The I'm Loving Series 9 Thread
DiscoP
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Hmm, so I couldn't decide where to put my opinion. At first I was going to put it in the ratings thread, and then the 'I've lost Interest' thread but then I decided to hell with it, my opinion really is that important that it deserves it's own thread 
and besides there are enough threads knocking series 9 so I thought it was time for some balance on the forum.
I just wanted to say how much I have been loving series 9, and if the finale delivers all that the trailer promises then this could well be not only one of my favourite series of nuWho but all of Doctor Who. It's not been perfect, and The girl who lived/died and Sleep No More were duds for me, but overall I would put it up there with seasons 7, 13 and 21 from the classic series (I can only include season 21 in that list by pretending that the Twin Dilemma isn't part of it, and I fully accept that I am biased towards that season as it's the first season that I vividly remember as a child, anyway I digress…)
I know that the series has lost roughly a million viewers and it's not to everyone's cup of tea, but from a purely selfish point of view I just don't care. When I see dumbed down, reality, z-list celeb, they've got no talent TV show after TV show becoming ratings hit after hit I find it very hard to respect what the Great British public apparently like to watch. Many programmes that are to my tastes get rave reviews but poor viewing figures (Inside No.9 I'm looking at you here). Also to bring up some anecdotal evidence that some people seem to love here I too have a friend who has been religiously watching NuWho but has been loosing interest as she's missing the Fun factor.
I can completely see why the current series isn't appealing to as many people. I get that the show is missing the fun element but for me the last two episodes and the Zygon Inversion in particular are telling the rather more mature stories that I always hoped Torchwood would deliver, and which it only really achieved for the Children of Earth series. I freely admit that fun TV doesn't always appeal to me. Other highlights of my TV viewing schedule are Game of Thrones and the Walking Dead, so compared to those two shows the darkest, bleakest episode of Doctor Who is like a walk in the park.
That said, I dare say that the production team will probably re-work the show for the next series will try to appeal to a broader audience once again, especially if they go for a spring, more family friendly slot. So I will cherish series 9, and salute all of it's attempts at being 'different' be they successful or not because I fully expect not to see the like again. anytime soon.
and besides there are enough threads knocking series 9 so I thought it was time for some balance on the forum.I just wanted to say how much I have been loving series 9, and if the finale delivers all that the trailer promises then this could well be not only one of my favourite series of nuWho but all of Doctor Who. It's not been perfect, and The girl who lived/died and Sleep No More were duds for me, but overall I would put it up there with seasons 7, 13 and 21 from the classic series (I can only include season 21 in that list by pretending that the Twin Dilemma isn't part of it, and I fully accept that I am biased towards that season as it's the first season that I vividly remember as a child, anyway I digress…)
I know that the series has lost roughly a million viewers and it's not to everyone's cup of tea, but from a purely selfish point of view I just don't care. When I see dumbed down, reality, z-list celeb, they've got no talent TV show after TV show becoming ratings hit after hit I find it very hard to respect what the Great British public apparently like to watch. Many programmes that are to my tastes get rave reviews but poor viewing figures (Inside No.9 I'm looking at you here). Also to bring up some anecdotal evidence that some people seem to love here I too have a friend who has been religiously watching NuWho but has been loosing interest as she's missing the Fun factor.
I can completely see why the current series isn't appealing to as many people. I get that the show is missing the fun element but for me the last two episodes and the Zygon Inversion in particular are telling the rather more mature stories that I always hoped Torchwood would deliver, and which it only really achieved for the Children of Earth series. I freely admit that fun TV doesn't always appeal to me. Other highlights of my TV viewing schedule are Game of Thrones and the Walking Dead, so compared to those two shows the darkest, bleakest episode of Doctor Who is like a walk in the park.
That said, I dare say that the production team will probably re-work the show for the next series will try to appeal to a broader audience once again, especially if they go for a spring, more family friendly slot. So I will cherish series 9, and salute all of it's attempts at being 'different' be they successful or not because I fully expect not to see the like again. anytime soon.
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Anyhow, your main point. I've also enjoyed this series a lot. I'm one of the few who enjoyed Sleep No More and I've found a lot to like in every story except the mid-season Ashildr two-parter, which were fairly formulaic and dull but did a lot of heavy lifting to set up what was to come.
This is the closest the show has come to replicating the feel of the Tom Baker era. He was the Doctor I grew up with, so it's probably not surprising this series has appealed to me with its darker, character-driven stories. It feels like Moffat has made a big effort to pursue a different direction this year (the cynic in me wonders if the reduction in CGI/action is as much down to smaller budgets than creative choice) with a darker feel and more experimental stories (in particular Sleep No More and Heaven Sent). When you make changes as big as that, you're going to alienate some viewers and make some missteps - but I'd rather he did what he has done than just keep rolling out one safe retread after another.
Not a perfect season, by any means. But Heaven Sent was brave and adventurous, and Hell Bent is too. (And, like last year's finale, it contains one moment that, if anything, will be even more controversial than the Brigaider-as-Cyberman.)
I don't understand the complaints of a lack of fun in it, I think it's been tremendously fun while presenting a smarter and more mature show than the preceding ten years. I agree with you about feeling disconnected from what the general public likes... especially when I see them raving about things I couldn't stand such as Ten and Rose's love story. In my opinion modern Doctor Who suffers from a lose/lose ultimatum where appealing to the widest audience possible means a dumbed down show of far lower quality, and Series 1-4 I feel were an example of this. Lots of people complain about Capaldi being boring and lacking energy, but the way I see it Tennant and Smith just spent too much time bouncing around the screen and shouting like children (not that Smith was a bad Doctor, but flawed, yes).
Oh blimey so you've seen Hell Bent already?
So without giving away any spoilers would you say that it ties up all the loose threads that have been created this series? The one fear that I have about the finale is that it feels like there is a lot to resolve in 45 minutes and I know Moffat has a habit of not always tidying up the mess that he creates
Funnily enough, while I tolerated the Ten/Rose love story dynamic but was happy to see the back of it, she absolutely hated it and she very nearly gave up after series 2.
Without wanting to make any sweeping generalisations - he says, making a sweeping generalisation - the odds are that anyone who loved Heaven Sent will like Hell Bent, and anyone who hated the first part will hate the second part too. I loved it (although there is one particular element that had me howling at my screen in indignation).
No spoilers (although I will put up a teaser preview over on the Metro website, probably Wednesday) but ... yes, I think all the loose ends are tied up, certainly more so than previous Moffat finales. And I didn't think it felt rushed at all - helped by the fact it has a run-time of bang on 60 minutes.
Yep, you have to sympathize with the creative minds behond Doctor Who... they know they can't please everybody and they've got a hell of a job trying to entertain the world when everybody wants different things.
Call me an easily pleased idiot (Pause....) but I genuinely have never watched a season/series of Who out of the whole 35 (count 'em!) we have had thus far that I've actively *disliked*. (Individual stories, yeah, but even they're quite rare considering the sheer volume we've had over more than half a century.) Although I have my preference for certain eras, stories, Doctors, etc obviously.
Speaking of Doctors, I found Capaldi's performance last year fascinating, and this year he's really hit a different level and owns the part completely. I genuinely think that some of his performances have been up there with the best we've seen in the role, and 'Heaven Sent' in particular is *right* up there....looking forward to the conclusion.
Of course, if Moffat does something completely radical that I don't like in 'Hell Bent', the whole series will be *ruined*, I tell you. *Ruined*!!
Not really, but this whole 'Gallifrey Base' will *explode*' stuff I've heard is rather intriguing. Still, I don't post there, so.....:D
I've written my own blogs (several of them), contributed to others, recorded podcasts and lots of other stuff for several years now. If I had the proverbial penny for every time someone had slated my opinion or called me a terrible writer,I would be very wealthy indeed. I'm always happy to discuss things with people who disagree - they're usually the most interesting discussions as long as they've civil - I have no time for people who merely wish to tell me I'm wrong/an idiot/whatever, and I'm pretty sure that the opinion of one person who thinks I'm a bad writer (no matter how valid that opinion many be) doesn't actually affect how good a writer I am - unless I choose to let it affect me.
Moffat and his writers are trying to do the best job they possibly can. Sometimes we'll love them. At other times, not so much. But that's just the way it is, and I doubt he lets it bother him too much.
Still one of the most interesting shows on my tellybox after ten years - that's not bad going.
I didn't come close to abandoning Sleep No More but I did struggle to stay awake during it. To date the only episodes of NuWho that I have fallen asleep during are Bore Her and Vincent and the Doctor, although Vincent and the Doctor was because I was drunk and I very much enjoyed it when I watched it again sober
I think it's pretty clear that we will not be getting an Autumn slot for Series 10. Apparently filming doesn't begin until May next year meaning Series 10 will be January 2017 at the earliest if this is true.
It doesn't look like there's going to be much Doctor Who at all next year.
Anyway, moving onto the topic of this thread- Yes, I'm very much enjoying Series 9. The Woman Who Lived was dodgy and I'm still not sure how I feel about Sleep no More, but on the whole I've enjoyed this year a lot more than last year.
And provided Hell Bent doesn't disappoint then the last 3 episodes look set to become my favourite finale since the show returned.
It's a pity the ratings have dropped significantly for the first time in 9 years this year.
I hope they find away to rekindle interest when Series 10 comes around (whenever the hell that will actually be).
I agree with some others that Sleep No More was a weaker episode but I like that they tried something different. There will always be ideas that sound great but don't quite pan out. The show should always take those risks so if there is going to be a weaker effort it is good that this happens while trying to do something fresh. The Woman Who Lived was probably the next weakest for me as well but I still really liked it and felt it was the right change of pace at that point in the series. Indeed the shifting in feel/pace/etc. from episode to episode has been excellent. I don't think any previous series has managed to handle that so well. Hopefully the finale ends the series on a high and confirms (for me ;-)) that this is the best series since 2005 and maybe even ever.
(Except Sleep No More, that was the single worst episode in New Who history for me.)
However I think series 9 has possibly been more enjoyable. I wouldn't have wanted an identical series to series 8, and quite rightly Moffat has lightened things up a bit and shown us a different side to Capaldi's doctor. (why he's been criticised for this, I don't know)
I should probably stick to this particular thread as I find some of the other threads unrelentingly negative. What's worse, certain posters seem to have a vision of Doctor Who which is backward looking and involves taking the show back to 2005-2008. As enjoyable as RTD's era as Who was, it's over. And as good as David Tennant was, he isn't the litmus test for how good a doctor is. It's depressingly unimaginative to be constantly harking back to the past.
It's interesting that back in the late 60's, Doctor Who's ratings were falling. So in 1970, Doctor Who was relaunched in a big way - filmed in colour, new doctor, set permanently on earth: there's very little in common between late 1960's who and early 1970's who.
And yet now, Pat Troughton is a fan favourite, and seems to be more fondly regarded than Jon Pertwee. In 10-15 years time, I think Capaldi's era will stand up far more than Tennant's, even if it isn't as popular right now.
I'm also a big Classic Season 7 fan. Four stories, all excellent: Spearhead from Space, Doctor Who and the Silurians, The Ambassadors of Death and Inferno. It's hard to think of any other seasons without a single thumbs down, even during the Holmes / Hinchcliffe /Baker era.
Thumb up or thumb down has these days become my informal rating system for an episode of Doctor Who. Thumbs up represents an episode of Doctor Who I would be happy for a non-fan of the show to be exposed to, a thumbs down isn't. It basically means 'Do I approve this episode or not'.
Applying this system to previous seasons tends to have the result of about 50 / 50 between thumbs up and down.
For example, last season is like this:
Deep Breath: Classic (Classic is a particularly distinguished thumbs-up, an episode I would confidently recommend)
Into the Dalek: Thumb Down
Robots of Sherwood: Thumb Down
Listen: Thumb Up
Time Heist: (wavering in the middle but this is a binary system so Thumb Down)
The Caretaker: Thumb Up
Kill the Moon: Thumb Down
Mummy on the Orient Express: Thumb Up
Flatline: Thumb Down
In the Forests of the Night: Thumb Down
Dark water: Classic
Death in Heaven: Thumb Up
As you can see, pretty 50 / 50. This is roughly the normal trend, between 40 - 60% approved.
Sadly I can only give an unequivocal thumbs up to the Moffat episodes and 'Face the Raven' this season (with a 'Classic' distinction for 'Heaven Sent') . I don't think I would rate any of the others with a Thumb Up. That shouldn't be taken to mean I thought the season was terrible; it wasn't, but it just hasn't worked for me. I'm confident that next season will pick things up.
This is a great comment. I agree with it.
Matt was a little bit too much like a mental childish version of tennant. Good to get a doctor with a difference
I'm enjoying series 9. Capaldi is spot on this year. He was good last year but they went too far with the rude/callous aspect. Much better balance this year. The show has about the right 'feel' at the moment, even if some detail of plots still has eyeballs rolling. E.g. loved the dalek opener, even if it did have the terrible idea of the Doctor meeting young Anakin Davroswalker ("Are you an angel?"). The skaro battlefield scene was great, though.
Well said!