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Are those wanting us to remain in the EU betraying the country?

PrestonAlPrestonAl Posts: 10,342
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it looks like those who want us to remain in the EU are those who possibly would be fine with the UK ceasing to exist as a country and becoming just another member of a bigger federal state.

If this is the case, are these people betraying the country or are they forward thinkers who believe that the UK alone is just a small fish in a big pond.
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    vauxhall1964vauxhall1964 Posts: 10,360
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    desperate, truly desperate
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    MesostimMesostim Posts: 52,864
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    PrestonAl wrote: »
    it looks like those who want us to remain in the EU are those who possibly would be fine with the UK ceasing to exist as a country and becoming just another member of a bigger federal state.

    If this is the case, are these people betraying the country or are they forward thinkers who believe that the UK alone is just a small fish in a big pond.

    Phew... thank goodness the Brexiters don;t do Project Fear.
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    NilSatisOptimumNilSatisOptimum Posts: 2,377
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    Bothered.
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    bluewomble88bluewomble88 Posts: 2,860
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    Yes. They are traitors to the brave souls that have their lives for our freedom and sovereignty.
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    glasshalffullglasshalffull Posts: 22,291
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    Dunno...I'll let you know later...I have to go burn down a couple of HM Dockyards right now
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    LostFoolLostFool Posts: 90,662
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    Yes. They are traitors to the brave souls that have their lives for our freedom and sovereignty.

    I wonder if the same people who are demanding "freedom and sovereignty" are the same ones who think the the UK shouldn't get involved in overseas military action without the approval of the UN?

    If we have full sovereignty then why should we need the permission from the UN for anything?
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    plateletplatelet Posts: 26,386
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    They're no more traitors than the brexiters are deserters
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    glasshalffullglasshalffull Posts: 22,291
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    LostFool wrote: »
    I wonder if the same people who are demanding "freedom and sovereignty" are the same ones who think the the UK shouldn't get involved in overseas military action without the approval of the UN?

    If we have full sovereignty then why should we need the permission from the UN for anything?

    A lot of them are the same people do not want the UK exercise it's "sovereignty" over a bunch of UK Territory Tax Havens to get them in line either ;-)
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    boddismboddism Posts: 16,436
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    PrestonAl wrote: »
    it looks like those who want us to remain in the EU are those who possibly would be fine with the UK ceasing to exist as a country and becoming just another member of a bigger federal state.

    If this is the case, are these people betraying the country or are they forward thinkers who believe that the UK alone is just a small fish in a big pond.

    This is OTT emotional talk. There is no great hunger for a Federal state amongst the 27 nations of the EU & they'd all have to agree to it for it to go ahead.
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    jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,572
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    Yes. They are traitors to the brave souls that have their lives for our freedom and sovereignty.

    Emotive nonsense.
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    BanglaRoadBanglaRoad Posts: 57,592
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    Yes. They are traitors to the brave souls that have their lives for our freedom and sovereignty.

    Brexit should put this on posters all over the country.
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    PrestonAlPrestonAl Posts: 10,342
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    boddism wrote: »
    This is OTT emotional talk. There is no great hunger for a Federal state amongst the 27 nations of the EU & they'd all have to agree to it for it to go ahead.

    Closer ties, everyone getting tax codes, more integration on tax, EU army in the works, EU making international decisions where the UK used to be involved.

    Yep, nothing to fear here.
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    jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,572
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    BanglaRoad wrote: »
    Brexit should put this on posters all over the country.

    Only if they want to weaken their case!
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    BanglaRoadBanglaRoad Posts: 57,592
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    jjwales wrote: »
    Only if they want to weaken their case!

    That was the general idea jj!
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    EnnerjeeEnnerjee Posts: 5,131
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    I believe they are betraying the country, yes.

    There's an excellent article by Matthew Paris (who's committed to stay in the EU) giving valid reasons why how he thinks the LEAVE campaign might be able to turn things around.

    He suggests that by not having the courage to vote for BREXIT, the people are demonstrating their lack of self-belief and opting for risk-averse safe-play.

    He cites Christopher Columbus, Francis Drake, Captain Cook, Emmiline Pankhurst and Margaret Thatcher as people who'd taken risks against all odds only to have won the prize they had their set their sights on and believed in.

    Read it here: http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/how-leave-can-win-or-at-least-lose-with-honour/
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    TassiumTassium Posts: 31,639
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    Most people just go with the flow.

    It takes a special person to either fight for their country or to betray their country, two sides/same coin.
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    jmclaughjmclaugh Posts: 63,997
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    Well if the EU President can call those who wish to leave the EU 'deserters' I suppose the converse can be argued for those who wish to stay.
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    BanglaRoadBanglaRoad Posts: 57,592
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    jmclaugh wrote: »
    Well if the EU President can call those who wish to leave the EU 'deserters' I suppose the converse can be argued for those who wish to stay.

    Or we could all grow up and leave the petty name calling out of it.
    Just because someone else said something daft should not be the green light for playground behaviour.
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    rhodrhod Posts: 3,995
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    PrestonAl wrote: »
    Are those wanting us to remain in the EU betraying the country?

    Assuming you believe the answer to be "yes" what do you intend to do, as you 'patriotic duty'?

    Shoot us?
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    mimik1ukmimik1uk Posts: 46,701
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    rhod wrote: »
    Assuming you believe the answer to be "yes" what do you intend to do, as you 'patriotic duty'?

    Shoot us?

    during the run up to the scottish indyref there were a few of the more extreme nationalists accusing anyone who would vote against independence of being a traitor and one who said they should all be hanged
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    MARTYM8MARTYM8 Posts: 44,710
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    I know what Henry VIII would have done with people who consort with foreign powers to undermine the sovereign powers of their monarch.:D
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    mimik1ukmimik1uk Posts: 46,701
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    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    I know what Henry VIII would have done with people who consort with foreign powers to undermine the sovereign powers of their monarch.:D

    wouldn't that be the brexit crowd then as they are the ones voting against the official position of her majesty's government ;-)
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    jjwalesjjwales Posts: 48,572
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    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    I know what Henry VIII would have done with people who consort with foreign powers to undermine the sovereign powers of their monarch.:D

    Something undemocratic presumably? :)

    Although our current monarch doesn't have any sovereign powers to be undermined.
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    BanglaRoadBanglaRoad Posts: 57,592
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    MARTYM8 wrote: »
    I know what Henry VIII would have done with people who consort with foreign powers to undermine the sovereign powers of their monarch.:D

    Marry them kill them and eat them?:D
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
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    Utterly disgusting claims on here. Goes to show the levels some Brexiters are prepared to go to. Maybe we should spilt the country in half and London in half like Germany and Berlin used to be. People could chose where they want to live depending on whether they're patriotic lair traitors.

    How dare any of you question my patriotism based on whether I support the UK's place in the EU. Disgusting and despicable behaviour.
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