Lord Sugar left school with one GCSE and he frequently spells words wrongly on twitter. He is not intelligent but, with a personal fortune of £770 million he is very very clever!
Hardwork, taking risks and a bit of luck also come into it !
A friend I emailed kindly suggested I might have a high IQ. I know my general knowledge isn't great and I'm not very good at basic things like maths, so I tend to think I wouldn't necessarily do well in an IQ test, so she replied saying she believes there's different types of intelligence, which was an interesting thought.
I then saw a program recently called Satisfied Fool, where Karl Pilkington talks about intelligence and gets his intelligence tested - anyway the relevance being that at one point he's with Germaine Greer and she says that (something along the lines of) 'there's a difference between being intelligent and being clever'. Again, that really interested me, so I asked my friend what she thought. She reckoned people who can adapt well to tests and aren't easily distracted, who can apply themselves to certain things, their perhaps more clever? any other thoughts on this, how would you distinguish the difference between being clever and being intelligent?.
Being intelligent and being clever are closely related, but I think I know what you mean. Just because you have a high IQ doesn't guarantee you have high social skills, emotional empathy and will make a general success of your life.
There's a lot more to life than spatial awareness, which is what many IQ tests seem to almost entirely consist of.
Being intelligent and being clever are closely related, but I think I know what you mean. Just because you have a high IQ doesn't guarantee you have high social skills, emotional empathy and will make a general success of your life.
f.
That's what I was thinking of when I mentioned the genius level man. He has neither social skills nor emotional empathy. Bill Gates asked him to join him.
There are some types of intelligence that lend themselves to being measured by tests and exams and others that don't, like wisdom and common sense.
Then there's the type of intelligence possessed by those with huge amounts of practical ability who might not necessarily have any of the other kinds. I think of some of my poorer relatives from very rural communities who can literally make something out of almost nothing when I say that.
It's generally accepted or understood that when we're talking about someone who is incredibly clever, or intelligent or smart - we'll mostly be using their attainment of academic qualifications as some kind of benchmark.
I always thought the difference was that intelligence is when you know stuff on paper but no good at practical stuff. Like being able to fly through an exam but ask him how to wire up a 2 pin plug and he's useless. To me clever and intelligent are degrees of the same thing. He's clever because he passed all his exams but he's intelligent because he can understand quantum psychics.
Skillful is when you know stuff in practice but not necessarily on paper like being able to make something out of raw materials or someone with a talent.
Common sense is when you know how to do things that matter in life like pay a bill or change a light bulb and being able to apply it in a logical manner. You can be intelligent but still have no common sense.
Street Wise is knowing a lot of things which are useful but not necessarily legal or moral. Like knowing how to fiddle your taxes or where to get knocked off DVDs and cheap **** from.
I always thought the difference was that intelligence is when you know stuff on paper but no good at practical stuff. Like being able to fly through an exam but ask him how to wire up a 2 pin plug and he's useless. To me clever and intelligent are degrees of the same thing. He's clever because he passed all his exams but he's intelligent because he can understand quantum psychics.
Skillful is when you know stuff in practice but not necessarily on paper like being able to make something out of raw materials or someone with a talent.
Common sense is when you know how to do things that matter in life like pay a bill or change a light bulb and being able to apply it in a logical manner. You can be intelligent but still have no common sense.
Street Wise is knowing a lot of things which are useful but not necessarily legal or moral. Like knowing how to fiddle your taxes or where to get knocked off DVDs and cheap **** from.
Rather than 'intelligent' and 'clever', 'intelligent' and 'intellectual' might be a better distinction.
The best definition of general intelligence I have ever heard was Robert Runcie who said - "Intelligence is the ability to cope".
I don't agree with that definition.
Some intelligent people lose their way in life through circumstance.
Otherwise all homeless living on the streets would by definition be thick. I'm thinking here more about the older ones because I started to get to know one.
Some intelligent people lose their way in life through circumstance.
Otherwise all homeless living on the streets would by definition be thick. I'm thinking here more about the older ones because I started to get to know one.
Sorry Izzy - don't want to go off topic.
Yes, I'd agree with you in a way, but I think he was talking about how people engage with normal everyday life rather than a specific set of awful circumstances that virtually no one would be able to surmount.
Being intelligent and being clever are closely related, but I think I know what you mean. Just because you have a high IQ doesn't guarantee you have high social skills, emotional empathy and will make a general success of your life.
There's a lot more to life than spatial awareness, which is what many IQ tests seem to almost entirely consist of.
Its more the other way around though - I reckon I probably wouldn't get an especially high (or good) result from an IQ test because I tend to over think and panic a bit in test situations, so I don't think any such result would necessarily reflect on my true intelligence, or cleverness/knowledge etc.
Some intelligent people lose their way in life through circumstance.
Otherwise all homeless living on the streets would by definition be thick. I'm thinking here more about the older ones because I started to get to know one.
Sorry Izzy - don't want to go off topic.
Don't worry about it im reading replies, I'm just not always sure what to say
I think posting this thread has led to me feeling a bit more thick - hah lol typical. Ah well... I do think I can be quite perceptive, inquisitive and empathetic but where that lies in all of this, im not entirely sure.
Yes, I'd agree with you in a way, but I think he was talking about how people engage with normal everyday life rather than a specific set of awful circumstances that virtually no one would be able to surmount.
Someone can be intelligent in a academic sense and completely gormless in real life.
Someone can be very shrewd with everyday life and not be good at retaining facts or figures or solving puzzles or whatever.
Some people are lucky to be both. Don't know if its as simple as academic = intelligent, shrewd = clever.
A friend on my son's is a right boffin. He works in research and earns hundreds of thousands a year, he's briliant. but In real life he's totally laid back and can just about work the sky recorder.
I think that there is a difference between 'intelligence' and being 'clever.' I would relate intelligence to be a characteristic that is a natural ability. You have an expertise and develop your interest in a certain area. Your focus is on researching and studying a particular field at length.
Being clever is related to a specific incident where someone has used sense, wisdom or experience to proficiently deal with a problem. I always think of being clever as demonstrating capabilities in an instant. For instance, a driving maneuver to avoid an accident and generally being sharp and aware of what is being asked of you.
A friend on my son's is a right boffin. He works in research and earns hundreds of thousands a year, he's briliant. but In real life he's totally laid back and can just about work the sky recorder.
That's fairly typical of people with extraordinary academic/intellectual ability.
Comments
Hardwork, taking risks and a bit of luck also come into it !
Yes for sure. But he's a good example for someone who didn't do so well in education.
Being intelligent and being clever are closely related, but I think I know what you mean. Just because you have a high IQ doesn't guarantee you have high social skills, emotional empathy and will make a general success of your life.
There's a lot more to life than spatial awareness, which is what many IQ tests seem to almost entirely consist of.
That's what I was thinking of when I mentioned the genius level man. He has neither social skills nor emotional empathy. Bill Gates asked him to join him.
The best definition of general intelligence I have ever heard was Robert Runcie who said - "Intelligence is the ability to cope".
"That's very clever. How's that working out for you?"
"What?"
"Being clever."
That is a very good distinction.
Where the heck have you been the past four years?!
Then there's the type of intelligence possessed by those with huge amounts of practical ability who might not necessarily have any of the other kinds. I think of some of my poorer relatives from very rural communities who can literally make something out of almost nothing when I say that.
It's generally accepted or understood that when we're talking about someone who is incredibly clever, or intelligent or smart - we'll mostly be using their attainment of academic qualifications as some kind of benchmark.
Trying to think of something intelligent and/or academic to say.
Skillful is when you know stuff in practice but not necessarily on paper like being able to make something out of raw materials or someone with a talent.
Common sense is when you know how to do things that matter in life like pay a bill or change a light bulb and being able to apply it in a logical manner. You can be intelligent but still have no common sense.
Street Wise is knowing a lot of things which are useful but not necessarily legal or moral. Like knowing how to fiddle your taxes or where to get knocked off DVDs and cheap **** from.
So are most engineers.
I don't agree with that definition.
Some intelligent people lose their way in life through circumstance.
Otherwise all homeless living on the streets would by definition be thick. I'm thinking here more about the older ones because I started to get to know one.
Sorry Izzy - don't want to go off topic.
In that case I'd probably describe him as being more skillfull or clever with his skills rather than use the word intelligent.
My interpretation is that intelligence describes academic ability rather than practical.
I guess you could be intelligent and skillful at the same time but I don't think you can use the two words to describe a mutual ability.
I know I'm intelligent but in no way am I academic! I am impractical though. Totally.
Surgeons work with their hands. Is a brain surgeon intelligent or clever?
Yes, I'd agree with you in a way, but I think he was talking about how people engage with normal everyday life rather than a specific set of awful circumstances that virtually no one would be able to surmount.
Its more the other way around though - I reckon I probably wouldn't get an especially high (or good) result from an IQ test because I tend to over think and panic a bit in test situations, so I don't think any such result would necessarily reflect on my true intelligence, or cleverness/knowledge etc.
Don't worry about it
I think posting this thread has led to me feeling a bit more thick - hah lol typical. Ah well... I do think I can be quite perceptive, inquisitive and empathetic but where that lies in all of this, im not entirely sure.
So have I and left school with nothing. I was also an engineer.
Could we coax you out little bald cat?
A friend on my son's is a right boffin. He works in research and earns hundreds of thousands a year, he's briliant. but In real life he's totally laid back and can just about work the sky recorder.
Being clever is related to a specific incident where someone has used sense, wisdom or experience to proficiently deal with a problem. I always think of being clever as demonstrating capabilities in an instant. For instance, a driving maneuver to avoid an accident and generally being sharp and aware of what is being asked of you.
That's fairly typical of people with extraordinary academic/intellectual ability.