What I never understood is why was Darke dropped from Monday Night Football (at start of 1995/96 season I think) in favour of Hawthorne? Darke had done MNF for the first 3 years of Sky's Premiership coverage.
He then did no main Sky football (other than a bit of Champions League interactive coverage of minor games) until suddenly reappearing in a prominent role in January 2005. All seems very odd.
Ian Darke was taken off mnf because of skys extra boxing coverage at the time hence bringing in rob hawthorne but now as sky have lost alot of big boxing coverage they have give ian darke the chance to do more commentry and from wat i have heard he will be back through out the comming season covering a lot of big games along with rob hawtorne and occasonlly martin tyler but noway on the scale that he used to rule the roost at sky sports
Sorry to repeat the debate at the end of last season earlier in the thread but does anyone now know the position for sure with Tyler.
There was speculation earlier in the thread that he was going to be joining the BBC this season and that that was the reason for him doing fewer big games at the end of last season on Sky.
It now appears that this speculation was wrong and that he is still at Sky.
So is it that Sky are now just sharing the big games around with Tyler, Darke and Hawthorne being treated equally?
Or is it that Tyler will now do fewer big games than Darke and Hawthorne? If so why? Surely he can't be considered an inferior commentator to Darke and Hawthorne so there would have to be some other reason.
This is the question that no-one has successfully answered. There could be any number of plausible reasons for the reduction in Tyler's participation (maybe he is going to retire, perhaps he is refusing to extend his contract with Sky beyond the end of this season) but it's the not knowing that really bothers me.
I have spoken to a lot of people about it, and it even seems to be causing confusion within the industry. By chance, I met Alan Green at the FA Cup Semi-Finals last year in Cardiff, now Alan works for 5 Live of course, but is normally sitting adjacent to Martin. He was confused as to the situation to.
What he did say is that no-one gets on with Andy Gray, too arrogant, including Tyler - and we speculated if that was the cause. But, they've worked together for 10 years, so surely that's unlikely? At the time, he even wondered if Tyler would be taken off the FA Cup Final. In the event, he wasn't, but he was taken off Liverpool's Champions League final, which was a bigger thing anyway!
I've got a mate who knows a very well-known Sky presenter, and I've asked him to ask him (if you get me). But he's out of the country at the moment with Sky, so I'll have to wait a couple of weeks to hear back. I'll let you know.
The following was on Football365. Someone wrote to Sky and received the following reply. I presume that the Ian Darke comments were added by the guy who asked the question and not Sky
" Thanks for your e-mail about Martin Tyler. I was concerned to read that you feel he is being phased out. Please allow me to explain. Sky have many talented commentators and we are spreading the matches out a bit. It's very hard for commentators to prepare and perform if the games come as thick and fast as they do with Sky Sports
'Ian ('should stick to pay per view boxing') Darke is one of the best commentators in the business and we are involving him more. However, you have my assurance that Martin is still very much part of the Sky Sports team.
'I hope this information helps and thanks for taking the time to contact Sky.'
There you go - Tyler has been demoted. Sky are making a big mistake. Darke, like a lot of other commentators, clearly annoys people. You rarely hear people complain about Tyler. He was the same quality as Brian Moore - that they are almost universally liked.
There you go - Tyler has been demoted. Sky are making a big mistake. Darke, like a lot of other commentators, clearly annoys people. You rarely hear people complain about Tyler. He was the same quality as Brian Moore - that they are almost universally liked.
To be honest Martin tyler was a very good commentator in his day but no one is invincible and i think if like everyone is saying and the guy is no longer happy in his role at sky then im sure other channels would soon snap him up if they were intrested in the guy but even last season when he was taken off most of the big games skys viewing figures didnt drop in fact their champions league final they had their best ever figures so im afraid hawthorne and darke must be doing something right and i think its time for us all to get used to sky commentry not comming exculsivly from martin tyler although as ive said before if anyone on sky is annoying in commentry its "i aslways butt in Andy Gray"
their champions league final they had their best ever figures so im afraid hawthorne and darke must be doing something right and i think its time for us all to get used to sky commentry not comming exculsivly from martin tyler although as ive said before if anyone on sky is annoying in commentry its "i aslways butt in Andy Gray"
I don't have to get used to anybody. Darke annoys me - and that's not going to change. But commentator's have no effect on ratings if people don't have a choice. It is just a bonus if the commentator is good. Liverpool being in the CL final is the reason the ratings were good.
Here in Ireland we have the choice of watching the Champions League on RTE on Wednesday nights - Tyler & Gray would be the only reason I'd watch it on Sky. Normally I watch the panellists on RTE and switch over to Sky for Tyler & Gray, but now I'll just stick with RTE for the game too. So having an irritating commentator is not a victimless crime
it wouldn't surpise me if TYLER moves to Setanta sports in the near future
I think that may be a good possibility as im sure like any football commentator he would like to be back doing all big games and any channell needing one may well look no further than tyler.
Interesting, that letter from Sky saying that they are "spreading the games out a bit". If that's true, how come Andy Gray is on every game?
I know what you're going to say -- Gray's only a summariser, therefore doesn't need to prepare so much. But that's just not true - Sky actually brand both voices as "co-commentators". Gray's just a slightly annoying one - aside from his genius "oh you beauty" moment after Gerrard's wondergoal last year.
Who said that changing commentators hasn't affected Sky's figures? The argument was that Sky has their best ever figures for the Champions League final last season. Might that have been because:
(a) Liverpool were in it; and
(b) there's more Sky subscribers now than in 1999 when Manchester United were the last English team in the final (not even sure that was on Sky, anyway).
So, hardly a surprise that they got good figures for that, is it?
Sky didn't have their best ever figures for the Champions League final last season.
They got 1.5 million - that's 700,000 than the best the have had for a football match in the past... and it wasn't even their highest-rated Champions League game of the season (although that was more due to it being shown on ITV as well).
I personally think that Rob Hawthorne has improved over the last few years. Maybe in the beginning he had problems adjusting from radio and said too much. It probably didn't help that he had Trevor Francis next to him.
Martin Tyler has been constantly good for over 20 years. Maybe with the Champions League and extra matches, he just couldn't face all these matches. Remember the CL final was three days before the US tour by England.(Crap money spinning tour , though) Maybe he insists that he is the voice for England games on Sky
I always prefered him to Brian Moore on ITV but that maybe an age thing. I do think that commentators in football loose it after a period of time. Barry Davies was garbage for the last few years. Very patronising.
Ian Darke was good 10 years ago, in the old analogue years, but since he came back, he seems to miss things and talks over , or misses the points that Andy Gray or Alan Smith say
If you want to hear great commentry during tournments, you should listen to the insane world of Steve Claridge on BBCI. It's not commentry on the match. Just his comments with a Radio 5 sports presentors and his response to emails. Very Entertaining.
If you want to hear great commentry during tournments, you should listen to the insane world of Steve Claridge on BBCI. It's not commentry on the match. Just his comments with a Radio 5 sports presentors and his response to emails. Very Entertaining.
Claridge is also now on Sky and often pops up on "You're on Sky Sports".
He was in fact a panelist on the Cardiff game tonight as well!
Looks like Tyler and Darke have got the two big games for the openers on sky today if sharing the games out is correct as parry and hawthorne got the two ppv games yesterday and ive also read that tyler is covering the denmark englang game next week so its not all bad news for martin tyler
"Interestingly on ITV's The Championship they had Martin Tyler commentating on some old footage of Man Utd vs Arsenal...not sure if he was there at the time though
Martin Tylers been around ....
more info here , he was an ex yorkshire tv sports commentator
How funny that after all this debate Tyler does the main game (Wigan v Chelsea) and Darke does the second game (Arsenal v Newcastle).
I guess we can conclude that this suggests he is at least still on a par with Darke and Hawthorne otherwise surely he wouldn't have got the main game on the first weekend of the season.
Great to hear him back with Andy Grey IMO. Hopefully will stay that way. In a way, I was surprised he was given 1st main game after he didn't do the CL final or Shield last week
I know it was the 4pm kick off, but was it really the "main" game. I know that's the way sky seemed to be treating it but surely Arsenal-Newcastle was a bigger game (though Wigan-Chelsea turned out to be one of the best televised games for a while in my opinion - edge of seat stuff). It was good to hear Tyler and Gray back together again. Hopefully it will carry on this way sometimes together, sometimes apart and a good rotation of commentary teams.
I know it was the 4pm kick off, but was it really the "main" game. I know that's the way sky seemed to be treating it but surely Arsenal-Newcastle was a bigger game (though Wigan-Chelsea turned out to be one of the best televised games for a while in my opinion - edge of seat stuff). It was good to hear Tyler and Gray back together again. Hopefully it will carry on this way sometimes together, sometimes apart and a good rotation of commentary teams.
Well said and written and coundnt agree with you more infact i thought both tyler and darke had good games and yes i think for sure sky have kept to their word and will rotate their commentators although i do hope alan parry will stick to all ppv games as listenting to him on saturday nearly put me to sleep with all his non-stop facts and figures and as far as martin tyler goes its just a shame that andy gray doesnt stop cutting over him when hes in full flow on commentry.
As for next weeks big Sunday game my money has to be on Rob Hawthorne to do the commentry.
I would like Martin Tyler and Andy Gray to be covering Sunday's game between Chelsea and Arsenal.
Looks like you'll be disappointed.
Tyler was originally down for that game, but after last weekend's neutrality lapse he was switched to a game which "won't give him an opportunity to express his personal feelings about Chelsea"
Tyler was originally down for that game, but after last weekend's neutrality lapse he was switched to a game which "won't give him an opportunity to express his personal feelings about Chelsea"
what is the source of your quote?
After watching the promo for the Super Sunday matches, I noticed Tyler's voice was used only for a couple of words, whereas Ian Darke and Tony Jones or John Anderson's voices (I can't remember exactly) were used as part of the promo, so I was less optimistic after that.
Comments
Ian Darke was taken off mnf because of skys extra boxing coverage at the time hence bringing in rob hawthorne but now as sky have lost alot of big boxing coverage they have give ian darke the chance to do more commentry and from wat i have heard he will be back through out the comming season covering a lot of big games along with rob hawtorne and occasonlly martin tyler but noway on the scale that he used to rule the roost at sky sports
There was speculation earlier in the thread that he was going to be joining the BBC this season and that that was the reason for him doing fewer big games at the end of last season on Sky.
It now appears that this speculation was wrong and that he is still at Sky.
So is it that Sky are now just sharing the big games around with Tyler, Darke and Hawthorne being treated equally?
Or is it that Tyler will now do fewer big games than Darke and Hawthorne? If so why? Surely he can't be considered an inferior commentator to Darke and Hawthorne so there would have to be some other reason.
I have spoken to a lot of people about it, and it even seems to be causing confusion within the industry. By chance, I met Alan Green at the FA Cup Semi-Finals last year in Cardiff, now Alan works for 5 Live of course, but is normally sitting adjacent to Martin. He was confused as to the situation to.
What he did say is that no-one gets on with Andy Gray, too arrogant, including Tyler - and we speculated if that was the cause. But, they've worked together for 10 years, so surely that's unlikely? At the time, he even wondered if Tyler would be taken off the FA Cup Final. In the event, he wasn't, but he was taken off Liverpool's Champions League final, which was a bigger thing anyway!
I've got a mate who knows a very well-known Sky presenter, and I've asked him to ask him (if you get me). But he's out of the country at the moment with Sky, so I'll have to wait a couple of weeks to hear back. I'll let you know.
" Thanks for your e-mail about Martin Tyler. I was concerned to read that you feel he is being phased out. Please allow me to explain. Sky have many talented commentators and we are spreading the matches out a bit. It's very hard for commentators to prepare and perform if the games come as thick and fast as they do with Sky Sports
'Ian ('should stick to pay per view boxing') Darke is one of the best commentators in the business and we are involving him more. However, you have my assurance that Martin is still very much part of the Sky Sports team.
'I hope this information helps and thanks for taking the time to contact Sky.'
To be honest Martin tyler was a very good commentator in his day but no one is invincible and i think if like everyone is saying and the guy is no longer happy in his role at sky then im sure other channels would soon snap him up if they were intrested in the guy but even last season when he was taken off most of the big games skys viewing figures didnt drop in fact their champions league final they had their best ever figures so im afraid hawthorne and darke must be doing something right and i think its time for us all to get used to sky commentry not comming exculsivly from martin tyler although as ive said before if anyone on sky is annoying in commentry its "i aslways butt in Andy Gray"
I don't have to get used to anybody. Darke annoys me - and that's not going to change. But commentator's have no effect on ratings if people don't have a choice. It is just a bonus if the commentator is good. Liverpool being in the CL final is the reason the ratings were good.
Here in Ireland we have the choice of watching the Champions League on RTE on Wednesday nights - Tyler & Gray would be the only reason I'd watch it on Sky. Normally I watch the panellists on RTE and switch over to Sky for Tyler & Gray, but now I'll just stick with RTE for the game too. So having an irritating commentator is not a victimless crime
It would suprise me though! lol...:p.
I know what you're going to say -- Gray's only a summariser, therefore doesn't need to prepare so much. But that's just not true - Sky actually brand both voices as "co-commentators". Gray's just a slightly annoying one - aside from his genius "oh you beauty" moment after Gerrard's wondergoal last year.
Who said that changing commentators hasn't affected Sky's figures? The argument was that Sky has their best ever figures for the Champions League final last season. Might that have been because:
(a) Liverpool were in it; and
(b) there's more Sky subscribers now than in 1999 when Manchester United were the last English team in the final (not even sure that was on Sky, anyway).
So, hardly a surprise that they got good figures for that, is it?
They got 1.5 million - that's 700,000 than the best the have had for a football match in the past... and it wasn't even their highest-rated Champions League game of the season (although that was more due to it being shown on ITV as well).
Martin Tyler has been constantly good for over 20 years. Maybe with the Champions League and extra matches, he just couldn't face all these matches. Remember the CL final was three days before the US tour by England.(Crap money spinning tour , though) Maybe he insists that he is the voice for England games on Sky
I always prefered him to Brian Moore on ITV but that maybe an age thing. I do think that commentators in football loose it after a period of time. Barry Davies was garbage for the last few years. Very patronising.
Ian Darke was good 10 years ago, in the old analogue years, but since he came back, he seems to miss things and talks over , or misses the points that Andy Gray or Alan Smith say
If you want to hear great commentry during tournments, you should listen to the insane world of Steve Claridge on BBCI. It's not commentry on the match. Just his comments with a Radio 5 sports presentors and his response to emails. Very Entertaining.
Claridge is also now on Sky and often pops up on "You're on Sky Sports".
He was in fact a panelist on the Cardiff game tonight as well!
Edit: Was that insane world or inane world!
Martin Tylers been around ....
more info here , he was an ex yorkshire tv sports commentator
http://tenseasons.premierleague.com/en/tenseasons/commentatorofthedecade.jsp
I guess we can conclude that this suggests he is at least still on a par with Darke and Hawthorne otherwise surely he wouldn't have got the main game on the first weekend of the season.
Well said and written and coundnt agree with you more infact i thought both tyler and darke had good games and yes i think for sure sky have kept to their word and will rotate their commentators although i do hope alan parry will stick to all ppv games as listenting to him on saturday nearly put me to sleep with all his non-stop facts and figures and as far as martin tyler goes its just a shame that andy gray doesnt stop cutting over him when hes in full flow on commentry.
As for next weeks big Sunday game my money has to be on Rob Hawthorne to do the commentry.
If not, I would guess that it will be Ian Darke/Andy Gray instead who are the commentators.
Looks like you'll be disappointed.
Tyler was originally down for that game, but after last weekend's neutrality lapse he was switched to a game which "won't give him an opportunity to express his personal feelings about Chelsea"
what is the source of your quote?
After watching the promo for the Super Sunday matches, I noticed Tyler's voice was used only for a couple of words, whereas Ian Darke and Tony Jones or John Anderson's voices (I can't remember exactly) were used as part of the promo, so I was less optimistic after that.
Tyler has covered England's matches for as long as I can remember!