In what way are they offering less for more? As someone who was on BT total broadband I was upgraded to infinity for free. Unless you mean they charge more than other ISP's for less of a service, even then they are offering a faster service than most, except Virgin Media at the moment.
As for the Lamborghini analogy I'd say it was more like giving someone a super fast car but saying there are some speed limits on the roads for the good of all users.
Most ISP's have some sort of FUP/Cap whether we like it or not there is no such thing as unlimited (i wish they would change the advertising but never will) 300gig is reasonable I do feel it should be a bit higher (maybe 4-500gig) but that may come with time especially with HD films etc as I said previously Bethere have been brilliant but they dithered over fttc which has got on alot of their customers nerves and quite a few have left which is a shame as they really are a g8 ISP and when they do bring out FTTC at the end of my infinity contract I will go back.
Sorry about my dbl post sent it via my mobile and something went ahem wrong
Whilst YOU can go from experience unfortunately Noise can't. He's never had BTVision or BT Infinity. In fact he's only recently got himself a TV license. His opinions are of course welcome - but that's all they are - very few of them have any supportable substance except for being his opinion.
I may not have had BT Vision, but I still had experience with it. a fair bit of it to honest. I was normally the person that was called when there was a problem, why I have no idea.
You are right, never had experience with BT infinity or any other fibre service and i doubt I ever will, can't see our exchange being updated.
But i have looked at different services that ISps are offering on fibre, just in case of some miracle we do get it here in the next 20 years. what I have seen is higher prices than what I am paying now just for a bit of speed.
I can do everything I want on ther speed I have got and I don't have to worry in case I go over some data limits
it seems like Infinity have got a few problems at the moment
I wonder why I got that T.v licence to be honest, still the same trash on, May get rid of it again, I got better choice now as the BBc Iplayer, 4OD and ITV player are all now on the Ps3, which I could watch without a licence.
As I got told off by the Mods who seem to be very onesided I have to be careful what I say as I seem to have been accused of all sorts of Cack, but there does seem to be alot of resentment from the people who can afford all the gadgets companies bring out, but alot of people having a go at people for having a very modest setup like myself, i am sorry i haven't got HD coming out of my jacksy but i'm sure when funds allow i will get it
It don't worry me what anyone say, just words to be honest, there are some things I may get a bit bothered about, but not much.
I can't really afford loads of gadgets either, My wages are not that great and I got rent and bills to pay like other people.
A need to update this computer, but it will be done bit by bit. I have got the money put away to go Freeview/Freesat Hd if I decide to, but as of yet I have not seen it as value for money.
I may just use the money to update my computer quicker and to get myself a Kindle.
I got a plasma T.v, but I did not pay for it and I have got a PS3, that I did pay for, which allows me to use Blu-ray, but not that bothered about HD broadcasted t.V
I may not have had BT Vision, but I still had experience with it. a fair bit of it to honest. I was normally the person that was called when there was a problem, why I have no idea.
You are right, never had experience with BT infinity or any other fibre service and i doubt I ever will, can't see our exchange being updated.
But i have looked at different services that ISps are offering on fibre, just in case of some miracle we do get it here in the next 20 years. what I have seen is higher prices than what I am paying now just for a bit of speed.
I can do everything I want on ther speed I have got and I don't have to worry in case I go over some data limits
it seems like Infinity have got a few problems at the moment
I wonder why I got that T.v licence to be honest, still the same trash on, May get rid of it again, I got better choice now as the BBc Iplayer, 4OD and ITV player are all now on the Ps3, which I could watch without a licence.
I think I was too quick in getting that licence.
I too had that problem but back to 25meg now, just been on another forum and there is a guy on there spouting the old anyone who uses over 300 gig a month is a pirate cack, I may not agree with some of your posts Noise, but I do respect your opinion (rightly or wrongly in my mind) but at least you haven't accuses all heavy users of being pirates lol
I thought as long as you watched any BBC content in this country regardless of delivery system you still need a TV Tax/License?
In what way are they offering less for more? As someone who was on BT total broadband I was upgraded to infinity for free. Unless you mean they charge more than other ISP's for less of a service, even then they are offering a faster service than most, except Virgin Media at the moment.
you may not find it as BT use traffic management on their normal service anyway. But I looked at the ISps I am using and Fibre is another £5 a month on top of what I am paying now and then you are limited to a 30Gb data limit, ok that is only in peak times and it is unlimited off peak
Off peak is midnight to 8am and all weekend, which i think is better than Bt offering and no traffic management.
Bt Option two is about the same price at around £25, but you are stuck into a 18 month contract and they tell lies about being unlimited and we all know it is not. Bt should really come right out with it and tell the truth. Then you get their traffic management and if it is as bad as their ADSL traffic management, then I don't see the point in the extra cost for infinity
Have a look here to see problems that are happening
As for the Lamborghini analogy I'd say it was more like giving someone a super fast car but saying there are some speed limits on the roads for the good of all users.
If we are going to be cut down, then why don't they use a PAYG system? I was on a system like that a few years back on broadband and it was a great idea. when I did not use the broadband much, I paid very little, if I used it a bit more I paid a bit more. That would sort out the traffic management
Even if we had a miracle and this city was fibre enabled, I think I would stay as am, it may be slower, but
(a) I stay away from Bt equipment
(b)at least I know that I am not going to go over any limits, because I have none
Most ISP's have some sort of FUP/Cap whether we like it or not there is no such thing as unlimited (i wish they would change the advertising but never will) 300gig is reasonable I do feel it should be a bit higher (maybe 4-500gig) but that may come with time especially with HD films etc as I said previously Bethere have been brilliant but they dithered over fttc which has got on alot of their customers nerves and quite a few have left which is a shame as they really are a g8 ISP and when they do bring out FTTC at the end of my infinity contract I will go back.
Sorry about my dbl post sent it via my mobile and something went ahem wrong
and yes my spelling sucks lol
I got no limits, no capping, no port blocking and no traffic management.
If I lived where a mate of mine lives I could get 16Megabits of pure clean unlimited uncapped broadband, but I don't, so I get 4 Megabits of it instead
you may not find it as BT use traffic management on their normal service anyway. But I looked at the ISps I am using and Fibre is another £5 a month on top of what I am paying now and then you are limited to a 30Gb data limit, ok that is only in peak times and it is unlimited off peak
Off peak is midnight to 8am and all weekend, which i think is better than Bt offering and no traffic management.
Bt Option two is about the same price at around £25, but you are stuck into a 18 month contract and they tell lies about being unlimited and we all know it is not. Bt should really come right out with it and tell the truth. Then you get their traffic management and if it is as bad as their ADSL traffic management, then I don't see the point in the extra cost for infinity
Have a look here to see problems that are happening
If we are going to be cut down, then why don't they use a PAYG system? I was on a system like that a few years back on broadband and it was a great idea. when I did not use the broadband much, I paid very little, if I used it a bit more I paid a bit more. That would sort out the traffic management
Even if we had a miracle and this city was fibre enabled, I think I would stay as am, it may be slower, but
(a) I stay away from Bt equipment
(b)at least I know that I am not going to go over any limits, because I have none
I was one of those affected but all ISP's have the odd problem including my fav Be, reading the BT forums most customers are very happy and impressed with Infinity
I too had that problem but back to 25meg now, just been on another forum and there is a guy on there spouting the old anyone who uses over 300 gig a month is a pirate cack, I may not agree with some of your posts Noise, but I do respect your opinion (rightly or wrongly in my mind) but at least you haven't accuses all heavy users of being pirates lol
what anyone do with their internet is up to them, if they want to download loads of songs or films then that is up to them, I don't care.
some people stream and lot and with more and more ways to stream and with more and more online services, usage data will go up.
Look now on the PS3, I can use BBC iplayer, ITV and 4OD services and if I pay a bit more for my love film subscription I can stream from there as well.
so it is so easy to go about 100Gb these days. My mate does it a lot as he is a big games player and download a lot of games legally, patches and updates. Plus he steams a lot.
I thought as long as you watched any BBC content in this country regardless of delivery system you still need a TV Tax/License?
then you thought wrong, just like a lot of people do.
You only need a TV licence if you are watching something that is being broadcasted at the same time.
I was one of those affected but all ISP's have the odd problem including my fav Be, reading the BT forums most customers are very happy and impressed with Infinity
Because it is like going from Dial up to broadband when it first started, give it a few months and they will start complaining that it is too slow and they want something faster
Because it is like going from Dial up to broadband when it first started, give it a few months and they will start complaining that it is too slow and they want something faster
i'm sorry Noise there you are totally wrong most people know the limits of technology and they know it takes time (it has taken virgin years to get to the speeds they are at now) once you are avg 30 meg you very rarely need much more, simple speed difference is amazing
Unless you have tried it you can't really understand it, the difference from 8 meg to 30+ meg is outstanding (and yes that includes network management)
i'm sorry Noise there you are totally wrong most people know the limits of technology and they know it takes time (it has taken virgin years to get to the speeds they are at now) once you are avg 30 meg you very rarely need much more, simple speed difference is amazing
Oh they will still want more, they will need that file to download in 3 seconds instead of say 30 seconds.
Unless you have tried it you can't really understand it, the difference from 8 meg to 30+ meg is outstanding (and yes that includes network management)
You are right, I can't understand the difference between 8 Mgeabits and 30+ megabits, I never had 8 megabits here.
But I do know the difference between my 4 and my mates 16 and it is immense Graphic laden web pages load instantly on my mates 16 megabits, he can download large files in minutes, it can take a hour or more on my connection for some of the files he downloads. I would love his 16 megabits connection, but i am not moving house to get it
i can do every thing I want to do to be honest now I moved to a decent network, i could never do half the stuff on BT. I can even upload at twice the speed as I could with BT.
If fibre came here and it offered me a slower speed say 16Megabits for the same price I am paying now with the same unlimited service i would take it. But I pay enough for my internet as it is, I don't want to pay any extra, no matter how fast it is, certainly for one that put restrictions on me. i had enough of Bt over the top traffic management on ADSL I think eventually it would be worse on Fibre.
I am glad you are happy with it and I hope you carry on being happy with it, but too high a price for just a bit more speed for me. But since we will never have it anyway, I don't think I have to worry about it.
Still, I had a nice £40 cheque from Bt a few days back after I closed my phone account All ties with Bt have now gone, the only thing is now I got to stop them contacting me with their leaflets and emails.
I don't think is new. TalkTalk are likely to do the same too. The bigger question - can existing Vision boxes access YouView - is a no as far as I know.
I don't think is new. TalkTalk are likely to do the same too. The bigger question - can existing Vision boxes access YouView - is a no as far as I know.
I agree (TalkTalk).
And I also think NO.
The current Vision box does not support DVB T2, HE AAC, have a 300 gb hard drive, or stream HD content live.
I liked the '2x dual-mode DVB-T/T2 tuners'. RF characteristics as specified by DTG D-Book
version 6.2. DVB-T2 is used for HD services on digital terrestrial.'
The current Vision box does not support 1. DVB T2, 2. HE AAC, have a 300 gb hard drive, or stream HD content live.
1. Missing hardware so no obviously not
2. the boxes can. never been enough bandwidth for HD, adding a 300GB HDD is very easy. HE AAC is a codec. software codecs are easy to implement on any windows based machine.
if the existing boxes could NOT support youview... then WHY are they bothering to roll out BBC iplayer on ALL EXISTING boxes? why didn't they wait till the new box?
I liked the '2x dual-mode DVB-T/T2 tuners'. RF characteristics as specified by DTG D-Book
version 6.2. DVB-T2 is used for HD services on digital terrestrial.'
That will cost them a lot of money, I hope Bt got deep pockets. Bt don't listen, that is the problem.
They still think their way is best, if their way is the best then why have every other LLu network provider not used Bt way?
Cable and wireless don't use no profiling at all, Sky uses some sort of DLM, but they do it well and will adjust if needs be, even Talk Talk use a better DLM system than BT, only just mind you.
As been proved by C&W, profiling/DLM is not needed.
2. the boxes can. never been enough bandwidth for HD, adding a 300GB HDD is very easy. HE AAC is a codec. software codecs are easy to implement on any windows based machine.
if the existing boxes could NOT support youview... then WHY are they bothering to roll out BBC iplayer on ALL EXISTING boxes? why didn't they wait till the new box?
That is confusing.
300Gb is not enough to be honest anyway, not for HD, a minimum of 500Gb is needed and to be honest hard drives are dead cheap now
So You View is going to use Linux, now is that a good or bad thing?
300Gb is not enough to be honest anyway, not for HD, a minimum of 500Gb is needed and to be honest hard drives are dead cheap now
So You View is going to use Linux, now is that a good or bad thing?
Still think the specs are not tight enough
.
Bad thing.
if it is to use linux then it will be easily reversable, and hacked custom box images will arrive as a result. if there paid for content... then hacks/bypasses could be made to enable those for free.
if it is to use linux then it will be easily reversable, and hacked custom box images will arrive as a result. if there paid for content... then hacks/bypasses could be made to enable those for free.
if it is to use linux then it will be easily reversable, and hacked custom box images will arrive as a result. if there paid for content... then hacks/bypasses could be made to enable those for free.
Oh yes, that is what I thought as well. There would have to be some flipping good security system hardware wise and then I don't think that will stop it.
Bad news, they could have the same problem as on digital did with people getting paid content for free.
What is means is that some clever spark can change the system to give you any paid content for free and do other clever things that the box was not meant to do.
Comments
Most ISP's have some sort of FUP/Cap whether we like it or not there is no such thing as unlimited (i wish they would change the advertising but never will) 300gig is reasonable I do feel it should be a bit higher (maybe 4-500gig) but that may come with time especially with HD films etc as I said previously Bethere have been brilliant but they dithered over fttc which has got on alot of their customers nerves and quite a few have left which is a shame as they really are a g8 ISP and when they do bring out FTTC at the end of my infinity contract I will go back.
Sorry about my dbl post sent it via my mobile and something went ahem wrong
and yes my spelling sucks lol
I may not have had BT Vision, but I still had experience with it. a fair bit of it to honest. I was normally the person that was called when there was a problem, why I have no idea.
You are right, never had experience with BT infinity or any other fibre service and i doubt I ever will, can't see our exchange being updated.
But i have looked at different services that ISps are offering on fibre, just in case of some miracle we do get it here in the next 20 years. what I have seen is higher prices than what I am paying now just for a bit of speed.
I can do everything I want on ther speed I have got and I don't have to worry in case I go over some data limits
it seems like Infinity have got a few problems at the moment
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/4512-bt-s-super-fast-infinity-broadband-stuck-in-the-slow-lane.html
I wonder why I got that T.v licence to be honest, still the same trash on, May get rid of it again, I got better choice now as the BBc Iplayer, 4OD and ITV player are all now on the Ps3, which I could watch without a licence.
I think I was too quick in getting that licence.
It don't worry me what anyone say, just words to be honest, there are some things I may get a bit bothered about, but not much.
I can't really afford loads of gadgets either, My wages are not that great and I got rent and bills to pay like other people.
A need to update this computer, but it will be done bit by bit. I have got the money put away to go Freeview/Freesat Hd if I decide to, but as of yet I have not seen it as value for money.
I may just use the money to update my computer quicker and to get myself a Kindle.
I got a plasma T.v, but I did not pay for it and I have got a PS3, that I did pay for, which allows me to use Blu-ray, but not that bothered about HD broadcasted t.V
I too had that problem but back to 25meg now, just been on another forum and there is a guy on there spouting the old anyone who uses over 300 gig a month is a pirate cack, I may not agree with some of your posts Noise, but I do respect your opinion (rightly or wrongly in my mind) but at least you haven't accuses all heavy users of being pirates lol
I thought as long as you watched any BBC content in this country regardless of delivery system you still need a TV Tax/License?
Off peak is midnight to 8am and all weekend, which i think is better than Bt offering and no traffic management.
Bt Option two is about the same price at around £25, but you are stuck into a 18 month contract and they tell lies about being unlimited and we all know it is not. Bt should really come right out with it and tell the truth. Then you get their traffic management and if it is as bad as their ADSL traffic management, then I don't see the point in the extra cost for infinity
Have a look here to see problems that are happening
If we are going to be cut down, then why don't they use a PAYG system? I was on a system like that a few years back on broadband and it was a great idea. when I did not use the broadband much, I paid very little, if I used it a bit more I paid a bit more. That would sort out the traffic management
Even if we had a miracle and this city was fibre enabled, I think I would stay as am, it may be slower, but
(a) I stay away from Bt equipment
(b)at least I know that I am not going to go over any limits, because I have none
I got no limits, no capping, no port blocking and no traffic management.
If I lived where a mate of mine lives I could get 16Megabits of pure clean unlimited uncapped broadband, but I don't, so I get 4 Megabits of it instead
I was one of those affected but all ISP's have the odd problem including my fav Be, reading the BT forums most customers are very happy and impressed with Infinity
what anyone do with their internet is up to them, if they want to download loads of songs or films then that is up to them, I don't care.
some people stream and lot and with more and more ways to stream and with more and more online services, usage data will go up.
Look now on the PS3, I can use BBC iplayer, ITV and 4OD services and if I pay a bit more for my love film subscription I can stream from there as well.
so it is so easy to go about 100Gb these days. My mate does it a lot as he is a big games player and download a lot of games legally, patches and updates. Plus he steams a lot.
then you thought wrong, just like a lot of people do.
You only need a TV licence if you are watching something that is being broadcasted at the same time.
Otherwise you would need a licence for you Tube
Because it is like going from Dial up to broadband when it first started, give it a few months and they will start complaining that it is too slow and they want something faster
i'm sorry Noise there you are totally wrong most people know the limits of technology and they know it takes time (it has taken virgin years to get to the speeds they are at now) once you are avg 30 meg you very rarely need much more, simple speed difference is amazing
Unless you have tried it you can't really understand it, the difference from 8 meg to 30+ meg is outstanding (and yes that includes network management)
Oh they will still want more, they will need that file to download in 3 seconds instead of say 30 seconds.
You are right, I can't understand the difference between 8 Mgeabits and 30+ megabits, I never had 8 megabits here.
But I do know the difference between my 4 and my mates 16 and it is immense Graphic laden web pages load instantly on my mates 16 megabits, he can download large files in minutes, it can take a hour or more on my connection for some of the files he downloads. I would love his 16 megabits connection, but i am not moving house to get it
i can do every thing I want to do to be honest now I moved to a decent network, i could never do half the stuff on BT. I can even upload at twice the speed as I could with BT.
If fibre came here and it offered me a slower speed say 16Megabits for the same price I am paying now with the same unlimited service i would take it. But I pay enough for my internet as it is, I don't want to pay any extra, no matter how fast it is, certainly for one that put restrictions on me. i had enough of Bt over the top traffic management on ADSL I think eventually it would be worse on Fibre.
I am glad you are happy with it and I hope you carry on being happy with it, but too high a price for just a bit more speed for me. But since we will never have it anyway, I don't think I have to worry about it.
Still, I had a nice £40 cheque from Bt a few days back after I closed my phone account All ties with Bt have now gone, the only thing is now I got to stop them contacting me with their leaflets and emails.
.
I've been looking around the other forums....
And your going to love this...
And before any non-BT users jump on the artical below, yes, it acknowledges Vision, in user numbers, is a commercial failure. And it is.
Looking forward to this service being added.
And you are going to love this...
"BT to include YouView boxes in broadband packages"
"The YouView service will be supported by BT Vision boxes, with the telecoms giant able to offer it from the launch day."
http://www.bradinsight.com/news.aspx?storyid=82357
I don't think is new. TalkTalk are likely to do the same too. The bigger question - can existing Vision boxes access YouView - is a no as far as I know.
I agree (TalkTalk).
And I also think NO.
The current Vision box does not support DVB T2, HE AAC, have a 300 gb hard drive, or stream HD content live.
I liked the '2x dual-mode DVB-T/T2 tuners'. RF characteristics as specified by DTG D-Book
version 6.2. DVB-T2 is used for HD services on digital terrestrial.'
The Full specs...
http://www.youview.com/wp-content/themes/youview/_site_media/resources/Consumer_Device_Platform_Draft_A.pdf
Nice.
1. Missing hardware so no obviously not
2. the boxes can. never been enough bandwidth for HD, adding a 300GB HDD is very easy. HE AAC is a codec. software codecs are easy to implement on any windows based machine.
if the existing boxes could NOT support youview... then WHY are they bothering to roll out BBC iplayer on ALL EXISTING boxes? why didn't they wait till the new box?
If these boxes are suppose to be HD, why is a Scart socket being put on them?
Not standard enough to be honest, still too many difference that different companies can make, this have been the problem with Freeview boxes.
Need to set a standard., don't forget that all the stuff on the PDf is draft, it can and no doubt will change
That will cost them a lot of money, I hope Bt got deep pockets. Bt don't listen, that is the problem.
They still think their way is best, if their way is the best then why have every other LLu network provider not used Bt way?
Cable and wireless don't use no profiling at all, Sky uses some sort of DLM, but they do it well and will adjust if needs be, even Talk Talk use a better DLM system than BT, only just mind you.
As been proved by C&W, profiling/DLM is not needed.
That is confusing.
300Gb is not enough to be honest anyway, not for HD, a minimum of 500Gb is needed and to be honest hard drives are dead cheap now
So You View is going to use Linux, now is that a good or bad thing?
Still think the specs are not tight enough
.
Bad thing.
if it is to use linux then it will be easily reversable, and hacked custom box images will arrive as a result. if there paid for content... then hacks/bypasses could be made to enable those for free.
Err,
What does that mean? (Not a tech person, sorry).
You don't have HD, or a HD box, so I personally wouldn't expect you to know.
All HD boxes have a scart on them. Why? I don't know. But they do.
All I can equate it to is - I had my Sky HD box on SD via a scart on a crt TV then got a HDMI lead to watch HD on my new HD TV.
And the quality in picture jumped significantly.
But you don't have HD, and so you are not in an informed position to comment.
You are, of course, free to post your comment, but it will not be an informed one.
1) To connect to a recorder to archiving recordings;
2) To feed a SCART based distribution system.
Oh yes, that is what I thought as well. There would have to be some flipping good security system hardware wise and then I don't think that will stop it.
Bad news, they could have the same problem as on digital did with people getting paid content for free.
What is means is that some clever spark can change the system to give you any paid content for free and do other clever things that the box was not meant to do.