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Nationwide Freeview retune event in Autumn 2009 (Merged)

Ray CathodeRay Cathode Posts: 13,231
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in Freeview #1
There will be a nationwide retune event in the autumn as Five moves from Mux A in pre-switchover areas and from Mux B in areas that have switched over to Mux 2. The BBC will be clearing Mux B for HD use by 2 Dec 2009 and will also be moving its services to other multiplexes. Channel 4 and ITV will also be moving some of their services around.
Freeview Autumn Re-tune (Date to be confirmed)

Details are emerging of a UK wide Autumn 2009 re-tune event led by Freeview and the public service broadcasters. As it is not a switchover, this event does not involve a move to 8K based high power transmissions.

Every UK home with a Freeview TV or box (including BT Vision and Top Up TV recorders) will need to re-tune to continue to receive Channel Five and other services that will move from their current multiplex location to another.

The re-tune will also pave the way for Five to become as widely available as the other terrestrial channels at digital television switchover. Freeview homes that have already completed switchover will need to re-tune.

At the same time, services will vacate the BBC-B mux to help prepare for the future launch of Freeview HD. The date is still to be confirmed.

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/34926/Installer_Newsletter_Kilvey_Hill__1_month_out_FINAL_24_July_09.pdf
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    a516a516 Posts: 5,241
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    #2
    I like the way that piece of information is hidden away on an installers' newsletter (although highly anticipated). However, with S4C moving muxes, it's about time we heard when Five would be moving muxes.
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    Ray CathodeRay Cathode Posts: 13,231
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    #3
    a516 wrote: »
    I like the way that piece of information is hidden away on an installers' newsletter (although highly anticipated). However, with S4C moving muxes, it's about time we heard when Five would be moving muxes.

    9th September would make sense, maybe Quest will launch as well. :D:D
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    Ray CathodeRay Cathode Posts: 13,231
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    #4
    On reflection if BBC services are vacating Mux B nationwide in the autumn, their main destination can only be Mux 1, and so Mux 1 will have to switch to 64QAM with poorer reception on existing low power.

    I am surprised about this and would have thought a region by region change at DSO would be more efficient, not a nationwide one. :D:D
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    AngusMastAngusMast Posts: 5,153
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    #5
    I think it means that when Granada gets HD, they won't have News Multiscreen, so everyone must lose it. And BBC Parliament is moving to Multiplex 2 (isn't it?) - so that's 2 services vacating BBC-B. They didn't say ALL services would be vacating.
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    CharnhamCharnham Posts: 61,397
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    #6
    I am not looking forward to this
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 25
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    #7
    Had me a little worried that this was a pre-DSO move to 8K until I read through this thread; I get my Freeview via two former ON Digital boxes which I'm not intending to replace until they become doorstops in 2011. By the time analogue broadcasting finally ceases from Emley Moor they'll have given me almost ten years of sterling service, which considering I never subscribed to ON and got both secondhand after the company went under isn't bad by anyone's standards. Unfortunately the same can't be said for the 2006 Sagem that was just out of warranty when it was killed by the split-NIT last year; I wonder if whatever I replace the ON boxes (a Pioneer and a Phillips) with will still be going strong in 2022.
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 284
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    #8
    Whoever planned all this must have the organisational power of a gnat.
    We already have THREE re-scans in three months as part of DSO.
    http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1053216
    Now they're adding a fourth.
    It's a pain in the neck for me with three digital TVs/boxes. Then there's the elderly neighbour who doesn't know what a rescan is and has to have it done for her.
    How come other countries have done DSO in one overnight hit?
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    John259John259 Posts: 28,483
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    #9
    As I understand it we're not talking about muxes moving UHF channels here, only LCN changes being made within the muxes. It's a great pity that so much Freeview equipment doesn't detect these frequent changes automatically. As a result many people do full UHF rescans and often lose muxes or get duplicates from more than one transmitter.

    John
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    BreizhBreizh Posts: 307
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    #10
    mcdavey wrote: »
    We already have THREE re-scans in three months as part of DSO.
    Then there's the elderly neighbour who doesn't know what a rescan is and has to have it done for her.
    Entirely agree. I was shocked to see an installer advertising help for the elderly with these switchovers charging 40 quid a go. Wonder he hasn't offered a three for £100 deal. What makes it worse is it is presented as an official Freeview service by the store concerned.
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    soulboy77soulboy77 Posts: 24,494
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    #11
    Winston_1 wrote: »
    So, what's new? To keep up with the ever changing channel plan I seem to have to retune about every three weeks anyway. Ah yes, one of the major channels is involved this time.
    Yes, re-tunes have become a way of life. Serves me right for having so many Freeview devices in the house!
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    NightdeamonNightdeamon Posts: 3,808
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    #12
    This retune wont involve channel number changes will it?
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    John259John259 Posts: 28,483
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    #13
    Nightdeamon wrote: »
    This retune wont involve channel number changes will it?
    As I understand it (correct me please if I'm wrong) it only involves some Freeview logical channels moving from one mux to another mux. However, I woudn't be surprised if some had their LCN numbers changed at the same time. AFAIK I don't think any muxes are changing UHF channel numbers.

    John
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    NightdeamonNightdeamon Posts: 3,808
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    #14
    John259 wrote: »
    As I understand it (correct me please if I'm wrong) it only involves some Freeview logical channels moving from one mux to another mux. However, I woudn't be surprised if some had their LCN numbers changed at the same time. AFAIK I don't think any muxes are changing UHF channel numbers.

    John

    That's what I thought but the DTT EPG is in desperate need of a reshuffle.
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    nwhitfieldnwhitfield Posts: 4,556
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    #15
    mcdavey wrote: »
    How come other countries have done DSO in one overnight hit?

    The only one that I can think of is the Netherlands, where the population of the whole country is a fraction that of the UK, the country is so flat it only needs a handful of transmitters, and cable TV penetration is over 90%.

    So, hardly comparable, is it?
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,930
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    #16
    John259 wrote: »
    As I understand it we're not talking about muxes moving UHF channels here, only LCN changes being made within the muxes. It's a great pity that so much Freeview equipment doesn't detect these frequent changes automatically. As a result many people do full UHF rescans and often lose muxes or get duplicates from more than one transmitter.

    It's insane that people don't make boxes that update automatically. Sky have been doing it for over ten years. It should be standard across the board
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    derk weaselderk weasel Posts: 936
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    #17
    does anyone know of the actuall date of the retune?
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    gomezzgomezz Posts: 44,633
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    #18
    mangadongle wrote: »
    It's insane that people don't make boxes that update automatically. Sky have been doing it for over ten years. It should be standard across the board
    It would be insane if they did given the many makes and models running different firmwares and the many channel change cock ups there have been down the years. Sky has a controlled environment so not really comparable.
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,930
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    #19
    Why would it be insane? it's simple and many boxes already do it - my Humax certainly does. You do a daily scan for channel changes. The box takes the revised data and updates itself. Sorted!
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    pburke90pburke90 Posts: 14,758
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    #20
    Well, if it moves any ITV or C4 channels from their current location to other MUX's then that is fine with me, as the ITV/C4 MUX is the only one that I can't receive properly here, the rest come in perfectly.
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    soulboy77soulboy77 Posts: 24,494
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    #21
    Nightdeamon wrote: »
    That's what I thought but the DTT EPG is in desperate need of a reshuffle.
    We all recognise this but DMOL seem to be taking a totally intransigent position in going about organising one. The recent LCN shuffle up was a missed opportunity to create a separate section for shopping/ gambling/ phone-a-tart channels at the very least.
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    NightdeamonNightdeamon Posts: 3,808
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    #22
    mangadongle wrote: »
    Why would it be insane? it's simple and many boxes already do it - my Humax certainly does. You do a daily scan for channel changes. The box takes the revised data and updates itself. Sorted!

    My LG TV does it as well but my TUTV box doesn't it only updates TUTV channels automatically.
    soulboy77 wrote: »
    We all recognise this but DMOL seem to be taking a totally intransigent position in going about organising one. The recent LCN shuffle up was a missed opportunity to create a separate section for shopping/ gambling/ phone-a-tart channels at the very least.

    i know Id like them to move the music and shopping channels and give priority to E4, ITV4, Fiver, Five USA and if it launches Quest
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    mossy2103mossy2103 Posts: 84,308
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    #23
    mangadongle wrote: »
    Why would it be insane? it's simple and many boxes already do it - my Humax certainly does. You do a daily scan for channel changes. The box takes the revised data and updates itself. Sorted!
    But your Humax is running a firmware that can do that, the point made earlier was that there are many boxes out there, all with widely differing platforms, many firmwares written by many different manufacturers to run on those many boxes, some firmwares are good, others are pretty basic. Sky could control the manufacturer base, and therefore the firmware.
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    John259John259 Posts: 28,483
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    #24
    Perhaps we need a British Standard for Freeview equipment. Here's a list of some of the things which most equipment now on sale fails to do, despite the digital tick scheme:
    Recognise LCN changes within muxes automatically.
    Separate mux rescans from UHF rescans.
    Handle MHEG text so as to give a performance at least to the same quality as analogue text.
    Deal with reception from multiple transmitters properly.

    John
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    linkinpark875linkinpark875 Posts: 29,703
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    #25
    So am I right in saying the mux with BBC Four will close down to make way for 4 HD services? And the one with BBC Three will change transmission to accommodate the moved channels?
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