The Tennis Thread (Part 14)

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oh i find that great entertainment!:cool::o

This thread is a continuation of: The Tennis Thread (Part 13)
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  • barracuda91barracuda91 Posts: 3,244
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    Like walking down the street, and somebody unexpectedly kicking you in the nuts might be interesting and unpredictable?

    To most tennis fans, watching mental midgets like Ivanovic, Stosur, Mad Vera, etc, choke their way through matches is going to be a pretty depressing spectacle. Last night, the world's "no.1 player" made a grand total of 0 winners in the first set. And that's actually a lot for her. :)

    Imagine the men's game played almost purely by Gasquet or Mathieu types... but with much less talent and athleticism. That's what women's tennis is.

    Well I wouldn't compare the women's game to being kicked in the nuts, especially since I don't have any :p

    Not all matches though are the players choking, sometimes the lower-ranked players play the tennis of their lives, it's not just down to the top players playing badly. Kerber for example played a fantastic tournament, really great tennis and fighting from her. Also this Wimbledon for me was the best Wimbledon I've seen in a long time, the first week had some great matches and there's been a couple of great matches at the US Open too, like the matches between Stosur and Petrova and Stosur and Kirilenko. The only time a men's match is exciting for me is the final set really and I'd much rather see any woman play rather than watching Gasquet or Mathieu, but that's all done to personal preference.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 4,670
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    When women's tennis is between to competitive players it's very good and sometimes a lot better to watch then men's tennis. A famous example is the Williams v Dementieva Wimbledon semi final. There is a lot of talent within women's tennis, but some consistency is severely lacking.

    I wish Wozniacki had held on more against Serena last night, she's the world No.1 and I really want her to win a slam. It annoys me that that the commentators keep saying "She's happy, she's got Rory" there's no way they would say that about Rory.
  • barracuda91barracuda91 Posts: 3,244
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    vicky2424 wrote: »
    When women's tennis is between to competitive players it's very good and sometimes a lot better to watch then men's tennis. A famous example is the Williams v Dementieva Wimbledon semi final. There is a lot of talent within women's tennis, but some consistency is severely lacking.

    I wish Wozniacki had held on more against Serena last night, she's the world No.1 and I really want her to win a slam. It annoys me that that the commentators keep saying "She's happy, she's got Rory" there's no way they would say that about Rory.

    That match agaisnt Serena and Elena is one of my favourite matches of all time, despite not liking the outcome. I remember I was doing the ironing when I was watching it and it was edge-of-seat stuff, amazing tennis. I do miss Dementieva :cry:
  • roger_50roger_50 Posts: 6,920
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    I think occasionally women's matches can be great, if all the conditions are right (two players match up well), but about 95% of great tennis matches I've watched the last..I don't know...two years, have been men's.

    So it's not as if it's impossible for women's tennis in this era to be great - it just happens far less often. I'd love more than anyone for it to happen more often than it does.
  • not_the_doctornot_the_doctor Posts: 1,835
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    Not all matches though are the players choking,
    Not all, but the frequency with which female players throw away 5-1 leads, and similar winning positions, is simply unmatched in the men's game, or indeed any other sport Not_the_doctor can think of. And it's not due to great fight-backs or the competitive nature of the game. It's just pure choking.
    and I'd much rather see any woman play rather than watching Gasquet or Mathieu, but that's all done to personal preference.
    All other things being even, at least some of the women are easier on the eye.
    vicky2424 wrote: »
    When women's tennis is between to competitive players it's very good
    Certainly. Not_the-doctor has fond memories of the time when the likes of Capriati, the Williams sisters, Hingis, Seles, Graf, etc, would slug it out on the American hard courts, but women's tennis just hasn't had anything like that for several years now.
  • alwaysanigel247alwaysanigel247 Posts: 6,360
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    That match agaisnt Serena and Elena is one of my favourite matches of all time, despite not liking the outcome. I remember I was doing the ironing when I was watching it and it was edge-of-seat stuff, amazing tennis. I do miss Dementieva :cry:

    that is a classic of a match! Also I'm missing Dementieva quite a lot, much more then Henin:rolleyes:
  • Drew_MDrew_M Posts: 1,451
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    that is a classic of a match! Also I'm missing Dementieva quite a lot, much more then Henin:rolleyes:
    A kindred spirit!

    From the previous part of the Tennis thread:

    "Like walking down the street, and somebody unexpectedly kicking you in the nuts might be interesting and unpredictable?"

    Methinks not_the_doctor has outdone himself with this statement (on more than one level, as barracuda has already pointed out). :eek::D

    Adverse comments about the women's game are fine, but refusing to accept that others don't share this view is hard to fathom.

    Re Serena, that really was a short & sweet masterclass this morning - Caro was just nowhere for most of Serena's shots. At least the scoreline didn't end up quite as embarrassing as it looked as though it was going to be.
  • Jewels501Jewels501 Posts: 26,932
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    Certainly. Not_the-doctor has fond memories of the time when the likes of Capriati, the Williams sisters, Hingis, Seles, Graf, etc, would slug it out on the American hard courts, but women's tennis just hasn't had anything like that for several years now.

    I think I have a solution to your posting dilemma not_the_doctor - if Federer wins that ATP Favourite Player thing voted for by the players at the end of the year, shall we call it a special slam to help you out?

    Although methinks you're rather enjoying this third person malarkey.:cool:

    Talk of Gasquet depresses me - so much talent and yet in comparative terms just unable to convert it into the wins. Although I do remember him at RG this year using the crowd to galvanise himself instead of viewing them as his enemy.
  • barracuda91barracuda91 Posts: 3,244
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    Drew_M wrote: »
    A kindred spirit!

    From the previous part of the Tennis thread:

    "Like walking down the street, and somebody unexpectedly kicking you in the nuts might be interesting and unpredictable?"

    Methinks not_the_doctor has outdone himself with this statement (on more than one level, as barracuda has already pointed out). :eek::D

    Adverse comments about the women's game are fine, but refusing to accept that others don't share this view is hard to fathom.

    Re Serena, that really was a short & sweet masterclass this morning - Caro was just nowhere for most of Serena's shots. At least the scoreline didn't end up quite as embarrassing as it looked as though it was going to be.

    Oh I apologise if that's how I came across. I think I said in a previous post that if people prefer the men's game, I don't have a problem with that. If people love the men's and hate the women's, that's their opinion and that's fine by me. I love the women's but I do like to follow David Ferrer :o
  • Jewels501Jewels501 Posts: 26,932
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    Oh I apologise if that's how I came across. I think I said in a previous post that if people prefer the men's game, I don't have a problem with that. If people love the men's and hate the women's, that's their opinion and that's fine by me. I love the women's but I do like to follow David Ferrer :o

    I don't think Drew_M was referring to you.

    You clearly have discerning taste - young David is my second favourite Spaniard - I love my little warrior.:D
  • barracuda91barracuda91 Posts: 3,244
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    Jewels501 wrote: »
    I don't think Drew_M was referring to you.

    You clearly have discerning taste - young David is my second favourite Spaniard - I love my little warrior.:D

    He's lovely :D A good player as well of course :p It was funny seeing Roddick go off on one, ranting to the officials and David was just saying nothing, just so cool :cool:
  • not_the_doctornot_the_doctor Posts: 1,835
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    Drew_M wrote: »
    Adverse comments about the women's game are fine, but refusing to accept that others don't share this view is hard to fathom.
    Not_the_doctor has done no such thing. Clearly some people like the women's game, but it's been clear from the attendance at regular tournaments for some time that it has fallen out of favor, and we're even starting to see this at Grand Slams now. It's not surprising, with non-entities like Schiavone and whomever won Wimbledon lifting the big trophies these days.
    Jewels501 wrote: »
    I think I have a solution to your posting dilemma not_the_doctor - if Federer wins that ATP Favourite Player thing voted for by the players at the end of the year, shall we call it a special slam to help you out?
    Sadly, only a slam or retirement can lift the curse.
    Talk of Gasquet depresses me - so much talent and yet in comparative terms just unable to convert it into the wins.
    Between Gasquet, Mauresmo and Mathieu, could the French be said to be the chokiest tennis nation ever?
  • Jewels501Jewels501 Posts: 26,932
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    He's lovely :D A good player as well of course :p It was funny seeing Roddick go off on one, ranting to the officials and David was just saying nothing, just so cool :cool:

    I reckon he was thinking to himself, I'll let Andy get all hot and bothered because he can do it well enough for the both of us and may be it'll distract him!

    David does have a temper on him though - saw him blow up at Ramos I think the other day but it was all in Spanish - he looked hot and I don't mean temperature-wise!:p:D And he kicked the hoarding or something when they started the rain delayed match initially and hurt his foot apparently!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 8,575
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    Not all, but the frequency with which female players throw away 5-1 leads, and similar winning positions, is simply unmatched in the men's game, or indeed any other sport Not_the_doctor can think of. And it's not due to great fight-backs or the competitive nature of the game. It's just pure choking.

    Not saying there isn't some choking. which there clearly is. But a lot of it is just change in momentum, which can happen at many times during a match.

    Because the serve is far from dominant in the women's gameio, indeed often not dominant at all. once players get the upper hand they start winning both their serve and return games. In the men's game with their serves, they can much easier hold on even when the other player is generally playing better.

    That explains a lot of the the large swings in scores during and, yes, at the end of women's matches, not so much one woman choking as the other improving their game and just getting on top and they take a succession of games.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 8,575
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    What brilliant moral indignation in Roger's press conference about Novak's "lucky" winning forehand on match points down.

    Awwww ;)
  • not_the_doctornot_the_doctor Posts: 1,835
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    indiana44 wrote: »
    ... That explains a lot of the the large swings in scores during and, yes, at the end of women's matches, not so much one woman choking as the other improving their game and just getting on top and they take a succession of games.
    Not_the_doctor doesn't really buy it, because it never used to be a big problem before. Sure, a few famous Novotna and Sabatina chokes stand out, but they were really exceptions to the rule, and it didn't have much to do with serves. The simple fact of the matter is that women's tennis is just in dire need of quality players. It's becoming an issue in the men's game as well, but they at least have a solid block of exceptional top players, where the women have now had a succession of absolute embarrassments populating the top spots.
    indiana44 wrote: »
    What brilliant moral indignation in Roger's press conference about Novak's "lucky" winning forehand on match points down.

    Awwww ;)
    That was pretty lucky, though.

    The silver lining for Federer is that making it to the final would not just have meant another loss to Nadal, it would also have added to Nadal's slam tally and brought him ever closer to a second career slam. Djokovic has a much better chance of stopping Nadal and safe guarding Federer's legacy..
  • bluesdiamondbluesdiamond Posts: 11,360
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    I see that Britain's Oliver Golding is playing in the Boys Final at the moment. He turns 18 this month, even if he does not play, should he be invited to the Davis Cup match to get to know the set up. Assuming he turns pro, he could be in a future squad.
  • Jewels501Jewels501 Posts: 26,932
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    The silver lining for Federer is that making it to the final would not just have meant another loss to Nadal, it would also have added to Nadal's slam tally and brought him ever closer to a second career slam. Djokovic has a much better chance of stopping Nadal and safe guarding Federer's legacy..

    And here we have the reason why Rafanatics such as myself were willing Federer to win.

    In fact, that's just another negative to add to the list - the more I think about it, the more I think he did it on purpose!:eek::D
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 22,198
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    indiana44 wrote: »
    What brilliant moral indignation in Roger's press conference about Novak's "lucky" winning forehand on match points down.

    Awwww ;)

    :D LOL Is it still all luck that people beat him? I must go hunt down a transcript of his interview.

    I want to like him, I really do because he's such a phenomenal player. But some of the things he comes out with are just so arrogant and dismissive, I cant.

    He doesn't like Nole or Andy. It must really "p" him off when those two get the W over him. :p
  • not_the_doctornot_the_doctor Posts: 1,835
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    tally wrote: »
    :D LOL Is it still all luck that people beat him? I must go hunt down a transcript of his interview.
    It wasn't exactly a million-in-one shot, but it would be absurd to suggest that hitting as close a winner as that on as big a point as that was anything other than lucky. What wasn't luck was the subsequent fight back. That was steely determination and confidence against Federer's loss of nerve.
  • Jewels501Jewels501 Posts: 26,932
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    Talking of the WTA - what on earth has happened to Dinara Safina? Is she still out with a back injury was it? Or is she back but just not doing particularly well?

    I think I heard she was contemplating retiring - or am I just making that up?

    I find her career decline really hard to fathom, even more so than Jankovic or Ivanovic - unless it's principally injury related?:confused:
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 8,575
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    tally wrote: »
    :D LOL Is it still all luck that people beat him? I must go hunt down a transcript of his interview.

    I posted the relevant parts of his press conference interviw on another forum. The full interview can be seen on the US Open official; site.

    Anyway....

    Novak had thrown his cap in the crowd at 40 - 15 down and then, well over to Roger...

    just the way he returned...guy who doesn't believe any more in winning....then to lose against someone like that....very disappointing...you feel he was mentally out of it already...just gets a lucky shot and off you go

    and returning to the theme :

    some players grow up and play like that....I remember in juniors players that would be 5 - 2 down and just slapping shots and they'ed go in for some reason...that's the way they grew up playing when they were down....I never played like that. I believe in hard work going to pay off kinda thing....because maybe early on I didn't work ay my hardest.....so it's very hard to understand how you can play a shot like that on match point...maybe he's been doing it for 20 years so for him it was very normal... better ask him

    Awwww
  • StuntyStunty Posts: 45,698
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    To continue the theme of the 2011 US Open ......... play is suspended, it's raining again!
  • Mike TeeveeMike Teevee Posts: 35,573
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    Part 14 whoop whoop - that is all :)
  • NewWorldManNewWorldMan Posts: 4,904
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    vicky2424 wrote: »
    When women's tennis is between to competitive players it's very good and sometimes a lot better to watch then men's tennis. A famous example is the Williams v Dementieva Wimbledon semi final. There is a lot of talent within women's tennis, but some consistency is severely lacking.

    Yes, that match should have been the final last year. I agree on your consistency remark as well.
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