For London, yes, not (at present) the other five C4 regions
The quote to which you referred was about C4 HD being able to be moved up the EPG even if it didn't move to 104 (to another slot owned by C4).
That aside it is unlikely that C4 would enable a swap for one region only. If C4 HD appears at 104 it will be for everyone (even if it is the London "region") or not at all.
The quote to which you referred was about C4 HD being able to be moved up the EPG even if it didn't move to 104 (to another slot owned by C4).
That aside it is unlikely that C4 would enable a swap for one region only. If C4 HD appears at 104 it will be for everyone (even if it is the London "region") or not at all.
lol it even confused me and it was my post he was quoting!
posting on a phone is tricky, a balance of wanting to keep up and not having very much on your screen!
Why is BBC2HD not on 102 in Scotland, Wales & NI ?
I think the last we heard was that the BBC Executive wanted to launch BBC Two HD versions for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and that proposals would be given to the Trust for approval.
Opt-outs are more extensive in the nations and I guess it wasn't deemed appropriate to show BBC Two HD England in the nations on 102.
I think the last we heard was that the BBC Executive wanted to launch BBC Two HD versions for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and that proposals would be given to the Trust for approval.
Regional opt-outs are more extensive in the nations and I guess it wasn't deemed appropriate to show BBC One HD England in the nations on 101.
I think you mean BBC Two HD England in the nations on 102. The nations already have BBC One HD Sco/Wal/NI at 101.
I tend to agree with your thinking as to why they aren't moving BBC Two HD England to 102 in the nations and they will still have BBC Two SD Sco/Wal/NI.
Channel 4 HD and Channel 5 HD could move to 104/105 once they enable Sky Ad Smart, the box would change the adverts automatically.
thats a very good point, of course it wont work if you record it, but if your watching a recording then winding through the adverts is the norm so that wouldnt make a big difference!
live pause would cause some issues though!
I tend to agree with your thinking as to why they aren't moving BBC Two HD England to 102 in the nations and they will still have BBC Two SD Sco/Wal/NI.
That is their thinking, confirmed by the good Doctor, before she buggered off to Vodafone
So could C4 HD
C5 HD is a differnt matter entirely, apart from the obvious that they arent FTA, C5 HD is on the lowest LCN C5 own on Sky apart from 105 I think!
Not quite. Back then they were only talking about swapping services where what viewers saw on SD and HD on any channel in any region/nation was identical - hence the nations got BBC One HD at 101 and England got BBC Two HD at 102.
What they are now doing is swapping BBC One HD in England even though that service is not currently identical to the BBC One SD service (no regional news etc on HD). Using the same logic they could also swap BBC Two HD in Sco/Wal/NI even though the HD service is not identical to the SD service there (no national variations on HD). However, it would not be so easy to redirect HD viewers to BBC Two SD in the nations when there are variations and the variations are less straightforward than on BBC One in England.
That is essentially why they are differentiating now between BBC One HD in England and BBC Two HD in Sco/Wal/NI.
What they are now doing is swapping BBC One HD in England even though that service is not currently identical to the BBC One SD service .
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced the BBC 1 swaps won't be happening in England, and possibly no swaps at all (yet) for Freesat. Someone in BBC Reception Advice has got the wrong end of the stick.
They shouldn't be helping Sky's HD service, so they should move the channels to 101 and 102 on Sky HD boxes with no subscription too, ie mine.
they should get Sky to sort out fta HD swapping for everyone with a HD box.
it didn't matter before Dec last year as all fta, or psb channels anyway, didn't swap, but now they do its an issue.
If they did that you'll have your SD channels with HD versions all over the EPG.
what do you mean?
if the HD swap was split into
FTA HD channel swaps
EE HD channel swaps
Movie HD channel swaps
Sport HD channel swaps
and if I was doing it I would say Ent HD channel swaps separate to EE HD channel swaps and introduce Entertainment+, Movies+ and Sports+ so creating mini HD packs on top of each pack so that HD is more affordable while still keeping it £10.25 overall if you add up all of them!
Anyway the ability to swap HD for each pack level, would mean that, FTA HD that swaps, would always be swapped for HD boxes, Sky would only need to write it into the new firmware, then send a signal to the box if something changes.
As a side note (thats already been mentioned but I would like to expand on it), Channel 4 HD and Channel 5 HD could swap by using adsmart on the boxes with the new firmware too, while leaving Thompson boxes out due to them having the old software still.
Channel 4 HD and Channel 5 HD swapping with adsmart would be a lot cheaper than them launching another 5 (C4) and 4 (C5) advertising regions.
Not quite. Back then they were only talking about swapping services where what viewers saw on SD and HD on any channel in any region/nation was identical - hence the nations got BBC One HD at 101 and England got BBC Two HD at 102.
Indeed, as Ms Pryde said in December:
One goal in our approach to distributing our channels is to put the ‘best’ version of a channel first in the EPG, where the ‘best’ version has the right availability of nations or regional content, followed by the highest picture quality. We also factor in whether the channel has been technically enabled to launch our much-valued BBC Red Button services.
Policy seems now to have changed to picture quality first, localised content second, for BBC One in the English regions (but not BBC Two in the non-English nations).
Comments
For London, yes, not (at present) the other five C4 regions
Oh I see, it doesn't make that clear in the BBC link as it just says Sky and Freesat.
is unfolding is more important than the mechanism of its telling.
driving the uptake of HD though is part of the BBC's sixth public purpose.
I know only in London, but that is something at least.
The quote to which you referred was about C4 HD being able to be moved up the EPG even if it didn't move to 104 (to another slot owned by C4).
That aside it is unlikely that C4 would enable a swap for one region only. If C4 HD appears at 104 it will be for everyone (even if it is the London "region") or not at all.
what about the elderly - will they have to swap to 141 for the local news?
DTT will remain the 'norm'; local services remain, as they have been for half a century,
on positions 1 and 3;
if I want the 'extra' of higher definition I'll switch to Freesat - don't see a problem.
What has age to do with this anyway?
lol it even confused me and it was my post he was quoting!
posting on a phone is tricky, a balance of wanting to keep up and not having very much on your screen!
you have a good point most people who would have trouble with this sort of thing would have freeview to fall back on.
I think the last we heard was that the BBC Executive wanted to launch BBC Two HD versions for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and that proposals would be given to the Trust for approval.
Opt-outs are more extensive in the nations and I guess it wasn't deemed appropriate to show BBC Two HD England in the nations on 102.
I think you mean BBC Two HD England in the nations on 102. The nations already have BBC One HD Sco/Wal/NI at 101.
I tend to agree with your thinking as to why they aren't moving BBC Two HD England to 102 in the nations and they will still have BBC Two SD Sco/Wal/NI.
thats a very good point, of course it wont work if you record it, but if your watching a recording then winding through the adverts is the norm so that wouldnt make a big difference!
live pause would cause some issues though!
That is their thinking, confirmed by the good Doctor, before she buggered off to Vodafone
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/aboutthebbc/posts/CBBC-HD-CBeebies-HD-BBC-Three-HD-BBC-Four-HD-and-BBC-News-HD-to-launch-on-Tuesday-10-December-2013
Are there any circumstances where Channel 5 HD would appear on 105 and be encrypted?
AFAIK Channel 5 SD would remain on 105 unless one has an HD subscription, in which case it would swap and be unencrypted
if someone has EE+ or the old HD pack on Sky then their card will decode channel 5 HD so it could go at 105 for those Sky subscribers with ad smart!
Not quite. Back then they were only talking about swapping services where what viewers saw on SD and HD on any channel in any region/nation was identical - hence the nations got BBC One HD at 101 and England got BBC Two HD at 102.
What they are now doing is swapping BBC One HD in England even though that service is not currently identical to the BBC One SD service (no regional news etc on HD). Using the same logic they could also swap BBC Two HD in Sco/Wal/NI even though the HD service is not identical to the SD service there (no national variations on HD). However, it would not be so easy to redirect HD viewers to BBC Two SD in the nations when there are variations and the variations are less straightforward than on BBC One in England.
That is essentially why they are differentiating now between BBC One HD in England and BBC Two HD in Sco/Wal/NI.
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced the BBC 1 swaps won't be happening in England, and possibly no swaps at all (yet) for Freesat. Someone in BBC Reception Advice has got the wrong end of the stick.
See you back here in 48 hours :cool:
they should get Sky to sort out fta HD swapping for everyone with a HD box.
it didn't matter before Dec last year as all fta, or psb channels anyway, didn't swap, but now they do its an issue.
If they did that you'll have your SD channels with HD versions all over the EPG.
what do you mean?
if the HD swap was split into
FTA HD channel swaps
EE HD channel swaps
Movie HD channel swaps
Sport HD channel swaps
and if I was doing it I would say Ent HD channel swaps separate to EE HD channel swaps and introduce Entertainment+, Movies+ and Sports+ so creating mini HD packs on top of each pack so that HD is more affordable while still keeping it £10.25 overall if you add up all of them!
Anyway the ability to swap HD for each pack level, would mean that, FTA HD that swaps, would always be swapped for HD boxes, Sky would only need to write it into the new firmware, then send a signal to the box if something changes.
As a side note (thats already been mentioned but I would like to expand on it), Channel 4 HD and Channel 5 HD could swap by using adsmart on the boxes with the new firmware too, while leaving Thompson boxes out due to them having the old software still.
Channel 4 HD and Channel 5 HD swapping with adsmart would be a lot cheaper than them launching another 5 (C4) and 4 (C5) advertising regions.
ITV really would be the one left out then!
Indeed, as Ms Pryde said in December:
Policy seems now to have changed to picture quality first, localised content second, for BBC One in the English regions (but not BBC Two in the non-English nations).