I did not say Tom would have won under the old format - I simply said Tom deserved to win under the new format.
Yes Lord Sugar made it quite clear that under the old format Helen was a formidable candidate - and a probable shoo in for a six figure job within his organisation - and in answer to your question, yes I did watch the LS/Dara interview and I can't understand why we are judging Tom on past formats.
Tom is an inventor, an Ideas man - Helen is not. Helen's talents lie in organisation and getting things done - Tom's do not. This year LS was looking for the business flair to form a productive partnership. Tom showed that flair - Helen didn't.
Helen's business plan was a disaster - and bringing business plan no.2 into the mix after Claude, Margaret, Mike and Matthew had already completed their interviews was surely too little - too late.
The innovation and creation of a concept that captures the public interest and brings the product to the mass market is a rare skill; organisational skills though valuable, lack rarity.
Tom winning isn't the issue. In those circumstances any idea - even an old nail file - beats no other business plan that works. The issue is whether the new format makes any sense, or is related to what the show shows, or is fair.
Its not at all clear that it makes sense. The winner in this case isn't decided by a business plan or show performance - its decided by a saleable invention that existed pre the show starting. Tom's business plan makes even less sense than anyone elses. Tom's chair testing service is ridiculed and binned within minutes by Lord Sugar - wheras Susan has a concept that works, but not on that scale and Jim and Helen have basic ideas that others have run with - but with no detail or hope of success. Its not at all clear that any candidates will ever be able to produce a business plan for a new business that holds up without already having done it.
Its pretty clear that that ending has little to do with the show. The winning nail file and Tom's other inventions never appear on the show . Tom's historically weak performancee on the show tasks doesn't matter. The interviews and business plans also don't matter- except as a way of eliminating everyone else.
Its pretty doubtful too if the result is fair. There's not a level playing field at the start because at least two people with businesses are going to be revealed as having suitable ideas to invest in as soon as their CVs are opened. The others do not look as promising from day one. Other people then go as they are judged on the task, while it looks like some people stay because of whats in their CV. Indeed, showing weaknesses on the tasks, for the winner, becomes a reason why he needs Lord Sugar to make the difference. Meanwhile other people, who might have a decent idea for the business plan stage, go because they fail marginally at tasks, and the people who do show the qualities tested by the tasks, fail because they can't come up with an idea to beat an existing product.
As it is, it seems almost inevitable that someone with an existing idea or business will win - as its too difficult to test and prove a new idea. If you then add on Lord Sugar's preference for a product, and take out he products that would need more than 250k fundng, there's not actually much of a competition left under the new format.
As it is, it seems almost inevitable that someone with an existing idea or business will win - as its too difficult to test and prove a new idea. If you then add on Lord Sugar's preference for a product, and take out he products that would need more than 250k fundng, there's not actually much of a competition left under the new format.
The issue of scaleability comes up repeatedly on Dragons Den. If the cottage business is too small the returns would not be worth the dragons' valuable time. If the scale is too ambitious, the dragons would want to know more and be very very sure of success before investing, say a million pounds. Perfectly good business models are therefore let go regularly because they fit the cottage industrialist, not the dragon. The proposal had to be bite-size.
It looked as if Susan's £million profit projection within a year was too hairy and requiring much more than £250K upfront. Helen's concierge service looked too labour-intensive with doubtful rewards. Tom's nail file was already proven and available, except that Tom had lost appetitie in marketing it, and maybe never had enough pazazz. .
Not looking for the best taylor-made in the future, just the least unsuited ready-to-wear in the present.
I am answering the question asked by the OP. Tom would NOT have won under the old format. Lord Sugar himself said he would have hired Helen.
I can't understand why some are saying Tom would have won. Did you not watch LS's after show interview with Dara?
Its isn't, and has never been, a first past the post competition.
Despite what he said, I very much doubt that LS would have hired Helen under the old format. . For example, he didnt hire Ruth or Christina.
He hires who he wants to work with and he goes with his intincts. He has no use for Helen as he already has an (excellent according to him) assisstant.
So, I suspect it would still have been Tom.
Its isn't, and has never been, a first past the post competition.
Despite what he said, I very much doubt that LS would have hired Helen under the old format. . For example, he didnt hire Ruth or Christina.
He hires who he wants to work with and he goes with his intincts. He has no use for Helen as he already has an (excellent according to him) assisstant.
So, I suspect it would still have been Tom.
I very much doubt it. Tom's merit in 2011 is that he comes with a saleable idea - and he may throw out more if you wade through the nonsense ones. The fact that he's almost completely incompetent ,doesn't matter this once as Lord Sugar can appoint someone to manage and present the business, drive strategy himself, and just take ideas from Tom.
If you put Tom into a pre 2011 year, or with a pre 2011 like concern to run, he's a non starter in the winning stakes as he's shown he can't reliably lead, manage, present, negotiate or sell ,or stick to the point. Its difficult to see any niche audience he will be picked to appeal to either, as some winners were.
if its not Tom , Lord Sugar's got a real dilemna who wins . Helen looks a lot like Kate, Liz, Miriam or Kristina and he's got a past record of often not picking the very competent (or the very forceful) females -his problem though is that Helen has a better record still, so he may have to hire her. Susan's story fits well with parts of his series 2, 4, 6 and 7 winner's stories, but she's young and riskier, and in need of more supervision to actually run something for him. Things change though as, in a normal series, Lord Sugar will have to get rid of Tom, rather than keep him regardless. Someone else will stay - certainly in the week Tom is PM and shows he couldn't manage in any Sugar company, if not before. If Tom goes, there's not only someone else in the last 4, but the personnel and roles change for some of the later tasks, so their records may change too. Depending on the job on offer, other people who have run a company on their own might just have ended up looking like a Stella or a Yasmina. He's still got to explain not taking Helen though - and thats not going to be that convincing unless someone else does something very special after Tom goes.
Comments
Tom winning isn't the issue. In those circumstances any idea - even an old nail file - beats no other business plan that works. The issue is whether the new format makes any sense, or is related to what the show shows, or is fair.
Its not at all clear that it makes sense. The winner in this case isn't decided by a business plan or show performance - its decided by a saleable invention that existed pre the show starting. Tom's business plan makes even less sense than anyone elses. Tom's chair testing service is ridiculed and binned within minutes by Lord Sugar - wheras Susan has a concept that works, but not on that scale and Jim and Helen have basic ideas that others have run with - but with no detail or hope of success. Its not at all clear that any candidates will ever be able to produce a business plan for a new business that holds up without already having done it.
Its pretty clear that that ending has little to do with the show. The winning nail file and Tom's other inventions never appear on the show . Tom's historically weak performancee on the show tasks doesn't matter. The interviews and business plans also don't matter- except as a way of eliminating everyone else.
Its pretty doubtful too if the result is fair. There's not a level playing field at the start because at least two people with businesses are going to be revealed as having suitable ideas to invest in as soon as their CVs are opened. The others do not look as promising from day one. Other people then go as they are judged on the task, while it looks like some people stay because of whats in their CV. Indeed, showing weaknesses on the tasks, for the winner, becomes a reason why he needs Lord Sugar to make the difference. Meanwhile other people, who might have a decent idea for the business plan stage, go because they fail marginally at tasks, and the people who do show the qualities tested by the tasks, fail because they can't come up with an idea to beat an existing product.
As it is, it seems almost inevitable that someone with an existing idea or business will win - as its too difficult to test and prove a new idea. If you then add on Lord Sugar's preference for a product, and take out he products that would need more than 250k fundng, there's not actually much of a competition left under the new format.
The issue of scaleability comes up repeatedly on Dragons Den. If the cottage business is too small the returns would not be worth the dragons' valuable time. If the scale is too ambitious, the dragons would want to know more and be very very sure of success before investing, say a million pounds. Perfectly good business models are therefore let go regularly because they fit the cottage industrialist, not the dragon. The proposal had to be bite-size.
It looked as if Susan's £million profit projection within a year was too hairy and requiring much more than £250K upfront. Helen's concierge service looked too labour-intensive with doubtful rewards. Tom's nail file was already proven and available, except that Tom had lost appetitie in marketing it, and maybe never had enough pazazz.
Not looking for the best taylor-made in the future, just the least unsuited ready-to-wear in the present.
Its isn't, and has never been, a first past the post competition.
Despite what he said, I very much doubt that LS would have hired Helen under the old format. . For example, he didnt hire Ruth or Christina.
He hires who he wants to work with and he goes with his intincts. He has no use for Helen as he already has an (excellent according to him) assisstant.
So, I suspect it would still have been Tom.
I very much doubt it. Tom's merit in 2011 is that he comes with a saleable idea - and he may throw out more if you wade through the nonsense ones. The fact that he's almost completely incompetent ,doesn't matter this once as Lord Sugar can appoint someone to manage and present the business, drive strategy himself, and just take ideas from Tom.
If you put Tom into a pre 2011 year, or with a pre 2011 like concern to run, he's a non starter in the winning stakes as he's shown he can't reliably lead, manage, present, negotiate or sell ,or stick to the point. Its difficult to see any niche audience he will be picked to appeal to either, as some winners were.
if its not Tom , Lord Sugar's got a real dilemna who wins . Helen looks a lot like Kate, Liz, Miriam or Kristina and he's got a past record of often not picking the very competent (or the very forceful) females -his problem though is that Helen has a better record still, so he may have to hire her. Susan's story fits well with parts of his series 2, 4, 6 and 7 winner's stories, but she's young and riskier, and in need of more supervision to actually run something for him. Things change though as, in a normal series, Lord Sugar will have to get rid of Tom, rather than keep him regardless. Someone else will stay - certainly in the week Tom is PM and shows he couldn't manage in any Sugar company, if not before. If Tom goes, there's not only someone else in the last 4, but the personnel and roles change for some of the later tasks, so their records may change too. Depending on the job on offer, other people who have run a company on their own might just have ended up looking like a Stella or a Yasmina. He's still got to explain not taking Helen though - and thats not going to be that convincing unless someone else does something very special after Tom goes.