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How do we prevent car cloning?
Stegan
Posts: 5,039 Forum Member
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The tax disc is abolished in October. Surely this will be a charter for more car cloning to take place won't it? How are the DVLA and police going to stop that happening? Does anyone have any good ideas to prevent cloning of cars?
As for ANPR cameras - I can't remember the last time I saw one of these at the side of the road for example.
Cars can be checked at the website below to check if a car is taxed and has an MOT. All that is needed is the registration number and the make of car. I've checked out all of my neighbours cars and they are all legal so far. Further information is also provided about the car you enquire about.
https://www.vehicleenquiry.service.gov.uk/
As for ANPR cameras - I can't remember the last time I saw one of these at the side of the road for example.
Cars can be checked at the website below to check if a car is taxed and has an MOT. All that is needed is the registration number and the make of car. I've checked out all of my neighbours cars and they are all legal so far. Further information is also provided about the car you enquire about.
https://www.vehicleenquiry.service.gov.uk/
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Now they're far more open and 'transparent' and loads of police cars have them too.
Cloning a number plate works for a bit, but once the original keeper gets speeding tickets or other charges, the police will suspect a plate might be cloned and can now put a mark to stop any vehicle with that plate (yes, that means the original owner would get stopped, although perhaps they're given a new one) and so it then becomes rather risky to keep driving on a cloned plate.
I suspect offenders swap plates quite a bit, and I don't get why they'd look at your tax disc. They'd look at your plate, or should I say look for a plate that matches the car they want to clone. That can be done by simply driving around, especially going into car parks etc.
When you clone a car you buy a wrecked one and steal a similar one and disguise it.
Surely that's obvious isn't it? At the moment, it is possible to check if a car has been taxed or not with the tax disc in evidence to prove it.
However, the new tax rules mean that an unscrupulous person can get a car which is the same model and colour of a 'legally taxed' car and no one is any the wiser. They would effectively be piggy backing on another persons tax.
Tamper proof number plates would be a start.
http://www.carcalluk.com/theft-resistant-number-plates/index.html
Yes, but if an individual cloning a car was careful and didn't drive like a maniac, they could avoid paying tax and the cost of an MOT for quite some time - maybe years. To prevent the possibility of being discovered, they could get rid of the car and do the exactly the same with another car.
Not really a clever way of doing it on a long term basis though is it? Somebody would naturally contact the police if that happened and they would be on the look out for that registration straight away.
No doubt the 'professional cloner' would get the plates made up by some dodgy dealer, drive carefully and piggy back on that cars tax for far longer.
The reg will be different and that is what will be used to check if a car is taxed.
Then there are the VINs.
No-one clones a car to 'piggy back' on someone else's tax whilst they use it for their daily commute and school run and other perfectly law-abiding business. They do it for one-off bank jobs or whatever to throw the police off the trail for a few days or weeks.
It's so obviously going to be easier to 'clone' a car now as all you need to do is swap number plates which is much easier than creating a forged tax disc.
For example is if you have a car with no tax and MOT. Just get a dodgy garage to put on the number plates of a similar car that does and voila you have a car that won't get picked out by cameras. Further more as there is no need for a visible tax disc you can leave it anywhere and no one be will the wiser.
So it will be easier to have a car and not bother taxing and getting an MOT.
^^^ Exactly. Easier still, just look at Autotrader or eBay and find a similar car then clone their number plates. You can even try and find one a long distance away so there's less chance of ever meeting the car you're cloning.
When purchasing a number plate, do you need to produce the documents of the car you're getting them for? I thought you could get them over the counter at Halfords without the need to prove ownership, so utilising a dodgy garage won't even be necessary?
You just need to hope the car you're cloning is up-to-date with their own tax, MOT and insurance otherwise you might get pulled over for doing the thing you're trying to avoid!
Agreed. It won't just be 'bank robbers' cloning cars either. I'll bet this will become rife.
How about this for example. Two people buy exactly the same new car together, then simply decide they'll change the plates on one of them to avoid tax. How would anyone be any the wiser? I'm just talking about ordinary people here who might be tempted to break the law and do such a thing in the same way they may clone disabled driver badges. They'll do the same with fraudulent insurance claims or tamper with Sky cards etc. It's what they do - scam and defraud whenever they can.
The types of slightly iffy individuals I'm thinking about are more than a little bit open to a bit of fraud and I suspect they wouldn't really see car cloning as a serious criminal act either.
What you are describing isn't "car cloning".
The two cars will have different vin numbers printed on the glass and various places around the chassis and engine. I'm going to hazard a guess that the new tax discs will be linked to the car beyond the licence plate.
Yes, that obviously becomes apparent once the car is stopped by the police, has an accident or goes into a garage for repairs and is spotted.
However, until then, the 'cloned car. is driving around with impunity until they are eventually stopped or found out in the way I've described.
I suppose the other car in the scenario I've described could simply be declared as SORN so no tax is then required on that vehicle. This would then leave the couple able to use two cars on the same registration plates - or have I missed something?
If the couple have the same car with the same number plate and are both being parked in the same location, it won't be long before questions are being asked.
The same could have happened with tax discs, as a colour copy could be taken of the tax disc which is used in both vehicles.
That means nothing though. Some of my mates used to stick anything that resembled a tax disc in the windscreen. You never get pulled over because your tax disc looks a bit dodgy.
Under the old rules, it was much easier shall we say to spot road tax evaders. Parking Wardens will spot fake tax discs as will neighbours or members of the public if they are determined enough.
It's quite obvious that so long as the other car remains taxed and road legal - the cloned car is safe. The cloned car remains safe until IT does something illegal - other than the fact it is cloned that is. For example, speeding or parking fines or is involved in an accident.
A mere tax disc on a vehicle doesn't prove a car has road tax and MOT.
The car could have been taxed just before the MOT expired. The owner then (for whatever claimed reason) asks for a tax refund, and says the disc is lost or stolen.
(And, yes, thank you, I'm aware it's not really road tax).
BIB ... How very kind of you. I trust your neighbours are suitably grateful when you tell them about it.
Stop calling it a cloned car.
It isn't cloned, my mates used to rob cars and bikes and actually clone them. They didn't care about the tax disc or licence plates.
I have done this for trailer and someone broke mne reasons.
Having the correct car and correct plate is not good enough, to be honest it is just a hassle, so buy show plates with all the correct details on, SO MUCH EASIER.
Used show plates a lot, I used the correct details but nothing to stop someone using false details.
If a car is using the registration plates of another car - IT IS CLONED.
BTW, since I'm road legal and pay my way with great difficulty I might add, then I believe others should do the same or be made to STOP DRIVING. They'll often also be the sort of people to be found speeding to excess, driving uninsured or even worse drink/drug driving. Throw the book at them I say - and if they won't stop sling them in prison!
If I discover any cars that are not road legal - I'll have absolutely no hesitation in reporting them. They are nothing more than thieves.
At the simplest level, somebody can verify that the reg. on the tax disc is the same as the reg. on the number plates.
Course, there's nothing to stop you from trying to create a fake tax disc but they're usually pretty easy to spot, which is why books of unused tax discs are often prime targets for theft when post-offices get broken into.