He indicated that all muslim women are terrorists. I'm assuming all/a lot of muslim women wear a headscarf.
It might also be men, they were scarves too. Come to think of it it might mean Batman too or Spider-Man they were a kind if headgear too lol
Don't you see it's all could be our interpretation too.
About Rons comment.
Its about stereotyping,the type that breeds hatred and division.
It would have been as bad if he said something to stereotype any culture,religion,ethniticity,sexuality,or disabilty .
These things are what people stereotype to build up a division and that breeds hatred..surely its fair enough for a TV show to deem such stereotyping as unnaceptable behaviour.
I hate political correctness but I am a supporter of stopping the type of stereotyping that singles other human beings out as less than human,or less valuable to society.
When someones offended by every little thing then it becomes ridiculous but as a society is it not fair that we stop hatred of others simply because we dress a certain way or hold certain religious belifs,or have darker skin.
There is a line to be drawn obviously,and charlottes crude language should not fall into or be compared to the comment ron made.
I couldn't believe what he was inferring! Is he just plain thick!
He wasn't inferring anything. He may have been implying something but he couldn't have been inferring.
Inference is the interpretation a listener takes from a phrase or remark. It is the concept they end up with having filtered a set of sounds though their own mind set.
For sure the speaker may intend them to take it that way - that would be an implication.
Sorry I don't normally do pedantic on here but in this case it really is pertinent to the debate. The whole discussion from last night is based on what we as listeners have inferred since the comments themselves were not overt.
If someone says something and the listener filters it through their own experience and makes a logical assumption based on something(s) they believe or assume to be true, the listener has inferred the point. That does not necessarily mean the speaker was implying it.
Mrs Danger,what Ron said was really offensive and he deserved the warning he received.
Think about the thought processes he had just seeing a lady with a towel on her head and what it prompted him to say. It wouldn't even occur to me to think that way.
I personally just want Ron out the door now. He depresses me.
I personally don't have much issue with either of the remarks that resulted in formal warnings, because for me, it is all about whether malice or intent are involved. Ron is a harmless silly old duffer, brought up against the background of tv like Love Thy Neighbour and Till Death Do Us Part. Carol was just gossiping - her intent was to make Ron look bad, not black people.
I can just give a wry shrug and do a bit of an eye roll at that sort of thing.
What I do have a big issue with is BB/Channel 5's clear incitement to stir up tensions, (both in the house and amongst the viewing public), by showing these incidents and making big melodramas out of them with their false outrage. If they didn't like it, they could simply have not included it in the edit. But they know that things like this do stir up trouble and get people talking, which in turn increases ratings - the only thing C5 are interested in.
Pathetic, but you only have to look at the number of threads on here to see what a successful tactic it is and how we are being manipulated into working ourselves up into a self-righteous lather about it all. :rolleyes:
He wasn't inferring anything. He may have been implying something but he couldn't have been inferring.
Inference is the interpretation a listener takes from a phrase or remark. It is the concept they end up with having filtered a set of sounds though their own mind set.
For sure the speaker may intend them to take it that way - that would be an implication.
Sorry I don't normally do pedantic on here but in this case it really is pertinent to the debate. The whole discussion from last night is based on what we as listeners have inferred since the comments themselves were not overt.
If someone says something and the listener filters it through their own experience and makes a logical assumption based on something(s) they believe or assume to be true, the listener has inferred the point. That does not necessarily mean the speaker was implying it.
Mrs Danger,what Ron said was really offensive and he deserved the warning he received.
Think about the thought processes he had just seeing a lady with a towel on her head and what it prompted him to say. It wouldn't even occur to me to think that way.
I personally just want Ron out the door now. He depresses me.
I'm just amazed that he seems to have learned nothing at all from his last experience.
Though to be honest, An's post did tell me something I didn't know
Well I'm not bragging or anything, but I did know that. It's just that I'd never have been able to explain it quite so superbly. Well done An Thropologist
brought up against the background of tv like Love Thy Neighbour and Till Death Do Us Part.
Funny thing is those shows were made to show racists up for the idiots they really are
Warren Mitchell (Alf) tells this story about how he once met a bigot in a pub ad he said to him "I love the way you make fun of those (N word)" and Warren replied "Don't you get it I'm not making fun of them I'm making fun of idiots like you"
Thats what his true thoughts and feelings are,it would be difficult to hide all day every day as in the BB house.
I don't want a gentleman who thinks like that but conceals it for fear of reprimand in the house tbh.
I honestly really cannot get over the fact that he's been a public figure for so long, been reprimanded in the past, and still hasn't learned anything about offending people. It's beyond comprehension, especially at his age.
Funny thing is those shows were made to show racists up for the idiots they really are
Warren Mitchell (Alf) tells this story about how he once met a bigot in a pub ad he said to him "I love the way you make fun of those (N word)" and Warren replied "Don't you get it I'm not making fun of them I'm making fun of idiots like you"
I know, same with Love Thy Neighbour. Bill the neighbour was shown as better educated and more sophisticated than Eddie, (but also quite capable of being as childish as Eddie, whom he usually called either 'Honky' or 'Snowflake'). Point is it was done with great humour - LTN had 7 series. Programmes like that took the pee out of bigots and racists, and made everybody laugh at the same time.
I find it sad that not a trace of humour is allowed any more on mainstream tv when it comes to 'issues'.
Mrs Danger,what Ron said was really offensive and he deserved the warning he received.
Think about the thought processes he had just seeing a lady with a towel on her head and what it prompted him to say. It wouldn't even occur to me to think that way.
I personally just want Ron out the door now. He depresses me.
But to be fair Madame Kitty, I don't believe there was any thought process involved. It was just a spur of the moment back handed comment ...... and as Oldnjaded so clearly puts it (I stand in awe - I wish I could express myself with a mere fraction of clarity OJ can ) .... it's about whether or not IMHO whether any malice or intent were involved and I genuinely don't believe there was any of that.
I personally don't have much issue with either of the remarks that resulted in formal warnings, because for me, it is all about whether malice or intent are involved. Ron is a harmless silly old duffer, brought up against the background of tv like Love Thy Neighbour and Till Death Do Us Part. Carol was just gossiping - her intent was to make Ron look bad, not black people.
I can just give a wry shrug and do a bit of an eye roll at that sort of thing.
What I do have a big issue with is BB/Channel 5's clear incitement to stir up tensions, (both in the house and amongst the viewing public), by showing these incidents and making big melodramas out of them with their false outrage. If they didn't like it, they could simply have not included it in the edit. But they know that things like this do stir up trouble and get people talking, which in turn increases ratings - the only thing C5 are interested in.
Pathetic, but you only have to look at the number of threads on here to see what a successful tactic it is and how we are being manipulated into working ourselves up into a self-righteous lather about it all. :rolleyes:
So well put. There is a difference imo between meaningless words where no malice is actually intended, and actual action derived from hatred. Completely agree with your assessment of CH5's responsibilty here for creating what needn't be an issue
What could have been edited out and Ron given an informal warning has blossomed into a major issue. The 'joke' was deliberately screened purely for sensationalist purposes.
There are thousands of people out there just waiting to be offended, and Channel 5 did just that.
TBF If they did not show it they would be accused of hiding if it was mentioned later remember Jay and the trouble it cased when it was fond out they didn't air some of his worse moments
Carol could easily have said "Ron said the 'N' word, which then got him the sack". Saying the full word was obviously going to get her a warning. Black people are still going to find it offensive, even if she just repeated what Ron said. Saying this though, they blocked it out on the highlights show, so I don't know what they were talking about when they indicated that it was heard by viewers.
Im sorry but history is history - if you dont use words in a derogatory way or a racist way - the use of them to describe something that has happened can not be deemed racist or offensive.
If it is - then go rewrite every history book that mentions things like nazism, stalinism, kkk etc etc etc - there are so many things people find offensive that its ridiculous to warn someone for describing something that happened using a certain word
Racism sexism etc etc - is offensive because of the hatred/nastiness etc used in the context of words
Though to be honest, An's post did tell me something I didn't know
That's one of the little gems of these boards. If you choose to you, you can learn stuff. Yesterday I wrote in for a dig and someone came back and explained it should be infra dig from the Latin infra dignitatum - beneath one's dignity.
Then last night a very kind lady was explainign the differences between Niqab, Burkha etc to me.
If he'd said it to a stranger in the street it would be offensive. Unfortunately (for him) he was born and raised back in the days when a sense of humour was still allowed.
Im sorry but history is history - if you dont use words in a derogatory way or a racist way - the use of them to describe something that has happened can not be deemed racist or offensive.
If it is - then go rewrite every history book that mentions things like nazism, stalinism, kkk etc etc etc - there are so many things people find offensive that its ridiculous to warn someone for describing something that happened using a certain word
Racism sexism etc etc - is offensive because of the hatred/nastiness etc used in the context of words
Carol used a context that was not offensive
Quite right and if we lose sight of our history we are doomed to repeat it.
Carol could easily have said "Ron said the 'N' word, which then got him the sack". Saying the full word was obviously going to get her a warning. Black people are still going to find it offensive, even if she just repeated what Ron said. Saying this though, they blocked it out on the highlights show, so I don't know what they were talking about when they indicated that it was heard by viewers.
It was a farce. When Carol said the word it was bleeped out by BB, I didn't know what she had said. I only heard what the offensive word was when BB repeated it.
I sometimes feel as if I've woken in an alternative universe, the world is going loopy. :D
What could have been edited out and Ron given an informal warning has blossomed into a major issue. The 'joke' was deliberately screened purely for sensationalist purposes.
There are thousands of people out there just waiting to be offended, and Channel 5 did just that.
Comments
It might also be men, they were scarves too. Come to think of it it might mean Batman too or Spider-Man they were a kind if headgear too lol
Don't you see it's all could be our interpretation too.
Its about stereotyping,the type that breeds hatred and division.
It would have been as bad if he said something to stereotype any culture,religion,ethniticity,sexuality,or disabilty .
These things are what people stereotype to build up a division and that breeds hatred..surely its fair enough for a TV show to deem such stereotyping as unnaceptable behaviour.
I hate political correctness but I am a supporter of stopping the type of stereotyping that singles other human beings out as less than human,or less valuable to society.
When someones offended by every little thing then it becomes ridiculous but as a society is it not fair that we stop hatred of others simply because we dress a certain way or hold certain religious belifs,or have darker skin.
There is a line to be drawn obviously,and charlottes crude language should not fall into or be compared to the comment ron made.
He wasn't inferring anything. He may have been implying something but he couldn't have been inferring.
Inference is the interpretation a listener takes from a phrase or remark. It is the concept they end up with having filtered a set of sounds though their own mind set.
For sure the speaker may intend them to take it that way - that would be an implication.
Sorry I don't normally do pedantic on here but in this case it really is pertinent to the debate. The whole discussion from last night is based on what we as listeners have inferred since the comments themselves were not overt.
If someone says something and the listener filters it through their own experience and makes a logical assumption based on something(s) they believe or assume to be true, the listener has inferred the point. That does not necessarily mean the speaker was implying it.
Mrs Danger,what Ron said was really offensive and he deserved the warning he received.
Think about the thought processes he had just seeing a lady with a towel on her head and what it prompted him to say. It wouldn't even occur to me to think that way.
I personally just want Ron out the door now. He depresses me.
I can just give a wry shrug and do a bit of an eye roll at that sort of thing.
What I do have a big issue with is BB/Channel 5's clear incitement to stir up tensions, (both in the house and amongst the viewing public), by showing these incidents and making big melodramas out of them with their false outrage. If they didn't like it, they could simply have not included it in the edit. But they know that things like this do stir up trouble and get people talking, which in turn increases ratings - the only thing C5 are interested in.
Pathetic, but you only have to look at the number of threads on here to see what a successful tactic it is and how we are being manipulated into working ourselves up into a self-righteous lather about it all. :rolleyes:
Nice. I'm never going to play Scrabble with you.
I'm just amazed that he seems to have learned nothing at all from his last experience.
Me neither
Nor me
Though to be honest, An's post did tell me something I didn't know
Thats what his true thoughts and feelings are,it would be difficult to hide all day every day as in the BB house.
I don't want a gentleman who thinks like that but conceals it for fear of reprimand in the house tbh.
Well I'm not bragging or anything, but I did know that.
Funny thing is those shows were made to show racists up for the idiots they really are
Warren Mitchell (Alf) tells this story about how he once met a bigot in a pub ad he said to him "I love the way you make fun of those (N word)" and Warren replied "Don't you get it I'm not making fun of them I'm making fun of idiots like you"
I honestly really cannot get over the fact that he's been a public figure for so long, been reprimanded in the past, and still hasn't learned anything about offending people. It's beyond comprehension, especially at his age.
I know, same with Love Thy Neighbour. Bill the neighbour was shown as better educated and more sophisticated than Eddie, (but also quite capable of being as childish as Eddie, whom he usually called either 'Honky' or 'Snowflake'). Point is it was done with great humour - LTN had 7 series. Programmes like that took the pee out of bigots and racists, and made everybody laugh at the same time.
I find it sad that not a trace of humour is allowed any more on mainstream tv when it comes to 'issues'.
But to be fair Madame Kitty, I don't believe there was any thought process involved. It was just a spur of the moment back handed comment ...... and as Oldnjaded so clearly puts it (I stand in awe - I wish I could express myself with a mere fraction of clarity OJ can
So well put. There is a difference imo between meaningless words where no malice is actually intended, and actual action derived from hatred. Completely agree with your assessment of CH5's responsibilty here for creating what needn't be an issue
There are thousands of people out there just waiting to be offended, and Channel 5 did just that.
Im sorry but history is history - if you dont use words in a derogatory way or a racist way - the use of them to describe something that has happened can not be deemed racist or offensive.
If it is - then go rewrite every history book that mentions things like nazism, stalinism, kkk etc etc etc - there are so many things people find offensive that its ridiculous to warn someone for describing something that happened using a certain word
Racism sexism etc etc - is offensive because of the hatred/nastiness etc used in the context of words
Carol used a context that was not offensive
Woof.
That's one of the little gems of these boards. If you choose to you, you can learn stuff. Yesterday I wrote in for a dig and someone came back and explained it should be infra dig from the Latin infra dignitatum - beneath one's dignity.
Then last night a very kind lady was explainign the differences between Niqab, Burkha etc to me.
PS I am rubbish at scrabble
Quite right and if we lose sight of our history we are doomed to repeat it.
It was a farce. When Carol said the word it was bleeped out by BB, I didn't know what she had said. I only heard what the offensive word was when BB repeated it.
I sometimes feel as if I've woken in an alternative universe, the world is going loopy.
Lord McAlpine jokes.
Agreed.