Is it pretty much impossible now to get a credible artist winning these shows
DUNDEEBOY
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The voice winners, add in ben hainault, sam bailey from x factor over last couple of years.
None of these people would have had much of a young vote which suggests that this vote has been marginalised as the young people have drifted away from these shows particularly in the case of x factor.
With the same type of act being dominant in these shows, i suppose its generally , i feel a more mature voter who votes in these things these days.
The also pretty much vote in the now and dont vote with the what might they do in the future, which kind of means these type of winners will continue to happen
None of these people would have had much of a young vote which suggests that this vote has been marginalised as the young people have drifted away from these shows particularly in the case of x factor.
With the same type of act being dominant in these shows, i suppose its generally , i feel a more mature voter who votes in these things these days.
The also pretty much vote in the now and dont vote with the what might they do in the future, which kind of means these type of winners will continue to happen
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So I would like to ask what the OP considers 'credible' as an artist and then we can get somewhere, rather than just throwing out dismissive remarks.
They fall for the gag-making story lines, the sniffling, the 'I want this more than anything in the word' rubbish, the sob story - the clever manipulations of a production team - and never base their vote on talent.
Why would they? They want to be entertained. They are not star pickers. They just like to think they are.
Absolutely true. The bland leading the bland .
But then we get all those voters who put Lucy in second place, so the theory doesn't hold up completely.
That's a very interesting point. I've never heard it expressed like that but it does make total sense.
I'm surprised that no-one on British telly has yet (to my knowledge) been able to make a wildly successful The Voice or X Factor show yet that simply features unsigned artists and bands playing their own material. That to me is a million times more interesting. It's new songs for a start. It's people personally invested in their own music. It gets rid of the weakest part of these shows (in my eyes) which is the judge's influencing the progression of the artist and taking them away from their original self and into a notion of what the judge thinks they should be.
Sometimes a decent singer will come on with a bit of originality and then by week three they'll be belting out Adele and Beyonce like a thousand others, and usually in a terrible arrangement meant to give it some new spark. (The Gotye cover was horrendous in my opinion just for the arrangement and the Radiohead/opera crossover did not work at all. If they were going that route then let her sing Karma Police and actually highlight her singing a bit. Not bloody No Surprises which only works if the person singing it sounds is if they are completely broken emotionally! On an up tempo Saturday night talent show. Bizarre choice.) Let artists go their own way and they might occasionally do something interesting of their own accord and it might just have some spark of originality about it.
All just my opinion, but that's what forums are for.
Totally agree
So do I
I loved Emmanuel until Ricky got his paws on him (pr maybe it was the production crew) and turned him into something utterly forgettable - and made him sing some dire numbers which did nothing for his voice or his style. A Whiter Shade of Pale? Que?
I actually know and love opera but Lucy is just another nice little voice. Maybe they need another Katherine Jenkins? *eye roll*
Lucy is not La Scala. I wish her luck, but real opera singers graft and train for years. They do not come out of stage schools. Well, not as far as I know.
Exactly. None of the panel would ever have subjected themselves to such a thing. This year's best hopes lost to a bloke who, although deserving immense respect for his job and being a nice fellow, is going nowhere as a recording artiste. We just won't bother watching next year. Partly because of the facts that halfway decent acts always get booted out, but also as a protest against the BBC axing our preferred team for our favourite show, Top Gear.
I've thought for a long time that in general, cream will rise to the top, i.e., if you're good enough and you want it enough, you'll graft until you get there. Very occasionally, you might get someone like Susan Boyle who genuinely hasn't had the opportunities. So many winners, in the UK at least, just don't seem to want to work. Taking Sam Bailey as an example, if I genuinely thought it was my time to shine and I wanted to make it as a singer, I'd have made sure I couldn't get pregnant just when I'd won the show that would give me my opportunity. Clearly she didn't want it enough. Some others have won because they were adequate singers with a good back story that made people vote for them, but they couldn't compete in the music industry because they weren't good enough.
Stevie's a lovely guy, he sings quite nicely, he's got no personality, and he'll go the same way as the singing dustman, i.e. out the door. Cruel for him, but that's the way it is.
Yes I think The Voice in particular is a middle aged and older audience making middle aged and older decisions. I think you could say that for every one of the winners. X Factor has ridden the biggest wave of star creation and sales success because it took the base laid by the earlier one-offs like Pop Idol and masterfully spun/manipulated it to a fantastic height which couldn't fail to bring sales with it. Its fallen itself now but still has the tradition that people buy. People are quite happy to watch The Voice but very few of the quite decent audiences its achieved are prepared to turn votes and viewing into sales. I do hope Stevie manages to get a decent chart position because the show could really do with at least some kind of recognition. However people will still tune n next year-the public have decided they are not bothered whether it fails in the star creation stakes.
He was on BBC News this morning being interviewed and he mentioned releasing music but never getting anywhere in the past. I searched on iTunes and sure enough, an EP and two singles released in 2010 & 2011.
I wonder how many of the people who downloaded Lost Stars realised they could also buy other Stevie McCrorie tracks on iTunes?
It amazes me. They see the #1 on iTunes and probably browse the charts (probably scroll down to #30 before getting bored) but how many of these people actually search for music?
I'm with you here. My favourite was Lara, loved her voice and everything about her as that's the kind of music I listen to.
I also love opera, my dad was a classical singer so I've grown up with it. Lucy was a good singer and if she has her sights set on singing at the highest level I hope she perseveres with her training.
Most singers just can't write good music though (and a lot of good song-writers can't sing or perform that well).
Yes, there are some very talented exceptions, but for the most part the 'original' songs that have appeared on these shows have been pretty awful
And even the most famous 'singer/songwriters' have had help.
Sir Elton John, for example, 'penned' many popular music scores, but needed Bernie Taupin to write the words for him to put the music to.
Robbie Williams is also known as a singer/songwriter, but many of his biggest hits were co-written with Guy Chambers.
And so on.....
It's a lot to expect someone auditioning for The Voice to perform all their own material.
And look what happens when they go on to do this.
Leanne Mitchell spent so long writing for her album, she was virtually forgotten by the time she had finished!
Then just pick the exceptions. Or pick people for their songs rather than because they fit a pre-existing pop idea of what type of singer will sell the most records once put through the Cowell filter.
I think a show such as the one I mentioned would need to target both a different kind of audience and a different type of performer. It needn't just be a case of X Factor except with a singer songwriter twist. I mean, it could be, but that be completely crap. It would be like Simon Cowell and Louis Walsh picking the Mercury Prize winner.
It would be a completely different show from top to bottom.
I'm not expecting it to happen but I'm surprised no one has had a go at it - other than C4 in a very reduced format. I'm also not sure I like "good" singers, or what others call good singers. I like distinctive singers. I like singers who can convey an idea or emotion. I like singers who look as though they aren't trying to be a clone of someone else. I'm not too fussy about their range really. I'm not a fan of warblers or people who over-sing, if that makes sense.
Sounds like a nice idea (apart from there would be very few artists to take part...).
But do you really think that the BBC (or ITV come to that) would risk airing a show on those lines on a Saturday evening?
Sadly, the biggest factor here is ratings and they wouldn't take that risk.
No I don't think they would because they have a formula that works (makes cash) and that's about as far as their ambitions lie, but I thought they might about ten years ago. Maybe not Saturday night but certainly on some level. C4 did try but it wasn't the best constructed idea either.
I think there are a lot of talented and unsigned bands and singer songwriters out there. I don't think they'd go on a tv talent show (on the most part), or at least not without serious reservations about it artistically because X Factor and such shows have defined in our minds and theirs what such a show is about. Done correctly, I think a show such as I'm imagining could be very successful, both in terms of ratings and in terms of developing artists.
But there is no reason why a tv show couldn't attempt to scout around and find the best upcoming bands in the country and showcase that. Every band or artist was an up and coming unsigned act once who was looking for a contract and we aren't short on talent. The difficulty would be making a show credible enough to attract that talent. X Factor and the similar shows have eroded that currently so such a thing seems hard to imagine.