Problem with friends' beliefs.
Like The Vixen I am too afraid to put this on the General Discussion forum for fear of being shouted down.
Recently my husband and I joined a local club, our old one having closed down. We soon made a lot of friends and found the members and staff to be very welcoming and always pleased to see us. We usually go there twice a week and have become friends with several other couples who welcomed us into their existing group. We all get on very well as we have the same sense of humour and are roughly the same age. They are much better off than us but this doesn't seem to matter although sometimes feel envious of their nice clothes and jewellry.
This is my problem. I soon discovered that these people have opinions I do not agree with including racism,homophobia and a general dislike of poor people especially the ones on benefits. I have heard opinions that would make Hitler blush and I cannot believe that people in this day and age can be so bigotted and ignorant. I have to have my say but I am either shouted down or laughed at for being naive. My husband says I should not argue with them but I feel if I say nothing then I am colluding with them.
Should I ignore them when they say things that are so vile. The racism is especialy nasty. Is it possible to be friends with people who's opinions you despise?
Recently my husband and I joined a local club, our old one having closed down. We soon made a lot of friends and found the members and staff to be very welcoming and always pleased to see us. We usually go there twice a week and have become friends with several other couples who welcomed us into their existing group. We all get on very well as we have the same sense of humour and are roughly the same age. They are much better off than us but this doesn't seem to matter although sometimes feel envious of their nice clothes and jewellry.
This is my problem. I soon discovered that these people have opinions I do not agree with including racism,homophobia and a general dislike of poor people especially the ones on benefits. I have heard opinions that would make Hitler blush and I cannot believe that people in this day and age can be so bigotted and ignorant. I have to have my say but I am either shouted down or laughed at for being naive. My husband says I should not argue with them but I feel if I say nothing then I am colluding with them.
Should I ignore them when they say things that are so vile. The racism is especialy nasty. Is it possible to be friends with people who's opinions you despise?
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Comments
Are you sure you want them as friends? They sound more like a social convenience - someone to hang around with for the want of real friends.
In our office, there is lots of banter that to an outsider could be taken as highly offensive to several minority groups but it is always done with humour and no one means any actual harm by it (for example - i am the only woman there and i requently get told i should be the one making the tea as its a womans job - this could be taken as sexist but it isnt said that way and not taken that way by me).
You need to decide if they are actually serious with what they are saying. I dont think i could be friends with people who are racist / sexist etc but i can put up with people who may say the odd sexist or racist comment as a joke? if you understand what i'm saying
I don't have friends who are homophobic or racist - if I knew someone held those views they wouldn't get beyond being mere acquaintances.
The world's a big place and there are plenty of people who have views just like yours. You just need to meet them. Forget going to this 'club and maybe you and your husband can find other interests or others to associate with in the club.
Why not go on a course on a subject you enjoy or maybe volunteering in a hospital? You'll meet people who are on your wavelength and wont feel soiled every time you associate with them. You can invite them to your club and start building a new set of friends who share your views.
It's healthy to have different opinions and viewpoints between friends - I have a couple whose politics are diamentrically opposite to mine, but who are very good people. But when fundamental values are very diffferent, I think real friendship, as opposed to having a swift pint with, is almost impossible.
It looks like I'm going to be in the minority here but yes, I do think it's possible to be friends with someone who has a massive disparity in their belief system to yourself...
My father was a terrible racist... I considered his opinion to be totally abhorrent... I still loved the man *despite* the polar differences in the way we thought...
I have a friend atm who is a Jehovah's Witness... My husband is a transplant recipient and I have ingrained beliefs about children/transfusions etc that make this chap want to choke... He's perfectly entitled to his (imo misguided) beliefs but we respect each other's opinion enough to steer clear of the subject...
To thine ownself be true is a rather good policy to keep hold of I think... If your new friends and you have other common grounds which entertain each other then fine - just have enough respect to avoid those subjects which the other finds unacceptable...
If they can't/won't accept that you have a differing moral code or belief system and respect that then I think that issue, for me, would be signal that this friendship wasn't worth pursuing... Debate is fine - shouting down and belittling someone isn't...
Yes I have a few friends and family with views I hate, I just dont engage with them on those subjects.
Not really...plenty of family separations occur due to arguments or differing opinions or judgemental attitudes...
I personally don't give a flying monkey's what anyone thinks of me or presumes my opinions to be...
I don't walk down the street with a label stating that I'm not racist or homophobic etc so my opinions stay mine until or unless I choose to divulge them... If someone wants to try and judge me based on the company that I sometimes keep then they can just kick on...
Lilith I feel for you. I too have had a very similar problem. It was in an activity group from meetup.com, where after some time everyone wanted to get closer - but they were exactly like your friends sound.
These people do not sound like friends. They do not sound like friendly people. They do not sound safe to be around. Make your excuses or say it outright, but detatch from them for once and for all - that's my advice.
You deserve far better than this. I assume their hate-filled remarks are directed at other friends of yours and perhaps family members? What about if you got disabled,or your husband did and you had to become his carer, and so you had to go on benefits? Do you get where I'm coming from? They may be ok for a laugh and banter now but when are they going to start picking on you because of their bigoted hate, what will friends and family feel about you if they knew you were good friends with people hostile towards them, and do you really think it's worth investing in people who may well let you down or hurt you in the future?
You say you're rather poor now - I don't mean to upset you but how do you know they're not putting the knife in already, talking about you behind your back?
Run!
I would not want to be friends with someone who judge me on who im friends with or anything else for that matter.
Speaking generally, they're entitled to their opinions, and the OP is entitled to hers. Each is entitled to argue their views; maybe they just enjoy being seen to be totally non-PC.
Apart from the "shouting down" or "laughing"; that's very bad manners.
Personally, I'd have thought that a club where everyone thought exactly the same would be pretty boring.
For some people, it is possible. Personally, I'd rather be totally friendless than be with people like that. Just personal taste.
It's funny really, because if I met him tomorrow and he talked like that, I'd just turn around and make a mental note to avoid him. But because we know him and know that he can be ok, you cut him some slack and just laugh it off. It's weird, I can't explain it.
Then again, I have a friend who I debate politics and religion with 'til the cows come home. We are polar opposites but it does not get in the way of our friendship.
Only you can really decide if this is a "friendship breaker" for you.
Put a contract out on them.
Sounds like the Ku Klux Klan.
OP, does your club have a distinctive uniform?
Have your say!
Disagreeing with someones opinion is one thing......despising the opinions is quite another. If I felt as strongly as that, then there is no way I would want them as a friend.
In additon, the OP has not defined what she means by homophobic or racist. Is she saying they want to hang these parties, or are they just telling jokes she takes offense at, or are they merely using terms she disapproves of ( remember the 'niggling/ Queer Street thread here on DS)?
Perhaps the 'shouting down' is caused by annoyance at being lectured or being faced with humourlessness? Is the OP just a tad self righteous?
Or perhaps these people really are card carrying membership of the BNP?
If the latter, what on earth are you doing in their company?
If not, it really is time to evaluate what is being said and how serious it is and whether you are over reacting and cannot cope with opinions which deviate from your own.