Would pay if the inspector comes on but if they aren't collecting cant do anything about it
Exactly - between Darton and Meadowhall there is no ticket machine at either end, and there is rarely a ticket inspector on the train either, so unless you buy your ticket beforehand at either Barnsley or Sheffield, or purchase it online, it is impossible to pay for a ticket for the journey.
Exactly - between Darton and Meadowhall there is no ticket machine at either end, and there is rarely a ticket inspector on the train either, so unless you buy your ticket beforehand at either Barnsley or Sheffield, or purchase it online, it is impossible to pay for a ticket for the journey.
The vast majority of station do have ticket machines or permits to travel though, it's been a very long time since I've been on a station without one and I do often go to small unmanned stations.Note Meadowhall has a ticket office though it is not open all hours.
Most trains with stations where there are no ticket machines do have guards though often you have to search them out. How many trains don't have guards? (I thought they virtually all did as the unions insist but I could easily be wrong on that).
Who controls the doors on the line you are talking about? Is it the driver?
The vast majority of station do have ticket machines or permits to travel though, it's been a very long time since I've been on a station without one and I do often go to small unmanned stations.Note Meadowhall has a ticket office though it is not open all hours.
Most trains with stations where there are no ticket machines do have guards though often you have to search them out. How many trains don't have guards? (I thought they virtually all did as the unions insist but I could easily be wrong on that).
Who controls the doors on the line you are talking about? Is it the driver?
Right down here on the south coast there are some train stations near and around Margate that are like ghost stations, there is no one around. The ticket office is never open (well not when I go down there anyway) and more often than not the ticket machine is either broke or vandalised, I remember one week someone had thrown white paint over the screen so it was impossible to buy a ticket. I'm guessing you live in more built up areas where most stations are manned. When you look out your window and you see stations which look like they are derelict? there the types of ones that are not manned and its dead easy to jump on without paying.
I have bunked the train once in my life. It was my first year at university and I was going back home, arrived at the station in plenty of time to buy a ticket but the ticket office was closed (it was around 7pm). Patiently waited at the ticket machine with about 3 people in front of me and about 5 minutes till the train arrived, thought ok no problem. Each of the 3 people appeared to be complete idiots who took ages to figure out how to buy a ticket. By this time my train was approaching, and I knew if I missed this one the next wasn't for another half hour, and it was a cold and wet January evening. So I decided to just get on, knowing that there were no barriers at my home station, and very rarely any ticket inspectors on the train. I get back to my stop, and there are a horde of ticket inspectors waiting at 8pm on a Friday evening, naturally I got fined. Never done it again though!
I have bunked the train once in my life. It was my first year at university and I was going back home, arrived at the station in plenty of time to buy a ticket but the ticket office was closed (it was around 7pm). Patiently waited at the ticket machine with about 3 people in front of me and about 5 minutes till the train arrived, thought ok no problem. Each of the 3 people appeared to be complete idiots who took ages to figure out how to buy a ticket. By this time my train was approaching, and I knew if I missed this one the next wasn't for another half hour, and it was a cold and wet January evening. So I decided to just get on, knowing that there were no barriers at my home station, and very rarely any ticket inspectors on the train. I get back to my stop, and there are a horde of ticket inspectors waiting at 8pm on a Friday evening, naturally I got fined. Never done it again though!
Why did you get fined though? surely if you was going to pay for the ticket in the first place they would have let you off by letting you buy it at the other end?
I've never got caught and do take fare money with me to pay but often there is no offices open or machines out of order or not there but if I do get asked for a ticket on board I can pay there or when I get off at the other end. Seems strange that some people get fined even though they were going to pay albeit couldnt at the first part of their journey.
Why did you get fined though? surely if you was going to pay for the ticket in the first place they would have let you off by letting you buy it at the other end?
Because he boarded the train without a ticket where there was a working machine at the station.
The problem is "there was a queue" is an excuse used by people who simply want to chance paying.
Many times when I was younger not anymore though. It got difficult once they started putting barriers in and then they put them at Waterloo station so not a hope of bunking trains anymore.
Why did you get fined though? surely if you was going to pay for the ticket in the first place they would have let you off by letting you buy it at the other end?
I've never got caught and do take fare money with me to pay but often there is no offices open or machines out of order or not there but if I do get asked for a ticket on board I can pay there or when I get off at the other end. Seems strange that some people get fined even though they were going to pay albeit couldnt at the first part of their journey.
Because he boarded the train without a ticket where there was a working machine at the station.
The problem is "there was a queue" is an excuse used by people who simply want to chance paying.
Precisely what Empirical said, the guy was very apologetic and he understood the situation, said he appreciated my honesty but he still had to fine me. Lesson learned, my extra half hour was not worth the £20 (I think that's how much it was)
Right down here on the south coast there are some train stations near and around Margate that are like ghost stations, there is no one around. The ticket office is never open (well not when I go down there anyway) and more often than not the ticket machine is either broke or vandalised, I remember one week someone had thrown white paint over the screen so it was impossible to buy a ticket. I'm guessing you live in more built up areas where most stations are manned. When you look out your window and you see stations which look like they are derelict? there the types of ones that are not manned and its dead easy to jump on without paying.
I quite often go to/from unmanned stations, usually there is a ticket machine though that is not 100% and as you say they can be vandalised. However most trains especially those on lines with unmanned ticketless stations do have guards where you can buy your ticket.
Of course there are always exceptions but most case are where people are deliberately avoiding paying rather than couldn't.
I have bunked the train once in my life. It was my first year at university and I was going back home, arrived at the station in plenty of time to buy a ticket but the ticket office was closed (it was around 7pm). Patiently waited at the ticket machine with about 3 people in front of me and about 5 minutes till the train arrived, thought ok no problem. Each of the 3 people appeared to be complete idiots who took ages to figure out how to buy a ticket. By this time my train was approaching, and I knew if I missed this one the next wasn't for another half hour, and it was a cold and wet January evening. So I decided to just get on, knowing that there were no barriers at my home station, and very rarely any ticket inspectors on the train. I get back to my stop, and there are a horde of ticket inspectors waiting at 8pm on a Friday evening, naturally I got fined. Never done it again though!
We got on a train at a station that never had a ticket machine (it does now) so we got "permits to travel" instead, right next to the machine were instructions to buy a ticket either on the train or at the destination. The destination was the next stop (4 minutes) and the guard was at the other end of the train so we decided to pay at the destination because we knew that had a ticket office.
When we got to the destination there were a host of inspectors and we got fined £20 because they said we should have paid on the train even though we explained about the instructions. We went back to the station we got on at, took photos of the instructions and sent off our complaint. We got our fine back plus £20 worth of vouchers for our inconvenience.:)
Several times back in the day due to their being no one to give money to.
This was a mainline from London but there would be no one manning the ticket office when I got on (ticket machines were the stuff of science fiction then), no conductor showed up during the hour long journey and my home station would be just as devoid of staff.
So even if I had a burning desire to pay for my travel there was no way to do so.
Well I suppose I could of put cash in an envelope and slipped it under the shutter on the ticket booth...but since I didn't in fact have that burning desire I didn't.
Several times back in the day due to their being no one to give money to.
This was a mainline from London but there would be no one manning the ticket office when I got on (ticket machines were the stuff of science fiction then), no conductor showed up during the hour long journey and my home station would be just as devoid of staff.
So even if I had a burning desire to pay for my travel there was no way to do so.
Well I suppose I could of put cash in an envelope and slipped it under the shutter on the ticket booth...but since I didn't in fact have that burning desire I didn't.
If there is a guard on the train it is your responsibility to find them, you did have an hour long journey. Of course if there is no guard on the train at all then that is a different matter.
My responsibility to find him? But surely it's his job to check everyone on the train had a ticket, i.e. it's what he is paid to do?
If I exceed parking time, or don't have money for the parking meter, it's not my responsibility to go and find a traffic warden to tell him I don't have a ticket surely?
Anyway, as I didn't go and look for him at the time we shall never know if there was a guard present or not. However given that the train was generally only 4 - 6 carriages I would assume that he could have travelled from one end to the other at least once in an hour (if not more).
Who controls the doors on the line you are talking about? Is it the driver?
Presumably,
The train stops for a minute or so at Darton, at Wombwell, at Elsecar and at Meadowhall whilst people get on and off. As far as I know none of these have ticket machines but I've never got off at Wombwell or Elsecar so can't say for certain. The train also stops at Barnsley, which does have a ticket office and a ticket machine, but I wouldn't have time to get off there, buy a icket, and get back on the train before it had set off.
I imagine it is the driver checking that all doors are clear before closing them. If there is a ticket inspector then he never wanders up and down the train checking tickets.
So, maybe its wrong to say that there isn't a ticket inspector on the train, but it is right to say that he never actually inspects tickets.
My responsibility to find him? But surely it's his job to check everyone on the train had a ticket, i.e. it's what he is paid to do?
If I exceed parking time, or don't have money for the parking meter, it's not my responsibility to go and find a traffic warden to tell him I don't have a ticket surely?
Anyway, as I didn't go and look for him at the time we shall never know if there was a guard present or not. However given that the train was generally only 4 - 6 carriages I would assume that he could have travelled from one end to the other at least once in an hour (if not more).
True they should travel up and down the train however they don't always and it is still your responsibility to pay at the earliest possibility. If inspectors had boarded the train you would almost certainly have been required to pay a penalty fare and quite rightly so. You can't walk out of a shop with items just because you have to go wandering around the shop to find someone to take your money.
So, maybe its wrong to say that there isn't a ticket inspector on the train, but it is right to say that he never actually inspects tickets.
That sort of thing is really annoying, I often travel by train and go the whole journey without my ticket being checked. I know there is a guard on the trains I go on but they just sit in the middle of the train and operate the doors etc - they will sell you a ticket but you have to approach them.
I once got all the way from south east Wales to Manchester without paying. The train station I left from didn't have a ticket office.
I then made it from Preston back home to Wales again without paying, so got most of the journey for free. This was about fifteen years ago. I don't think I'd be tempted to try and get away with it these days.
So, maybe its wrong to say that there isn't a ticket inspector on the train, but it is right to say that he never actually inspects tickets.
Supermarket security staff rarely inspect receipts outside the door so does that mean you should go in and shoplift because you can probably get away with it? I think not.
Train "bunking" is just as illegal and just as immoral as shoplifting, except that the company concerned happens to provide services not goods. I've never done either.
Just commenting generally here, not suggesting that you yourself do any of this.
Just commenting generally here, not suggesting that you yourself do any of this.
If a ticket inspector made himself known to me - or even made himself visible so I'd know to be able to go up to him and ask to buy a ticket off him - then I'd happily do so. I don't try to get away with not buying a ticket - it's just next-to-impossible to be able to buy a ticket, and impossibl to find anyone at either station or on the train who will actually sell you one.
I have no idea if the ticket inspector exists or not - I've never actually seen him standing on the platform or peering out of the train door to ensure the doors are clear to know whether he actually lives at the front, the back or in the middle of the train.
It may indeed be just the driver who checks that the doors are clear before leaving the station, and I don't suppose he would take too kindly to people going into his little cockpit at the front of the train and asking for a single from Meadowhall to Darton at half past ten at night. He's driving a train, not selling tickets.
Presumably the majority of people who ride this train - and there aren't very many at this time of night - either get on where there is a ticket machine, get off where there is a ticket machine, or have a railcard anyway, it just so happens that I don't.
Comments
Exactly - between Darton and Meadowhall there is no ticket machine at either end, and there is rarely a ticket inspector on the train either, so unless you buy your ticket beforehand at either Barnsley or Sheffield, or purchase it online, it is impossible to pay for a ticket for the journey.
The vast majority of station do have ticket machines or permits to travel though, it's been a very long time since I've been on a station without one and I do often go to small unmanned stations.Note Meadowhall has a ticket office though it is not open all hours.
Most trains with stations where there are no ticket machines do have guards though often you have to search them out. How many trains don't have guards? (I thought they virtually all did as the unions insist but I could easily be wrong on that).
Who controls the doors on the line you are talking about? Is it the driver?
Right down here on the south coast there are some train stations near and around Margate that are like ghost stations, there is no one around. The ticket office is never open (well not when I go down there anyway) and more often than not the ticket machine is either broke or vandalised, I remember one week someone had thrown white paint over the screen so it was impossible to buy a ticket. I'm guessing you live in more built up areas where most stations are manned. When you look out your window and you see stations which look like they are derelict? there the types of ones that are not manned and its dead easy to jump on without paying.
Why did you get fined though? surely if you was going to pay for the ticket in the first place they would have let you off by letting you buy it at the other end?
I've never got caught and do take fare money with me to pay but often there is no offices open or machines out of order or not there but if I do get asked for a ticket on board I can pay there or when I get off at the other end. Seems strange that some people get fined even though they were going to pay albeit couldnt at the first part of their journey.
Because he boarded the train without a ticket where there was a working machine at the station.
The problem is "there was a queue" is an excuse used by people who simply want to chance paying.
Precisely what Empirical said, the guy was very apologetic and he understood the situation, said he appreciated my honesty but he still had to fine me. Lesson learned, my extra half hour was not worth the £20 (I think that's how much it was)
I quite often go to/from unmanned stations, usually there is a ticket machine though that is not 100% and as you say they can be vandalised. However most trains especially those on lines with unmanned ticketless stations do have guards where you can buy your ticket.
Of course there are always exceptions but most case are where people are deliberately avoiding paying rather than couldn't.
We got on a train at a station that never had a ticket machine (it does now) so we got "permits to travel" instead, right next to the machine were instructions to buy a ticket either on the train or at the destination. The destination was the next stop (4 minutes) and the guard was at the other end of the train so we decided to pay at the destination because we knew that had a ticket office.
When we got to the destination there were a host of inspectors and we got fined £20 because they said we should have paid on the train even though we explained about the instructions. We went back to the station we got on at, took photos of the instructions and sent off our complaint. We got our fine back plus £20 worth of vouchers for our inconvenience.:)
This was a mainline from London but there would be no one manning the ticket office when I got on (ticket machines were the stuff of science fiction then), no conductor showed up during the hour long journey and my home station would be just as devoid of staff.
So even if I had a burning desire to pay for my travel there was no way to do so.
Well I suppose I could of put cash in an envelope and slipped it under the shutter on the ticket booth...but since I didn't in fact have that burning desire I didn't.
If there is a guard on the train it is your responsibility to find them, you did have an hour long journey. Of course if there is no guard on the train at all then that is a different matter.
If I exceed parking time, or don't have money for the parking meter, it's not my responsibility to go and find a traffic warden to tell him I don't have a ticket surely?
Anyway, as I didn't go and look for him at the time we shall never know if there was a guard present or not. However given that the train was generally only 4 - 6 carriages I would assume that he could have travelled from one end to the other at least once in an hour (if not more).
Presumably,
The train stops for a minute or so at Darton, at Wombwell, at Elsecar and at Meadowhall whilst people get on and off. As far as I know none of these have ticket machines but I've never got off at Wombwell or Elsecar so can't say for certain. The train also stops at Barnsley, which does have a ticket office and a ticket machine, but I wouldn't have time to get off there, buy a icket, and get back on the train before it had set off.
I imagine it is the driver checking that all doors are clear before closing them. If there is a ticket inspector then he never wanders up and down the train checking tickets.
So, maybe its wrong to say that there isn't a ticket inspector on the train, but it is right to say that he never actually inspects tickets.
True they should travel up and down the train however they don't always and it is still your responsibility to pay at the earliest possibility. If inspectors had boarded the train you would almost certainly have been required to pay a penalty fare and quite rightly so. You can't walk out of a shop with items just because you have to go wandering around the shop to find someone to take your money.
That sort of thing is really annoying, I often travel by train and go the whole journey without my ticket being checked. I know there is a guard on the trains I go on but they just sit in the middle of the train and operate the doors etc - they will sell you a ticket but you have to approach them.
I then made it from Preston back home to Wales again without paying, so got most of the journey for free. This was about fifteen years ago. I don't think I'd be tempted to try and get away with it these days.
Supermarket security staff rarely inspect receipts outside the door so does that mean you should go in and shoplift because you can probably get away with it? I think not.
Train "bunking" is just as illegal and just as immoral as shoplifting, except that the company concerned happens to provide services not goods. I've never done either.
Just commenting generally here, not suggesting that you yourself do any of this.
If a ticket inspector made himself known to me - or even made himself visible so I'd know to be able to go up to him and ask to buy a ticket off him - then I'd happily do so. I don't try to get away with not buying a ticket - it's just next-to-impossible to be able to buy a ticket, and impossibl to find anyone at either station or on the train who will actually sell you one.
I have no idea if the ticket inspector exists or not - I've never actually seen him standing on the platform or peering out of the train door to ensure the doors are clear to know whether he actually lives at the front, the back or in the middle of the train.
It may indeed be just the driver who checks that the doors are clear before leaving the station, and I don't suppose he would take too kindly to people going into his little cockpit at the front of the train and asking for a single from Meadowhall to Darton at half past ten at night. He's driving a train, not selling tickets.
Presumably the majority of people who ride this train - and there aren't very many at this time of night - either get on where there is a ticket machine, get off where there is a ticket machine, or have a railcard anyway, it just so happens that I don't.