Pertwee is by far and away my favourite Doctor and his era has never been bettered in my opinion. I liked it because the humour was subtle and sly, unlike, for example, the school of trip over scarf/do a pratfall/offer a jelly baby.
Whereas, for me, Season 7 of the classic series is, pound-for-pound, the most adult and successful of the entire run. I still don't think it's been bettered.
Fair Play to you on both points but for me Season 7 is one of my least favourite Seasons ever. Aside from Pertwee's pomposity it was full of overlong stories that dragged on for weeks, it also for me went against everything Doctor Who was about. Plus the Earth Exile Scenario sucked big time.
And Pertwee is one of my least favourite Doctors though I like Jon Pertwee. He was excellent in W.Gummidge, brilliant in the Carry On Films and in The Avengers he was well funny. As Doctor Who, not for me but that's what opinion is all about.
Fair Play to you on both points but for me Season 7 is one of my least favourite Seasons ever. Aside from Pertwee's pomposity it was full of overlong stories that dragged on for weeks, it also for me went against everything Doctor Who was about. Plus the Earth Exile Scenario sucked big time.
And Pertwee is one of my least favourite Doctors though I like Jon Pertwee. He was excellent in W.Gummidge, brilliant in the Carry On Films and in The Avengers he was well funny. As Doctor Who, not for me but that's what opinion is all about.
Well my earliest DW memories are of Pertwee. That was when I fell in love with the show and he was my Doctor. I remember clearly season 8 when I was 4 and I never missed an episode. When they announced his departure I cried. Properly cried. I really could not see anybody else as The Doctor.
I sometimes feel guilty about the fact that I went on to love Tom Baker even more (by about episode 2 of Robot!), but he was just so brilliant!
I guess I wouldn't want anything to change about the Pertwee era because that's my fondly remembered childhood.
That almost exactly replicates my experience with the very minor differences that I was 5 when Pertwee left and I think I managed to boycott the first two episodes of Robot before giving in to the delights of Tom Baker's Doctor.
The pomposity WAS the humour with Jon Pertwee. He took himself so seriously and when that self-importance was pricked it was amusing. It would also lead to him being hilariously rude to people. The Doctor's interplays with the Brigadeer, Liz Shaw , the Master and so on were wonderful. It wasn't madcap like Tom Baker's time but there was nothing stodgy and humourless about the 3rd Doctor's era. I frequently find myself laughing out loud when watching it.
And let us not forget gems like 'Tom Tit?! Yes, Tom Tit.' all delivered with a wonderfully straight face. It's that famous 'dry' British sense of humour
The pomposity WAS the humour with Jon Pertwee. He took himself so seriously and when that self-importance was pricked it was amusing. It would also lead to him being hilariously rude to people. The Doctor's interplays with the Brigadeer, Liz Shaw , the Master and so on were wonderful. It wasn't madcap like Tom Baker's time but there was nothing stodgy and humourless about the 3rd Doctor's era. I frequently find myself laughing out loud when watching it.
And let us not forget gems like 'Tom Tit?! Yes, Tom Tit.' all delivered with a wonderfully straight face. It's that famous 'dry' British sense of humour
That was my impression too. If he'd gone round larking around he'd have been accused of being too like both the Second Doctor and too reminiscent of his own previous career in comedy. He had to be different but also had his own way of bringing the humour in subtly by being almost comically pompous in a straight-faced way. I loved his era.
That was my impression too. If he'd gone round larking around he'd have been accused of being too like both the Second Doctor and too reminiscent of his own previous career in comedy. He had to be different but also had his own way of bringing the humour in subtly by being almost comically pompous in a straight-faced way. I loved his era.
Good point about his previous career in comedy. Have you ever heard all his silly voices in The Navy Lark? That's what Pertwee was like going out of his way being funny for its own sake. And it wouldn't have worked in DW.
I agree Pertwee had to be different to Troughton but Tennant and Smith have proved in the New Series that you can have back to back humourous Doctors. Both of those Doctors are very different in terms of the funny side that they showed. Tennant was jolly but Smith is a bit more eccentric and manic.
Maybe that means Capaldi's Doctor will be more serious to provide a contrast with Tennant and Smith
Maybe that means Capaldi's Doctor will be more serious to provide a contrast with Tennant and Smith
Oddly enough my initial thoughts on his casting, based on the roles he'd played before, is that maybe his Doctor will be more akin to Pertwee's intepretation, though I'm hoping I'm wrong!
However he plays it, I do agree that like Pertwee he will perhaps be a more serious Doctor. Hope not, though, as I think the humour should never be left out completely.
No, IMO Pertwee was perfect as he was. The very reason he played it straight was that as people knew him mainly as a comedian, he didn't want to play a "comic" Doctor. He explains all this in his second autobiography " I am the Doctor"
Oddly enough my initial thoughts on his casting, based on the roles he'd played before, is that maybe his Doctor will be more akin to Pertwee's intepretation, though I'm hoping I'm wrong!
However he plays it, I do agree that like Pertwee he will perhaps be a more serious Doctor. Hope not, though, as I think the humour should never be left out completely.
Daveyboy you seem to be under the impression that The Doctor is a comedy role.
Of the classic Doctors only Troughton played up the more comedic side of his nature throughout his run. Tom Baker and Sylvester McCoy both more successful when they played it more serious and Hartnell, Davison and Colin Baker played it about as straight as Pertwee.
Perhaps Pertwee was just a bit too subtle for you.
A straight answer to your question fro me would be, no I do not think he would have worked better if he added more humour. I'm very glad he didn't as I think he would have been less successful and if the series had have got to Tom it would have affected him.
Good point about his previous career in comedy. Have you ever heard all his silly voices in The Navy Lark? That's what Pertwee was like going out of his way being funny for its own sake. And it wouldn't have worked in DW.
I used to listen to the Navy Lark, and some of it was on Radio 4 Extra a few months ago, definitely worth a listen. I remember when he played all the parts in a 3 way conversation and it was just crazy, no- one else could get a word in, and they did try:)
A Doctor Who review from the Morning Star, 31st January 1970:
'No longer labelled ' For Children' - though I'll bet plenty still watch it- and with previously "compulsory" adolescent characters in the cast eliminated, the series has been given a shot in the arm with the advent of Jon Pertwee. We wondered if a trend had set in, if Doctor Who would get progressively zanier with Pertwee an established comedian in the role. The danger here could have been that if the Doctor had been allowed to get too far-out, his observations on life, science and the universe would become less and less credible. So, with just a hint now and again of a near-slip into The Navy Lark, in the new Doctor Who we've got some charm, a suggestion of presence and a restraining pedal on the still present humour.'
Daveyboy you seem to be under the impression that The Doctor is a comedy role.
Of the classic Doctors only Troughton played up the more comedic side of his nature throughout his run. Tom Baker and Sylvester McCoy both more successful when they played it more serious and Hartnell, Davison and Colin Baker played it about as straight as Pertwee.
Perhaps Pertwee was just a bit too subtle for you.
A straight answer to your question fro me would be, no I do not think he would have worked better if he added more humour. I'm very glad he didn't as I think he would have been less successful and if the series had have got to Tom it would have affected him.
Not at all. If I thought that, Davison wouldn't be my favourite Doctor now, would he?
I think I was just commenting on what you seemed to be implying that all other Doctors in Classic Who aside Tom Baker had no sense of humour where I pointed out that they actually did.
And I totally disagree that Colin Baker played it dead straight. Looking at Season 23, I think at times he was more humourous than Tom Baker but in a different way. He had to be a contrast to Davison's more reserved interpretation and that's just want he was.
I don't think Pertwee was too subtle, more too boring at times. I don't actually dislike his Doctor and as I said at the beginning there were moments of humour but not enough and he spent far too much time moralising which, as has been pointed out, could be a production team fault.
This is where I disagree with you just a bit as I think a lot of the humour from other Doctors came from their eccentricity.
Hartnell's humour came from his absent mindedness and all those high pitched chuckles and sense of mischief.
I think you might be seeing the classic series through modern eyes and applying what you know about the Doctor from New Who to the classic series.
There's a world of difference between eccentricity and humour. All the classic Doctors displayed eccentricity but few of them played the role for laughs. Only Tom Baker and McCoy had flashes of comedy in their performances. I personally feel that New Who was heavily influenced by the Tom Baker/Douglas Adams period of the show and that's why New Doctors have a strong streak of comedy in their performances. But it's easy to forget that the Baker/Adams period lasted no more than 2 years and isn't representive of most of the classic show.
As for Pertwee, he took the show from averaging 6-7 million viewers to 10-12 million viewers. His era is very much of it's time now and has probably aged the most of all the era's of the show (it screams 1970s). However the steep rise in viewing figures suggests they got things spot on.
I think you might be seeing the classic series through modern eyes and applying what you know about the Doctor from New Who to the classic series.
There's a world of difference between eccentricity and humour. All the classic Doctors displayed eccentricity but few of them played the role for laughs. Only Tom Baker and McCoy had flashes of comedy in their performances. I personally feel that New Who was heavily influenced by the Tom Baker/Douglas Adams period of the show and that's why New Doctors have a strong streak of comedy in their performances. But it's easy to forget that the Baker/Adams period lasted no more than 2 years and isn't representive of most of the classic show.
As for Pertwee, he took the show from averaging 6-7 million viewers to 10-12 million viewers. His era is very much of it's time now and has probably aged the most of all the era's of the show (it screams 1970s). However the steep rise in viewing figures suggests they got things spot on.
I agree the Classic Doctors were predominantly serious but if you think they never played the role for laughs I would suggest you watch The Romans, The Reign Of Terror and look at the scenes from stories like The Caves Of Androzani and as I seem to keep saying Season 23, when violence was replaced by humour. Even Pertwee himself had his moments like in The Green Death(something I'd like to have seen more off)
And that's the point I'm trying to make that everyone seems to keep missing. I'm not saying the Classic Doctors played it for laughs(except in stories like I mentioned above) merely that it was stated that The Doctor was mainly serious. Well yes he was but he was not without humour(Pertwee mainly aside) and quite simply, that is the point I'm trying to make.
All that Venusian eyebrow speaking lark? Course he did funny/silly bits. Pertwee was a great doctor. His political machinations and put downs were spot on. He was pompous and polite and well mannered. Serious, yes, but that was required. The plots were detailed, lengthy and twisting in his era. Definitely more like thrillers than anything else.
The clowning around can be off-putting when used liberally. Which it has been on too many occasions recently.
Comments
Fair Play to you on both points but for me Season 7 is one of my least favourite Seasons ever. Aside from Pertwee's pomposity it was full of overlong stories that dragged on for weeks, it also for me went against everything Doctor Who was about. Plus the Earth Exile Scenario sucked big time.
And Pertwee is one of my least favourite Doctors though I like Jon Pertwee. He was excellent in W.Gummidge, brilliant in the Carry On Films and in The Avengers he was well funny. As Doctor Who, not for me but that's what opinion is all about.
Quite. For me, the exile era was definitive Who!
That almost exactly replicates my experience with the very minor differences that I was 5 when Pertwee left and I think I managed to boycott the first two episodes of Robot before giving in to the delights of Tom Baker's Doctor.
And let us not forget gems like 'Tom Tit?! Yes, Tom Tit.' all delivered with a wonderfully straight face. It's that famous 'dry' British sense of humour
That was my impression too. If he'd gone round larking around he'd have been accused of being too like both the Second Doctor and too reminiscent of his own previous career in comedy. He had to be different but also had his own way of bringing the humour in subtly by being almost comically pompous in a straight-faced way. I loved his era.
Good point about his previous career in comedy. Have you ever heard all his silly voices in The Navy Lark? That's what Pertwee was like going out of his way being funny for its own sake. And it wouldn't have worked in DW.
Maybe that means Capaldi's Doctor will be more serious to provide a contrast with Tennant and Smith
Oddly enough my initial thoughts on his casting, based on the roles he'd played before, is that maybe his Doctor will be more akin to Pertwee's intepretation, though I'm hoping I'm wrong!
However he plays it, I do agree that like Pertwee he will perhaps be a more serious Doctor. Hope not, though, as I think the humour should never be left out completely.
Daveyboy you seem to be under the impression that The Doctor is a comedy role.
Of the classic Doctors only Troughton played up the more comedic side of his nature throughout his run. Tom Baker and Sylvester McCoy both more successful when they played it more serious and Hartnell, Davison and Colin Baker played it about as straight as Pertwee.
Perhaps Pertwee was just a bit too subtle for you.
A straight answer to your question fro me would be, no I do not think he would have worked better if he added more humour. I'm very glad he didn't as I think he would have been less successful and if the series had have got to Tom it would have affected him.
I used to listen to the Navy Lark, and some of it was on Radio 4 Extra a few months ago, definitely worth a listen. I remember when he played all the parts in a 3 way conversation and it was just crazy, no- one else could get a word in, and they did try:)
'No longer labelled ' For Children' - though I'll bet plenty still watch it- and with previously "compulsory" adolescent characters in the cast eliminated, the series has been given a shot in the arm with the advent of Jon Pertwee. We wondered if a trend had set in, if Doctor Who would get progressively zanier with Pertwee an established comedian in the role. The danger here could have been that if the Doctor had been allowed to get too far-out, his observations on life, science and the universe would become less and less credible. So, with just a hint now and again of a near-slip into The Navy Lark, in the new Doctor Who we've got some charm, a suggestion of presence and a restraining pedal on the still present humour.'
Not at all. If I thought that, Davison wouldn't be my favourite Doctor now, would he?
I think I was just commenting on what you seemed to be implying that all other Doctors in Classic Who aside Tom Baker had no sense of humour where I pointed out that they actually did.
And I totally disagree that Colin Baker played it dead straight. Looking at Season 23, I think at times he was more humourous than Tom Baker but in a different way. He had to be a contrast to Davison's more reserved interpretation and that's just want he was.
I don't think Pertwee was too subtle, more too boring at times. I don't actually dislike his Doctor and as I said at the beginning there were moments of humour but not enough and he spent far too much time moralising which, as has been pointed out, could be a production team fault.
I think you might be seeing the classic series through modern eyes and applying what you know about the Doctor from New Who to the classic series.
There's a world of difference between eccentricity and humour. All the classic Doctors displayed eccentricity but few of them played the role for laughs. Only Tom Baker and McCoy had flashes of comedy in their performances. I personally feel that New Who was heavily influenced by the Tom Baker/Douglas Adams period of the show and that's why New Doctors have a strong streak of comedy in their performances. But it's easy to forget that the Baker/Adams period lasted no more than 2 years and isn't representive of most of the classic show.
As for Pertwee, he took the show from averaging 6-7 million viewers to 10-12 million viewers. His era is very much of it's time now and has probably aged the most of all the era's of the show (it screams 1970s). However the steep rise in viewing figures suggests they got things spot on.
I agree the Classic Doctors were predominantly serious but if you think they never played the role for laughs I would suggest you watch The Romans, The Reign Of Terror and look at the scenes from stories like The Caves Of Androzani and as I seem to keep saying Season 23, when violence was replaced by humour. Even Pertwee himself had his moments like in The Green Death(something I'd like to have seen more off)
And that's the point I'm trying to make that everyone seems to keep missing. I'm not saying the Classic Doctors played it for laughs(except in stories like I mentioned above) merely that it was stated that The Doctor was mainly serious. Well yes he was but he was not without humour(Pertwee mainly aside) and quite simply, that is the point I'm trying to make.
The clowning around can be off-putting when used liberally. Which it has been on too many occasions recently.
To paraphrase the Ninth Doctor.... all planets have toffs