The shows biggest issue is that it can't seem to decide if it wants to re-connect with Young viewers or be a 'Saturday Night Variety Show' ala Strictly and Britain's Got Talent.
been saying this for 2-3 years now, since the show started losing ground to strictly its like it cant make its mind up who its trying to appeal to anymore, it wants to market itself as a show looking to find a "current" popstar but also appeal to the SCD audience
The themes have long been an issue, time to scrap them and just let the acts sing what they want. If they keep choosing the same genre viewers will get bored so naturally they will vary it up. Instead this Saturday we will sit through another year of 'Ghostbusters' a slowed-down dramatic version of 'Thriller' and whatever else is in the 'been there, done that' song list.
themes are not the problem, song choices are the problem, last year they didn't have a single theme that forced any of the acts to sing a specific genre, era or artist and we still got crappy song choices. i agree completely that the themes this year have been poor but even then they could have picked way better songs within the themes than they did. take the theme at the weekend, afaik there was only one song used that hasn't been done to death on the show and that was the sam smith song
have you really got any confidence that if they got rid of themes that the song choices would improve?
How many acts over the years genuinely lose because they "weren't good enough?" Not many that I can think of.
The same thing will happen that happens every year on talent shows, the most talented acts will lose either due to poor song choices, being unlikable to the general public, and other spite voting reasons such as "they're not to my style so I'll vote for the act that is completely safe."
being unlikeable or not someone's style IS not being good enough on a show like this ...
i dont think james arthur was particularly likeable or to everyone's style, but he won because he was good
if you are talented enough you will stand out, if you aren't then people wont vote for you
we can argue all night about suitability of song choices but how often do we see a fan of a certain act rave about how great their favourite's song choice was when its leaked on a friday, then blame the song when the act does it terribly on a saturday, its that type of hypocrisy and refusal to accept the act themself is ever to blame that i am talking about
being unlikeable or not someone's style IS not being good enough on a show like this ...
i dont think james arthur was particularly likeable or to everyone's style, but he won because he was good
if you are talented enough you will stand out, if you aren't then people wont vote for you
we can argue all night about suitability of song choices but how often do we see a fan of a certain act rave about how great their favourite's song choice was when its leaked on a friday, then blame the song when the act does it terribly on a saturday, its that type of hypocrisy and refusal to accept the act themself is ever to blame that i am talking about
James Arthur is a rare exception to the rule, and because he actually did have a controversial style of Music and a dodgy personality for The X Factor's audience is probably the reason why he was the only winner to ever go into a bottom two as he didn't unite people into thinking that his "okay" because he does safe bland options that the audience can unite behind.
And I'm sorry but a singer with a genre is better than a moldable act that has no distinct sound at all, even if the act with a genre isn't the best within their genre it's still at least gonna appeal to Music buyers if they release good material, where as the Matt Terry's and the Ryan's won't really appeal to anybody in the Music circles.
And I'm sorry but a singer with a genre is better than a moldable act that has no distinct sound at all, even if the act with a genre isn't the best within their genre it's still at least gonna appeal to Music buyers if they release good material, where as the Matt Terry's and the Ryan's won't really appeal to anybody in the Music circles.
but the show isn't aimed at music buyers, its aimed at a saturday night TV audience that want some light entertainment listening to people doing karaoke
"good enough" isn't something that can be proven, its subjective and individual, the only thing we do know is if you dont get enough votes then you aren't "good enough" to progress on the show
and i repeat what my point has been all along that you continue to ignore, people are biased, people are not objective and this forum has a long history of fans of acts coming out with all sorts of excuses and conspiracy theories to rationalise their favourite getting eliminated. an act could sit down in the middle of the stage and armpit fart along to the backing music and their fans would still say they were thrown under the bus.
but the show isn't aimed at music buyers, its aimed at a saturday night TV audience that want some light entertainment listening to people doing karaoke
"good enough" isn't something that can be proven, its subjective and individual, the only thing we do know is if you dont get enough votes then you aren't "good enough" to progress on the show
and i repeat what my point has been all along that you continue to ignore, people are biased, people are not objective and this forum has a long history of fans of acts coming out with all sorts of excuses and conspiracy theories to rationalise their favourite getting eliminated. an act could sit down in the middle of the stage and armpit fart along to the backing music and their fans would still say they were thrown under the bus.
But the Saturday night audience are not investing into the acts after they have voted for them, so there for its basically a waste of time.
James Arthur is not a good example in my opinion. He had a sob story to make people feel sorry for him and the show went out of its way to make him seem likeable with the VTs. They even tried to portray him as some sort of sex symbol.
but the show isn't aimed at music buyers, its aimed at a saturday night TV audience that want some light entertainment listening to people doing karaoke
"good enough" isn't something that can be proven, its subjective and individual, the only thing we do know is if you dont get enough votes then you aren't "good enough" to progress on the show
and i repeat what my point has been all along that you continue to ignore, people are biased, people are not objective and this forum has a long history of fans of acts coming out with all sorts of excuses and conspiracy theories to rationalise their favourite getting eliminated. an act could sit down in the middle of the stage and armpit fart along to the backing music and their fans would still say they were thrown under the bus.
It's subjective that Relley can hold a note whilst Ryan and Honey G can't? This by the way is coming from someone that's a fan of Rock/Indie Music so there's no Music bias going on here, and I'm sure that other people can look on this objectively and see that the public voted very wrongly on what is still suppose to be a Music competition (no matter how much Simon and the other producers try to change it) that is it's core concept, and it's a joke that instead of progressing with acts like Relley C and Freddy into next week, we're instead putting up with jokes like Ryan, Honey G, 4OD, and Matt who will just falsetto every song to oblivion.
And of course there's bias on the show, People all will like different Music styles, but that's how it should be imo, voting for an act just because they're moldable and don't do genres to offend the audience shouldn't really be progressing in the competition imo because as someone that really likes Music and can appreciate all Music styles if done well, it goes against the grain for me to accept some of these singers going far.
It's subjective that Relley can hold a note whilst Ryan and Honey G can't? This by the way is coming from someone that's a fan of Rock/Indie Music so there's no Music bias going on here, and I'm sure that other people can look on this objectively and see that the public voted very wrongly on what is still suppose to be a Music competition (no matter how much Simon and the other producers try to change it) that is it's core concept, and it's a joke that instead of progressing with acts like Relley C and Freddy into next week, we're instead putting up with jokes like Ryan, Honey G, 4OD, and Matt who will just falsetto every song to oblivion.
And of course there's bias on the show, People all will like different Music styles, but that's how it should be imo, voting for an act just because they're moldable and don't do genres to offend the audience shouldn't really be progressing in the competition imo because as someone that really likes Music and can appreciate all Music styles if done well, it goes against the grain for me to accept some of these singers going far.
i suggest you go back and read the first line of my last post ...
of course relley is a better singer than those acts but she wasn't GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her therefore she ended up in the sing off
if she was GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her then she wouldn't have been in the sing off
this is tiresome so i'll duck out of this thread now
i suggest you go back and read the first line of my last post ...
of course relley is a better singer than those acts but she wasn't GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her therefore she ended up in the sing off
if she was GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her then she wouldn't have been in the sing off
this is tiresome so i'll duck out of this thread now
If there was just a straight forward bottom two as there should be there would be no need to have all this hastle. The worst two acts would be going home.
I guess there will always be people who refuse to see how the show casts and manipulates!
But these people are becoming less and less which imo is why XF ratings are dropping year on year! Most are now able to see that the show is wholly disingenuous.
I envy them in all honesty how I'd love to return to the days when i believed people just queued to audition straight in front of the judges, that the chosen ones jetted off to be their respective judges actual house guest and that the judges spent all day every day coaching their acts and really cared about them.
I guess there will always be people who refuse to see how the show casts and manipulates!
But these people are becoming less and less which imo is why XF ratings are dropping year on year! Most are now able to see that the show is wholly disingenuous.
I envy them in all honesty how I'd love to return to the days when i believed people just queued to audition straight in front of the judges, that the chosen ones jetted off to be their respective judges actual house guest and that the judges spent all day every day coaching their acts and really cared about them.
yeah coz someone who makes a post like this in another thread today is obviously so naive about how the show is fixed and couldn't possibly think that a personal friend of a contestant is so biased they are looking for excuses as to why she was eliminated rather than just accept she wasn't good enough
i think it does matter and its a bit of an own goal
one of the big criticisms that gets made about the show is how fixed it is, and that aspect has been blamed for it losing viewers, and so they introduce a feature that is about as genuine as sharon osborne's face, that just draws even more attention to how fixed the show is
yeah coz someone who makes a post like this in another thread today is obviously so naive about how the show is fixed and couldn't possibly think that a personal friend of a contestant is so biased they are looking for excuses as to why she was eliminated rather than just accept she wasn't good enough
You know what I'm a tad tired of you and your insinuations, I really have no idea what your issue is and quite frankly i couldn't give a hoot what you think!
You know what I'm a tad tired of you and your insinuations, I really have no idea what your issue is and quite frankly i couldn't give a hoot what you think!
ah you accuse people of being too naive to realise that the show is manipulated and then cant hack it when they respond in kind ...
You know what I'm a tad tired of you and your insinuations, I really have no idea what your issue is and quite frankly i couldn't give a hoot what you think!
ah you accuse people of being too naive to realise that the show is manipulated and then cant hack it when they respond in kind ...
cya then
I am happy to have an open discussion with anyone but when a persons tone becomes accusatory, condescending and verging on rude you must excuse me as I'd prefer to opt out
I am happy to have an open discussion with anyone but when a persons tone becomes accusatory, condescending and verging on rude you must excuse me as I'd prefer to opt out
i'm happy to have an open discussion as well, but when someone is so blinded by their personal relationship to a contestant that they ignore any alternative opinion that is obviously impossible
i suggest you go back and read the first line of my last post ...
of course relley is a better singer than those acts but she wasn't GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her therefore she ended up in the sing off
if she was GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her then she wouldn't have been in the sing off
this is tiresome so i'll duck out of this thread now
BIB is fair enough if you think that the public genuinely voted on the performances and they thought that Ryan stoodout more than Relley C.
However how do you explain the judges not saving Relley C when they had the chance? 4OD are an average girl group at best, they didn't deserve to beat Relley C and were only marginally better than Relley in the sing-off, yet the judges saved them with not even a deadlock credibility for Relley.
i'm happy to have an open discussion as well, but when someone is so blinded by their personal relationship to a contestant that they ignore any alternative opinion that is obviously impossible
Or perhaps blinkered by information received as a result of said relationship!!! along with having been an avid sofabet reader for a number of months
Relley left because the public didn't like her enough to save her. Not in the main vote and not in the lifeline vote. Why blame the show for how the public vote?
Personally, I'm really happy Four of Diamonds got through (although not so happy they were in the bottom two).
As for Honey G . They put her in because they thought the public would like her and they were right. It's the public who keep saving her not the judges. If the judges save her once she hits the bottom two then you can legitimately blame them for poor judgement but not before.
Do you work for the show? Everything you say is very on-message...
Natalie, the whats really going on thread is in these forums, just look the first few pages.
Thrombin, based on your post, you clearly did not read said thread, or you would realize I was not just talking about Relley, or anyone.
It IS easy to say you are anyone in a forum, but several other forum members here know that I am legit and how I have the knowledge I have. Again, I am not upset about any one contestant , even those I know personally, who were treated badly and misrepresented(see whats really going on thread,ds forum). I am upset about ALL of the talented artists who were denied the FAIR exposure , being seen and heard as they truly are, when they EARNED it and were pretty much led to believe they'd get it.
Do you work for the show? Everything you say is very on-message...
TBH I think this guy talks out of his rearend, anyone who still thinks or pretends to think the judges actually choose whose going to the lives is either seriously retarded or as you say, workin for the show in one way or another
Natalie, the whats really going on thread is in these forums, just look the first few pages.
Thrombin, based on your post, you clearly did not read said thread, or you would realize I was not just talking about Relley, or anyone.
It IS easy to say you are anyone in a forum, but several other forum members here know that I am legit and how I have the knowledge I have. Again, I am not upset about any one contestant , even those I know personally, who were treated badly and misrepresented(see whats really going on thread,ds forum). I am upset about ALL of the talented artists who were denied the FAIR exposure , being seen and heard as they truly are, when they EARNED it and were pretty much led to believe they'd get it.
Your sudden stance on this is confusing me. Many of us have been talking for years about the shady way they undermine various contestants for a few years now. Yet you, who has insider knowledge on how it all works apparently, has only just decided to be upset? It never bothered you before when talented contestants were considered disposable by the show and lost out on a few more weeks exposure for whatever agenda the producers were pursuing in that particular week? Because that's happened lots.
Relley was one of the better singers this year for sure. But she's not the first to have lost out to less accomplished acts who either have a 'hook' or are just favoured by the show for whatever reason. And she's certainly not had the harshest of treatments at the hand of the producers compared to many.
Your sudden stance on this is confusing me. Many of us have been talking for years about the shady way they undermine various contestants for a few years now. Yet you, who has insider knowledge on how it all works apparently, has only just decided to be upset? It never bothered you before when talented contestants were considered disposable by the show and lost out on a few more weeks exposure for whatever agenda the producers were pursuing in that particular week? Because that's happened lots.
Relley was one of the better singers this year for sure. But she's not the first to have lost out to less accomplished acts who either have a 'hook' or are just favoured by the show for whatever reason. And she's certainly not had the harshest of treatments at the hand of the producers compared to many.
I will assume ,based on your aposts showing a lack of knowing what I said or when,that you did not read my other posts about these things,which go back to well before the lives,or read them in this thread clearly.
Obviously I did NOT "just" decide to "be upset". Read some of my previous posts. I only just decided to post about how it really is in detail this year, because they really took it too far. I did so well befoe Relley .If you actually read the whats really going om thread,you will see that I actually said plenty that makes what you just posted not apply to me at all.
Again: It isn't about Relley, or Nate, or Anelisa or anyone in particular, and if you read the other thread, it may just open your eyes to things many are actually unable to talk about, and why.
TBH I think this guy talks out of his rearend, anyone who still thinks or pretends to think the judges actually choose whose going to the lives is either seriously retarded or as you say, workin for the show in one way or another
I don't buy into some of the conspiracy theories, but I thought it was fairly understood by now the producers choose the finalists, or the judges do it with their "help". I think enough of the judges, contestants and those who've approached to be judges have alluded to this or said something directly.
I think it's interesting that I've come across posters using specific phrases or wording under different usernames. I remember last year somebody was called out on the fact they were making identical anti-Strictly and pro-X-Factor posts on both forums and had never posted on other topics. He disappeared shortly after that.
I don't buy into some of the conspiracy theories, but I thought it was fairly understood by now the producers choose the finalists, or the judges do it with their "help". I think enough of the judges, contestants and those who've approached to be judges have alluded to this or said something directly.
I think it's interesting that I've come across posters using specific phrases or wording under different usernames. I remember last year somebody was called out on the fact they were making identical anti-Strictly and pro-X-Factor posts on both forums and had never posted on other topics. He disappeared shortly after that.
Interesting point Drakhen and one that i'd not even considered before!
Comments
been saying this for 2-3 years now, since the show started losing ground to strictly its like it cant make its mind up who its trying to appeal to anymore, it wants to market itself as a show looking to find a "current" popstar but also appeal to the SCD audience
themes are not the problem, song choices are the problem, last year they didn't have a single theme that forced any of the acts to sing a specific genre, era or artist and we still got crappy song choices. i agree completely that the themes this year have been poor but even then they could have picked way better songs within the themes than they did. take the theme at the weekend, afaik there was only one song used that hasn't been done to death on the show and that was the sam smith song
have you really got any confidence that if they got rid of themes that the song choices would improve?
i dont
being unlikeable or not someone's style IS not being good enough on a show like this ...
i dont think james arthur was particularly likeable or to everyone's style, but he won because he was good
if you are talented enough you will stand out, if you aren't then people wont vote for you
we can argue all night about suitability of song choices but how often do we see a fan of a certain act rave about how great their favourite's song choice was when its leaked on a friday, then blame the song when the act does it terribly on a saturday, its that type of hypocrisy and refusal to accept the act themself is ever to blame that i am talking about
James Arthur is a rare exception to the rule, and because he actually did have a controversial style of Music and a dodgy personality for The X Factor's audience is probably the reason why he was the only winner to ever go into a bottom two as he didn't unite people into thinking that his "okay" because he does safe bland options that the audience can unite behind.
And I'm sorry but a singer with a genre is better than a moldable act that has no distinct sound at all, even if the act with a genre isn't the best within their genre it's still at least gonna appeal to Music buyers if they release good material, where as the Matt Terry's and the Ryan's won't really appeal to anybody in the Music circles.
but the show isn't aimed at music buyers, its aimed at a saturday night TV audience that want some light entertainment listening to people doing karaoke
"good enough" isn't something that can be proven, its subjective and individual, the only thing we do know is if you dont get enough votes then you aren't "good enough" to progress on the show
and i repeat what my point has been all along that you continue to ignore, people are biased, people are not objective and this forum has a long history of fans of acts coming out with all sorts of excuses and conspiracy theories to rationalise their favourite getting eliminated. an act could sit down in the middle of the stage and armpit fart along to the backing music and their fans would still say they were thrown under the bus.
But the Saturday night audience are not investing into the acts after they have voted for them, so there for its basically a waste of time.
It's subjective that Relley can hold a note whilst Ryan and Honey G can't? This by the way is coming from someone that's a fan of Rock/Indie Music so there's no Music bias going on here, and I'm sure that other people can look on this objectively and see that the public voted very wrongly on what is still suppose to be a Music competition (no matter how much Simon and the other producers try to change it) that is it's core concept, and it's a joke that instead of progressing with acts like Relley C and Freddy into next week, we're instead putting up with jokes like Ryan, Honey G, 4OD, and Matt who will just falsetto every song to oblivion.
And of course there's bias on the show, People all will like different Music styles, but that's how it should be imo, voting for an act just because they're moldable and don't do genres to offend the audience shouldn't really be progressing in the competition imo because as someone that really likes Music and can appreciate all Music styles if done well, it goes against the grain for me to accept some of these singers going far.
i suggest you go back and read the first line of my last post ...
of course relley is a better singer than those acts but she wasn't GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her therefore she ended up in the sing off
if she was GOOD ENOUGH to stand out and get people to vote for her then she wouldn't have been in the sing off
this is tiresome so i'll duck out of this thread now
If there was just a straight forward bottom two as there should be there would be no need to have all this hastle. The worst two acts would be going home.
But these people are becoming less and less which imo is why XF ratings are dropping year on year! Most are now able to see that the show is wholly disingenuous.
I envy them in all honesty how I'd love to return to the days when i believed people just queued to audition straight in front of the judges, that the chosen ones jetted off to be their respective judges actual house guest and that the judges spent all day every day coaching their acts and really cared about them.
yeah coz someone who makes a post like this in another thread today is obviously so naive about how the show is fixed and couldn't possibly think that a personal friend of a contestant is so biased they are looking for excuses as to why she was eliminated rather than just accept she wasn't good enough
You know what I'm a tad tired of you and your insinuations, I really have no idea what your issue is and quite frankly i couldn't give a hoot what you think!
ah you accuse people of being too naive to realise that the show is manipulated and then cant hack it when they respond in kind ...
cya then
I agree with you regarding this.
I am happy to have an open discussion with anyone but when a persons tone becomes accusatory, condescending and verging on rude you must excuse me as I'd prefer to opt out
i'm happy to have an open discussion as well, but when someone is so blinded by their personal relationship to a contestant that they ignore any alternative opinion that is obviously impossible
BIB is fair enough if you think that the public genuinely voted on the performances and they thought that Ryan stoodout more than Relley C.
However how do you explain the judges not saving Relley C when they had the chance? 4OD are an average girl group at best, they didn't deserve to beat Relley C and were only marginally better than Relley in the sing-off, yet the judges saved them with not even a deadlock credibility for Relley.
Or perhaps blinkered by information received as a result of said relationship!!! along with having been an avid sofabet reader for a number of months
Do you work for the show? Everything you say is very on-message...
Thrombin, based on your post, you clearly did not read said thread, or you would realize I was not just talking about Relley, or anyone.
It IS easy to say you are anyone in a forum, but several other forum members here know that I am legit and how I have the knowledge I have. Again, I am not upset about any one contestant , even those I know personally, who were treated badly and misrepresented(see whats really going on thread,ds forum). I am upset about ALL of the talented artists who were denied the FAIR exposure , being seen and heard as they truly are, when they EARNED it and were pretty much led to believe they'd get it.
Your sudden stance on this is confusing me. Many of us have been talking for years about the shady way they undermine various contestants for a few years now. Yet you, who has insider knowledge on how it all works apparently, has only just decided to be upset? It never bothered you before when talented contestants were considered disposable by the show and lost out on a few more weeks exposure for whatever agenda the producers were pursuing in that particular week? Because that's happened lots.
Relley was one of the better singers this year for sure. But she's not the first to have lost out to less accomplished acts who either have a 'hook' or are just favoured by the show for whatever reason. And she's certainly not had the harshest of treatments at the hand of the producers compared to many.
I will assume ,based on your aposts showing a lack of knowing what I said or when,that you did not read my other posts about these things,which go back to well before the lives,or read them in this thread clearly.
Obviously I did NOT "just" decide to "be upset". Read some of my previous posts. I only just decided to post about how it really is in detail this year, because they really took it too far. I did so well befoe Relley .If you actually read the whats really going om thread,you will see that I actually said plenty that makes what you just posted not apply to me at all.
Again: It isn't about Relley, or Nate, or Anelisa or anyone in particular, and if you read the other thread, it may just open your eyes to things many are actually unable to talk about, and why.
I don't buy into some of the conspiracy theories, but I thought it was fairly understood by now the producers choose the finalists, or the judges do it with their "help". I think enough of the judges, contestants and those who've approached to be judges have alluded to this or said something directly.
I think it's interesting that I've come across posters using specific phrases or wording under different usernames. I remember last year somebody was called out on the fact they were making identical anti-Strictly and pro-X-Factor posts on both forums and had never posted on other topics. He disappeared shortly after that.
Interesting point Drakhen and one that i'd not even considered before!