Surely everybody knows that Ross County v Celtic was never going to be a Saturday 3pm kick off.
Celtic going away from home 3pm Saturday afternoon is a thing of the past. Booking a hotel room and Citylink bus tickets assuming a 3pm Saturday kick off well in advance when the kick off time was always going to change is a massive mistake.
It's Celtic v Ross County.
But regardless, "flag day" was always going to be shown live.
And that is exactly what BT want. They want BB customers and many will either sign up to BT BB or stay with BT BB to get the sports channels.
But I think many will pay the £12 too, as it is a pretty reasonable amount for 3 premium channels with decent quality EPL games and Aviva rugby etc.
Another advantage to BT's strategy is they will potentially have a lot higher audience figures than ESPN, because 6.3 million already have BT broadband, and this will bring in decent ad revenue for the channels.
If that's the case, why not just give the channel to everyone they can? Thus increasing the audience even further and raising the potential advertising revenue?
If that's the case, why not just give the channel to everyone they can? Thus increasing the audience even further and raising the potential advertising revenue?
I do not know what you mean by this comment. BT's strategy is to retain/obtain new and existing broadband and telephony users through their new venture into the sports market.
If that's the case, why not just give the channel to everyone they can? Thus increasing the audience even further and raising the potential advertising revenue?
Because ad revenue is not their core business. They want to drive telephony and broadband, The ad revenue will be an added bonus offsetting some of the costs.
Another advantage to BT's strategy is they will potentially have a lot higher audience figures than ESPN, because 6.3 million already have BT broadband, and this will bring in decent ad revenue for the channels.
But how many of those 6.3m homes will have the means to watch the broadcasts (and I mean on their TV, not online).
You have less than 1m BT Vision/YouView customers and BT&Sky customers.
How many Sky customers are interested enough to register to watch?
But how many of those 6.3m homes will have the means to watch the broadcasts (and I mean on their TV, not online).
You have less than 1m BT Vision/YouView customers and BT&Sky customers.
How many Sky customers are interested enough to register to watch?
Judging by the comments form a market research company who contacted me a significant number.
I was asked why , having left sky tv, had i now swtitched to BT broadband. Obviously, with the free sports, it was an obvious reply.
(yes i know that the BB and phone deal was £1 a month more with BT but in any event was also free for 6 months).
The researcher let it slip that there had been a significant switch for that reason.
Sky subscribers who paid for ESPN are likely to consider the BT package as it promised more home based sports...but the significant market will come from the 7m existing existing BT BB customers who DONT have sky or have left due to the cost, and want some sport.
Unlike Setanta/ESPN and ITV beforehand ...BT hit the ground running and have a billing infrastructure in place that does not rely on sky. BT will look to develop stand alone sports channels without the need to take "entertainment" packages and thus offer a lower entry point for pay sports.
Look at what sky have been forced to do with movies. They now offer this service as a stream only to compete with Love film etc and last week Groupon were offering this at a total cost of £14.99 for 6 months.
When BT say game changing...it really will be.They just need to sort out deals with virgin etc
Judging by the comments form a market research company who contacted me a significant number.
I was asked why , having left sky tv, had i now swtitched to BT broadband. Obviously, with the free sports, it was an obvious reply.
(yes i know that the BB and phone deal was £1 a month more with BT but in any event was also free for 6 months).
The researcher let it slip that there had been a significant switch for that reason.
Sky subscribers who paid for ESPN are likely to consider the BT package as it promised more home based sports...but the significant market will come from the 7m existing existing BT BB customers who DONT have sky or have left due to the cost, and want some sport.
Unlike Setanta/ESPN and ITV beforehand ...BT hit the ground running and have a billing infrastructure in place that does not rely on sky. BT will look to develop stand alone sports channels without the need to take "entertainment" packages and thus offer a lower entry point for pay sports.
Look at what sky have been forced to do with movies. They now offer this service as a stream only to compete with Love film etc and last week Groupon were offering this at a total cost of £14.99 for 6 months.
When BT say game changing...it really will be.They just need to sort out deals with virgin etc
I suggest we wait until we see some clear evidence. I wouldn't put too much store on what so called "researchers" tell you. Who was the market research being carried out for (BT by any chance?).
I am a Sky subscriber (inc Sky Sports) who paid for ESPN but primarily for US sports. To continue with BT Sports I would be asked to pay 50% more, no multiroom and possibly less US Sport. So far I am not inclined to take it up.
ESPN and Setanta could only attract around 1m paying customers each so there is little to suggest BT will do any better particularly given their free offering to Broadband subscribers.
Even if they did attract 1m paying customers at £15pm (highly questionable based on Setanta and ESPN experience and given the likely number of "free" subscribers) that is an income of only £180m per annum as against anticipated costs of £450m per annum. ie they will likely lose somewhere in excess of £200m per annum. So it is all about gaining, or not losing, broadband customers. It does not make financial sense otherwise. You wonder whether they might not have been better simply using Sky Sports as a loss leader to attract custom on that basis.
The problem when your focus is one thing (broadband) is that the thing that is key to customers (sport) becomes a secondary consideration.
I doubt that there is a significant market for pay Sport amongst those who don't already have Sky Sports and/or ESPN. Hard to say how many of its own BB customers would stay because of free BT Sports rather than changing BB suppliers to save cash, or how many will change to BT Broadband because of free BT Sports. Not as many perhaps as some might suppose I suspect. People on this forum are not typical of the population at large.
A lower entry point for pay Sport is only relevant if the sport on offer is what you want. Great for footy and rugger fans perhaps but not much value for cricket or golf or fans of other sports.
To me £15pm for BT Sports is not great value on a comparative basis against what I get from Sky Sports.
Much of what is being claimed for BT Sports was also claimed for Setanta then ESPN. I remain to be convinced that the outcome this time will be much different.
I am though open to persuasion but for now I may wait and see.
But how many of those 6.3m homes will have the means to watch the broadcasts (and I mean on their TV, not online).
You have less than 1m BT Vision/YouView customers and BT&Sky customers.
How many Sky customers are interested enough to register to watch?
Anecdotal evidence from those working in BT call centres suggest huge interest. Their phones haven't stopped ringing.
Never underestimate the power of a "free" offer on the public.
How stupid would a sky sports customer with BT broadband be to miss out on 3 free sports channels just for the sake of a 5 minute phone call to an 0800 number?
Anecdotal evidence from those working in BT call centres suggest huge interest. Their phones haven't stopped ringing.
Never underestimate the power of a "free" offer on the public.
How stupid would a sky sports customer with BT broadband be to miss out on 3 free sports channels just for the sake of a 5 minute phone call to an 0800 number?
Plenty of people making the switch from TalkTalk, Plusnet, Sky etc as well. TBH I haven't noticed many from VM just the odd one myself, although obviously can't speak on behalf of everyone. Maybe it is the hassle of moving and having a new line installed, whereas if you have a BT line in, you can chop and change as you wish?
Anecdotal evidence from those working in BT call centres suggest huge interest. Their phones haven't stopped ringing.
There's a shocker on a "they would say that wouldn't they basis"!
I agree that if you are a Sky Sports customer with BT Broadband it is pretty much a no brainer but there again BT are effectively gaining very little from those people. No BT Sports subs, no increased Broadband fee income in most cases - just securing their custom for another 12 months.
BARB figures will give an indication as to audience in due course for comparison. I wonder what figures BT will release as to subscribers - wonder if they will indicate how many people are actually paying for BT Sports.
There's a shocker on a "they would say that wouldn't they basis"!
I agree that if you are a Sky Sports customer with BT Broadband it is pretty much a no brainer but there again BT are effectively gaining very little from those people. No BT Sports subs, no increased Broadband fee income in most cases - just securing their custom for another 12 months.
BARB figures will give an indication as to audience in due course for comparison. I wonder what figures BT will release as to subscribers - wonder if they will indicate how many people are actually paying for BT Sports.
Indeed.
As it stands at the moment, its impossible to guesstimate user uptake numbers of these new channels, because so many things are still up in the air, with the negotiations with VM and TT yet to be announced. And BT have yet to announce their roll out plans with YouView too. And the user uptake on that platform alone will be interesting to see.
There's a shocker on a "they would say that wouldn't they basis"!
I agree that if you are a Sky Sports customer with BT Broadband it is pretty much a no brainer but there again BT are effectively gaining very little from those people. No BT Sports subs, no increased Broadband fee income in most cases - just securing their custom for another 12 months.
On the contrary, they are gaining large numbers of Sky subscriber email addresses they can target - lists like that are like gold dust to marketeers.
Addresses they can target for years to come. 24 carat gold dust.
Any idea of actual numbers? For broadband? For TV?
50,000? 100,000? 200,000? 500,000?
Any of the above could be considered a big number.
This channel and the fact that is is free for BT broadband customers has been advertised heavily for the last few months including during huge sporting events with millions of viewers on ITV. I think one of the ads was at half time in the FA Cup final.
There won't be many people that haven't heard of this and on that basis their signups must be in the millions.
As for how many are actually switching broadband, it is hard to guess.
I think £12 is still such a low amount for 3 premium sports channels that many will pay that rather than have the hassle of moving broadband.
I am one of the ones that switched to BT broadband for the bt sport but I have kept sky TV. It is slightly more hassle having 2 bills but i would imagine many like me will see it as the best of both both worlds because there are little perks on BT BB that sky don't offer. like the wifi that i use a lot and teh smart talk.
I bet he can't even define what would constitute a flop, and when!
I actually think BT would define success as simply keeping their current BB customers and stemming the flow of them leaving for sky. That really is the main objective here. Anything else is a bonus.
But I have a feeling that these channels are going to do very well indeed.
On the contrary, they are gaining large numbers of Sky subscriber email addresses they can target - lists like that are like gold dust to marketeers.
Addresses they can target for years to come. 24 carat gold dust.
But if you are already a BT Broadband customer (as per the point I was making) they probably, if not certainly, know your e-mail details anyway.
They are shelling out a hell of a lot in cash on sports rights and possibly going to lose over £200m a year or more on BT Sports just to get e-mail addresses? Hope it proves to be worth it.
Comments
But regardless, "flag day" was always going to be shown live.
If that's the case, why not just give the channel to everyone they can? Thus increasing the audience even further and raising the potential advertising revenue?
I do not know what you mean by this comment. BT's strategy is to retain/obtain new and existing broadband and telephony users through their new venture into the sports market.
Because ad revenue is not their core business. They want to drive telephony and broadband, The ad revenue will be an added bonus offsetting some of the costs.
But how many of those 6.3m homes will have the means to watch the broadcasts (and I mean on their TV, not online).
You have less than 1m BT Vision/YouView customers and BT&Sky customers.
How many Sky customers are interested enough to register to watch?
Judging by the comments form a market research company who contacted me a significant number.
I was asked why , having left sky tv, had i now swtitched to BT broadband. Obviously, with the free sports, it was an obvious reply.
(yes i know that the BB and phone deal was £1 a month more with BT but in any event was also free for 6 months).
The researcher let it slip that there had been a significant switch for that reason.
Sky subscribers who paid for ESPN are likely to consider the BT package as it promised more home based sports...but the significant market will come from the 7m existing existing BT BB customers who DONT have sky or have left due to the cost, and want some sport.
Unlike Setanta/ESPN and ITV beforehand ...BT hit the ground running and have a billing infrastructure in place that does not rely on sky. BT will look to develop stand alone sports channels without the need to take "entertainment" packages and thus offer a lower entry point for pay sports.
Look at what sky have been forced to do with movies. They now offer this service as a stream only to compete with Love film etc and last week Groupon were offering this at a total cost of £14.99 for 6 months.
When BT say game changing...it really will be.They just need to sort out deals with virgin etc
"BT Sport Pack £1.94
This is the cost of your BT Sport at £12.00 a month, charged in advance from 2 Aug 2013 to 6 Aug 2013
Get the best BT Sport deal with BT Broadband - www.bt.com/packages
Credit FREE BT Sport Pack -£1.94
2 Aug - 6 Aug 13
BT Sport Broadband dependent discount
For BT Broadband customers"
Approx 1m are PlusNet so don't qualify anyway.
Though total base (ie inc PlusNet) now higher than 6.3m - from memory 6.7m and that figure will already be out of date.
Surely (5/31) * 12 = £1.94 so looks correctly calculated for one "subscription".
Not sure why 1st day of August excluded?
I suggest we wait until we see some clear evidence. I wouldn't put too much store on what so called "researchers" tell you. Who was the market research being carried out for (BT by any chance?).
I am a Sky subscriber (inc Sky Sports) who paid for ESPN but primarily for US sports. To continue with BT Sports I would be asked to pay 50% more, no multiroom and possibly less US Sport. So far I am not inclined to take it up.
ESPN and Setanta could only attract around 1m paying customers each so there is little to suggest BT will do any better particularly given their free offering to Broadband subscribers.
Even if they did attract 1m paying customers at £15pm (highly questionable based on Setanta and ESPN experience and given the likely number of "free" subscribers) that is an income of only £180m per annum as against anticipated costs of £450m per annum. ie they will likely lose somewhere in excess of £200m per annum. So it is all about gaining, or not losing, broadband customers. It does not make financial sense otherwise. You wonder whether they might not have been better simply using Sky Sports as a loss leader to attract custom on that basis.
The problem when your focus is one thing (broadband) is that the thing that is key to customers (sport) becomes a secondary consideration.
I doubt that there is a significant market for pay Sport amongst those who don't already have Sky Sports and/or ESPN. Hard to say how many of its own BB customers would stay because of free BT Sports rather than changing BB suppliers to save cash, or how many will change to BT Broadband because of free BT Sports. Not as many perhaps as some might suppose I suspect. People on this forum are not typical of the population at large.
A lower entry point for pay Sport is only relevant if the sport on offer is what you want. Great for footy and rugger fans perhaps but not much value for cricket or golf or fans of other sports.
To me £15pm for BT Sports is not great value on a comparative basis against what I get from Sky Sports.
Much of what is being claimed for BT Sports was also claimed for Setanta then ESPN. I remain to be convinced that the outcome this time will be much different.
I am though open to persuasion but for now I may wait and see.
That is 1 subscription, but the same message appears 4 times!
The start date of the 2nd August did puzzle me, I'm assuming the channel will be free on August 1st?
There has been a lot of interest.
Anecdotal evidence from those working in BT call centres suggest huge interest. Their phones haven't stopped ringing.
Never underestimate the power of a "free" offer on the public.
How stupid would a sky sports customer with BT broadband be to miss out on 3 free sports channels just for the sake of a 5 minute phone call to an 0800 number?
Plenty of people making the switch from TalkTalk, Plusnet, Sky etc as well. TBH I haven't noticed many from VM just the odd one myself, although obviously can't speak on behalf of everyone. Maybe it is the hassle of moving and having a new line installed, whereas if you have a BT line in, you can chop and change as you wish?
There's a shocker on a "they would say that wouldn't they basis"!
I agree that if you are a Sky Sports customer with BT Broadband it is pretty much a no brainer but there again BT are effectively gaining very little from those people. No BT Sports subs, no increased Broadband fee income in most cases - just securing their custom for another 12 months.
BARB figures will give an indication as to audience in due course for comparison. I wonder what figures BT will release as to subscribers - wonder if they will indicate how many people are actually paying for BT Sports.
Indeed.
As it stands at the moment, its impossible to guesstimate user uptake numbers of these new channels, because so many things are still up in the air, with the negotiations with VM and TT yet to be announced. And BT have yet to announce their roll out plans with YouView too. And the user uptake on that platform alone will be interesting to see.
With a statement like that i'm sure you can back it up further with why you think it will flop?
Any idea of actual numbers? For broadband? For TV?
50,000? 100,000? 200,000? 500,000?
Any of the above could be considered a big number.
I bet he can't even define what would constitute a flop, and when!
On the contrary, they are gaining large numbers of Sky subscriber email addresses they can target - lists like that are like gold dust to marketeers.
Addresses they can target for years to come. 24 carat gold dust.
This channel and the fact that is is free for BT broadband customers has been advertised heavily for the last few months including during huge sporting events with millions of viewers on ITV. I think one of the ads was at half time in the FA Cup final.
There won't be many people that haven't heard of this and on that basis their signups must be in the millions.
As for how many are actually switching broadband, it is hard to guess.
I think £12 is still such a low amount for 3 premium sports channels that many will pay that rather than have the hassle of moving broadband.
I am one of the ones that switched to BT broadband for the bt sport but I have kept sky TV. It is slightly more hassle having 2 bills but i would imagine many like me will see it as the best of both both worlds because there are little perks on BT BB that sky don't offer. like the wifi that i use a lot and teh smart talk.
I actually think BT would define success as simply keeping their current BB customers and stemming the flow of them leaving for sky. That really is the main objective here. Anything else is a bonus.
But I have a feeling that these channels are going to do very well indeed.
But if you are already a BT Broadband customer (as per the point I was making) they probably, if not certainly, know your e-mail details anyway.
They are shelling out a hell of a lot in cash on sports rights and possibly going to lose over £200m a year or more on BT Sports just to get e-mail addresses? Hope it proves to be worth it.