance of the NSA, the vast number of people operating with it, and only one person was brave enough to be a whistleblower, completely disproves your 'people are peaceful' theory.
The need to be peaceful is not good or bad, and it can very easily lead to supporting horrific evil practices.
If you ever lived in a 3rd world country, as i have, you would know the attitude for peace is inherently self-destructive.
No, the issue isn't about liberal "lax" attitudes towards Muslims or about the numbers of extremist Muslims. The issue is to fight terrorism, to recognise it as an untenable position and to not try to splinter the group that is against terrorism by taking a route that tries to generalise something that cannot be, and should not be.
Wrong, terrorism is simply the end result, fighting terrorism doesn't prevent it.
Racist acts is the end result of racist attitudes, simply stopping these doesn't prevent future occurrences, only by educating people why racist attitudes are wrong, rationally, can it finally be stopped.
In this Age Of Reason, this shouldn't even need to be explained.
Not just Bill it seems. Why do you need to be so personally attacking with fellow FM's?
Once again I will ask you a simple question which others have asked too, without success. Please don't reply again with watch the video, there's nothing new or enlightening to see there for most people. I think most Muslims are aware of the views expressed.. Tell me what do you intend doing about this? Or what we all should do about this? I take it you don't have any need for oil? (Even your hero Bill acknowledges that fact of life)
Do you know nothing, for example, about the subjugation of women in the Muslim world?
Come on! It's no wonder Bill Maher loses his rag!
Well, I know manners and common courtesy if that helps. If you wanted to make a point about the subjugation of women, perhaps that would have been a better example than your "not blowing up the underground" example.
I think there are probably two issues here:
1. The sorts of human rights issues like the subjugation of women. (Which of course I don't condone, by the way.)
If it helps - I'm including those that live in England.
I take it you are hypocritically missing out the oil producing countries where the West has massive investment. Their subjugation of women etc.etc.etc.etc doesn't matter? I asked how you intend to do anything about your concerns?
I think you are rather naive, simplistic and idealistic about this entire subject.
I take it you are hypocritically missing out the oil producing countries where the West has massive investment. Their subjugation of women etc.etc.etc.etc doesn't matter? I asked how you intend to do anything about your concerns?
I think you are rather naive, simplistic and idealistic about this entire subject.
If they didn't have oil, the entire Middle-east would probably be one massive sheet of glass by now.
I take it you are hypocritically missing out the oil producing countries where the West has massive investment. Their subjugation of women etc.etc.etc.etc doesn't matter? I asked how you intend to do anything about your concerns?
I think you are rather naive, simplistic and idealistic about this entire subject.
I'm NOT missing out the oil rich countries AT ALL.
This goes for Muslims everywhere. Africa, Bradford, Luton - all over.
Well, I know manners and common courtesy if that helps. If you wanted to make a point about the subjugation of women, perhaps that would have been a better example than your "not blowing up the underground" example.
I think there are probably two issues here:
1. The sorts of human rights issues like the subjugation of women. (Which of course I don't condone, by the way.)
2. The actions of extremist groups like ISIS.
The simple point I was trying to get across (and have been for many years with Left-wingers) is that not blowing up the underground doesn't make you moderate - like say, the average person who buys the Daily Mail or (if it helps) Richard Littlejohn.
This shouldn't be difficult to understand. Surely?
I'm NOT missing out the oil rich countries AT ALL.
This goes for Muslims everywhere. Africa, Bradford, Luton - all over.
WHAT does??? I've lost count of how many times you've been asked that question in this thread..
Once again I will ask you a simple question which others have asked too, without success. Please don't reply again with watch the video, there's nothing new or enlightening to see there for most people. I think most Muslims are aware of the views expressed.. Tell me what do you intend doing about this?
The simple point I was trying to get across (and have been for many years with Left-wingers) is that not blowing up the underground doesn't make you moderate - like say, the average person who buys the Daily Mail or (if it helps) Richard Littlejohn.
This shouldn't be difficult to understand. Surely?
What is difficult to understand about?.................NOT thinking moderately about anything in life isn't a CRIME, which has all been said before. Repeating the same non-facts doesn't make them correct.
What is a crime is "blasphemy" (Islamic, death by hanging) - at least in Pakistan. But it's not what we would call moderate. Are you an apologist for this as well?
What is a crime is "blasphemy" (Islamic, death by hanging) - at least in Pakistan. But it's not what we would call moderate. Are you an apologist for this as well?
Why do you need to misrepresent and insult me with such nonsensical judgement? If you can't answer my (tiringly often repeated) question, why not either say so or just stop it.
Why do you need to misrepresent and insult me with such nonsensical judgement? If you can't answer my (tiringly often repeated) question, why not either say so or just stop it.
What do you think you still need answering? I've told you it's nothing to do with oil. Are you asking me to solve the Islam problem for the world?
That's not the intention of the thread, but put one up and I'll chip in. Obviously it isn't going away any century soon, but an enlightenment is needed in the meantime. And pronto.
What do you think you still need answering? I've told you it's nothing to do with oil. Are you asking me to solve the Islam problem for the world?
That's not the intention of the thread, but put one up and I'll chip in. Obviously it isn't going away any century soon, but an enlightenment is needed in the meantime. And pronto.
Ok, so you have no idea what to do about any problems of Islam or how to facilitate enlightenment, as I knew already. You like all fantasy "anti liberal" pontificators smugly play the blame game without even a smidgen of original thought and it's all hot air. Never mind Bill will carry on yelling rubbish and nothing else, in exactly the same superior empty headed vein, so that will keep you happy. I suspect he's been living under his rock for too long now.
By the way what was the "intention of the thread". That we all agree with his very loud nothingness?:D
Nothing to do with oil is just plain dumb and extremely naive, as far as the attitudes of the West go, my dear.:D
Ok, so you have no idea what to do about any problems of Islam or how to facilitate enlightenment, as I knew already. You like all fantasy "anti liberal" pontificators smugly play the blame game without even a smidgen of original thought and it's all hot air. Never mind Bill will carry on yelling rubbish and nothing else, in exactly the same superior empty headed vein, so that will keep you happy. I suspect he's been living under his rock for too long now.
By the way what was the "intention of the thread". That we all agree with his very loud nothingness?:D
Nothing to do with oil is just plain dumb and extremely naive, as far as the attitudes of the West go, my dear.:D
Put a thread up, "How Do You Solve The Problem of Islam" and I'll pile in there.
Not tolerating Hate Schools in England (and other countries) would be a start.
No one ever made the argument that, when slavery was around, that many supports of slavery were peaceful people.
The argument 'there are so many peaceful muslims' is not a valid argument, precisely because virtually every country in the middle-east with a majority muslim population experiences extreme human rights issue's, socially and government, all stated to be inspired by Islam, by them themselves.
When you have entire countries suffering oppression due to this in a variety of way's, perpetrated by Muslims, you no longer get to play 'its a minority' card.
If All of europe was oppressing blacks horribly, not a single person would try and say 'but theres alot of peaceful white people'.
They would do everything they can to combat the idealogy that justifies oppressing black people.
'peace' is a bankrupt argument, in any form or fashion, because the major reason why people are peaceful is not because they are good people, but because they are people of self-interest that simply want to get through the day without hassles.
There is just a valid argument that the vast majority of peaceful people would support horrible horrific practices if these practices were mandated and enforced by a group in power, because they don't want trouble with this group.
The very existance of the NSA, the vast number of people operating with it, and only one person was brave enough to be a whistleblower, completely disproves your 'people are peaceful' theory.
The need to be peaceful is not good or bad, and it can very easily lead to supporting horrific evil practices.
If you ever lived in a 3rd world country, as i have, you would know the attitude for peace is inherently self-destructive.
Wrong, terrorism is simply the end result, fighting terrorism doesn't prevent it.
Racist acts is the end result of racist attitudes, simply stopping these doesn't prevent future occurrences, only by educating people why racist attitudes are wrong, rationally, can it finally be stopped.
In this Age Of Reason, this shouldn't even need to be explained.
Indeed. The Muslim world needs it's own Age of Reason.
Comments
Pretty much what another poster said. Not blowing up the underground isn't a crime.
Lots of people think all sorts of terrible things without actually doing them all the time.
I'd be pretty sure if my wife did all the things she's ever thought about doing to her mother-in-law she'd be facing a pretty long stretch in prison.
Are you (and others alright)? We all know it is not a crime if you don't blow up the underground.
THE POINT IS: Not blowing up the underground DOES NOT make you a liberal moderate.
This really should not be difficult to understand.
That seems something of a straw man though.
Not being a liberal moderate isn't a crime either.
I'm sure plenty of non Muslims in the UK would like to see the reintroduction of the death penalty for example.
That they don't go around hanging people vigilante style doesn't make them liberal moderates either.
Do you know nothing, for example, about the subjugation of women in the Muslim world?
Come on! It's no wonder Bill Maher loses his rag!
Not just Bill it seems. Why do you need to be so personally attacking with fellow FM's?
Once again I will ask you a simple question which others have asked too, without success. Please don't reply again with watch the video, there's nothing new or enlightening to see there for most people. I think most Muslims are aware of the views expressed.. Tell me what do you intend doing about this? Or what we all should do about this? I take it you don't have any need for oil? (Even your hero Bill acknowledges that fact of life)
http://www.quickmeme.com/img/e3/e369f6685472481a4c71f30976634478bcc7c8c5275267fb2af68184ff445576.jpg
And subjugate women, finance terrorists and behead people.
Do you intend, hypocritically, to only express your outrage at the countries where we don't have massive investment and need their oil? And how?
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_6ai5mauc2j4/SUAZpcntdWI/AAAAAAAAA2s/ZrjmykDuX9Y/s400/fuel%20hike%20-%20dunce%20-%20OPEC%20-%20USA%20-%20Oil%20Companies%20-%203rd%20World%20India%20-%20Common%20Man.jpg
No one ever made the argument that, when slavery was around, that many supports of slavery were peaceful people.
The argument 'there are so many peaceful muslims' is not a valid argument, precisely because virtually every country in the middle-east with a majority muslim population experiences extreme human rights issue's, socially and government, all stated to be inspired by Islam, by them themselves.
When you have entire countries suffering oppression due to this in a variety of way's, perpetrated by Muslims, you no longer get to play 'its a minority' card.
If All of europe was oppressing blacks horribly, not a single person would try and say 'but theres alot of peaceful white people'.
They would do everything they can to combat the idealogy that justifies oppressing black people.
'peace' is a bankrupt argument, in any form or fashion, because the major reason why people are peaceful is not because they are good people, but because they are people of self-interest that simply want to get through the day without hassles.
There is just a valid argument that the vast majority of peaceful people would support horrible horrific practices if these practices were mandated and enforced by a group in power, because they don't want trouble with this group.
The very existance of the NSA, the vast number of people operating with it, and only one person was brave enough to be a whistleblower, completely disproves your 'people are peaceful' theory.
The need to be peaceful is not good or bad, and it can very easily lead to supporting horrific evil practices.
If you ever lived in a 3rd world country, as i have, you would know the attitude for peace is inherently self-destructive. Wrong, terrorism is simply the end result, fighting terrorism doesn't prevent it.
Racist acts is the end result of racist attitudes, simply stopping these doesn't prevent future occurrences, only by educating people why racist attitudes are wrong, rationally, can it finally be stopped.
In this Age Of Reason, this shouldn't even need to be explained.
If it helps - I'm including those that live in England.
Well, I know manners and common courtesy if that helps. If you wanted to make a point about the subjugation of women, perhaps that would have been a better example than your "not blowing up the underground" example.
I think there are probably two issues here:
1. The sorts of human rights issues like the subjugation of women. (Which of course I don't condone, by the way.)
2. The actions of extremist groups like ISIS.
I take it you are hypocritically missing out the oil producing countries where the West has massive investment. Their subjugation of women etc.etc.etc.etc doesn't matter? I asked how you intend to do anything about your concerns?
I think you are rather naive, simplistic and idealistic about this entire subject.
If they didn't have oil, the entire Middle-east would probably be one massive sheet of glass by now.
I'm NOT missing out the oil rich countries AT ALL.
This goes for Muslims everywhere. Africa, Bradford, Luton - all over.
The simple point I was trying to get across (and have been for many years with Left-wingers) is that not blowing up the underground doesn't make you moderate - like say, the average person who buys the Daily Mail or (if it helps) Richard Littlejohn.
This shouldn't be difficult to understand. Surely?
WHAT does??? I've lost count of how many times you've been asked that question in this thread..
What is difficult to understand about?.................NOT thinking moderately about anything in life isn't a CRIME, which has all been said before. Repeating the same non-facts doesn't make them correct.
What is a crime is "blasphemy" (Islamic, death by hanging) - at least in Pakistan. But it's not what we would call moderate. Are you an apologist for this as well?
Why do you need to misrepresent and insult me with such nonsensical judgement? If you can't answer my (tiringly often repeated) question, why not either say so or just stop it.
What do you think you still need answering? I've told you it's nothing to do with oil. Are you asking me to solve the Islam problem for the world?
That's not the intention of the thread, but put one up and I'll chip in. Obviously it isn't going away any century soon, but an enlightenment is needed in the meantime. And pronto.
Ok, so you have no idea what to do about any problems of Islam or how to facilitate enlightenment, as I knew already. You like all fantasy "anti liberal" pontificators smugly play the blame game without even a smidgen of original thought and it's all hot air. Never mind Bill will carry on yelling rubbish and nothing else, in exactly the same superior empty headed vein, so that will keep you happy. I suspect he's been living under his rock for too long now.
By the way what was the "intention of the thread". That we all agree with his very loud nothingness?:D
Nothing to do with oil is just plain dumb and extremely naive, as far as the attitudes of the West go, my dear.:D
Put a thread up, "How Do You Solve The Problem of Islam" and I'll pile in there.
Not tolerating Hate Schools in England (and other countries) would be a start.
Indeed. The Muslim world needs it's own Age of Reason.