A lot of us could write lengthy tomes about being groped and having to slap older blokes swiftly or escaping from attacks by complete strangers in broad daylight from the age of thirteen but I'm not sure if Vanessa Feltz is trying to be supportive of actual victims or she's unwittingly diffusing the situation by joining in the scrum.
I think it's best left just to the victims who were underage at the time to relate to the police what happened rather than for celebs to leap out of the woodwork relating their stories. It's not irrelevant but it's a more general issue ie ' Should men keep their hands off women who don't want to be groped'. Yes- but that's not as relevant at the moment I think as finding out who Jimmy Saville knew resulting in his confidence that he'd get away with it. That's the bigger story.
I'm no fan of Feltz, but I don't understand all the questions about why she didn't notify anyone, she says it in the article, no-one would have believed her against this bastion of the establishment. That's why she's mentioning it now, sympathising with others who felt they couldn't speak out.
So we wouldn't believe her if she said who it was? And why should we believe her if she doesn't have the courage to say who it was? It's a nonsense I'm afraid.
I just don't get this attitude that still prevails that some people are so important and bastions of the establishment that they are untouchable. This is precisely the load of crap that enabled Jimmy Savile to get away with things for his whole life. Now people talk about removing his knighthood etc. as if it's ever going to matter to him now. He's dead and he got away with it scot-free because people thought that his television celebrity and charity work made him some kind of saint that could never be questioned.
Surely, if we can learn anything from the Jimmy Savile story it is that NOBODY is whiter than white.
It does rather smack of 'jumping on the bandwagon'. I'm not completely comfortable with all the 'celebrities' speaking out via the media now about their own random experiences (not that I disbelieve them). Although I'm not implicating Vanessa Feltz, some will do anything to revive their flagging careers and although not lying, airing their experiences for the wrong reasons.
As Stockingfiller says, the current major issue is with the abuse of underage children among celebrity circles. Female celebrities coming forward to the press and social media and relating how they were groped back in some past incident- unless the same people were involved- is muddying the waters, to a degree. Instead of conveying what happened to the media, if they have concerns they should perhaps either make a formal complaint or report what happened to the police. No, they might not have any realistic chance of a prosecution if 'evidence' is minimal or if an incident happened a long time ago and yes, it could be extremely difficult for them but they would be setting an example for others.
All of this has made me wonder if there are any male celebrities/ high profile personalities who were molested either as children or in their adult years while working in media/entertainment. I'm guessing that there are but imagine it would be much harder for them to speak out- whether formally or via the media.
She said he was twanging her knicker elastic, how did he get his hand up her skirt? She always wore straight skirts which on sitting down would become too tight for a hand to gain entry, let alone travel further upwards to her elastic knickers. A magician was it?
Ulrika Jonsson, having gained notoriety as a mere Weather Autocue Reader, has already tried the scam.... relying on her friendship with Matthew Wright to out an alleged rapist, damn well destroying his broadcasting career, coincidentally (or not) tied into a Book Promotion Tour.
Unfortunately, the police were never notified at the time, evidence was never collated, suspects never interviewed, corroborational testimony never extracted, no charges brought, and hence, no alleged perpetrator was ever submitted to judicial process, with any case "Proven beyond any reasonable doubt".
Perhaps broadcasters should adopt a fair approach.... blacklisting both those perpetrators who have been brought to justice, and blacklisting those perpetrators who accuse the innocent of haneous crimes.
Was Ulrika better friends with Matthew than his fellow John Noel client?
She said he was twanging her knicker elastic, how did he get his hand up her skirt? She always wore straight skirts which on sitting down would become too tight for a hand to gain entry, let alone travel further upwards to her elastic knickers. A magician was it?
If, as has been mentioned, this occurred while she was on the Big Breakfast, she wouldn't have been sitting down. She did her interviews lying on a bed.
Ulrika Jonsson, having gained notoriety as a mere Weather Autocue Reader, has already tried the scam.... relying on her friendship with Matthew Wright to out an alleged rapist, damn well destroying his broadcasting career, coincidentally (or not) tied into a Book Promotion Tour.
Unfortunately, the police were never notified at the time, evidence was never collated, suspects never interviewed, corroborational testimony never extracted, no charges brought, and hence, no alleged perpetrator was ever submitted to judicial process, with any case "Proven beyond any reasonable doubt".
Perhaps broadcasters should adopt a fair approach.... blacklisting both those perpetrators who have been brought to justice, and blacklisting those perpetrators who accuse the innocent of haneous crimes.
It's true that Ulrika chose not to report the matter, but as a result of this publicity two other women did come forward and reported John Leslie who was subsequently arrested.
It's true that Ulrika chose not to report the matter, but as a result of this publicity two other women did come forward and reported John Leslie who was subsequently arrested.
And not charged presumably owing to lack of evidence. So his career is destroyed for nothing. IF he is innocent how is that justice for him?
IMO he was well within his rght to go after them and sue them for loss of earnings which considering what he was earning at the time would have destroyed their lives.
And not charged presumably owing to lack of evidence. So his career is destroyed for nothing. IF he is innocent how is that justice for him?
IMO he was well within his rght to go after them and sue them for loss of earnings which considering what he was earning at the time would have destroyed their lives.
Lack of evidence to bring a case does not automatically mean a crime was not committed.
I don't believe the exact reasons Leslie was not brought to court were ever placed in the public domain.
A lot of us could write lengthy tomes about being groped and having to slap older blokes swiftly or escaping from attacks by complete strangers in broad daylight from the age of thirteen but I'm not sure if Vanessa Feltz is trying to be supportive of actual victims or she's unwittingly diffusing the situation by joining in the scrum.
I think it's best left just to the victims who were underage at the time to relate to the police what happened rather than for celebs to leap out of the woodwork relating their stories. It's not irrelevant but it's a more general issue ie ' Should men keep their hands off women who don't want to be groped'. Yes- but that's not as relevant at the moment I think as finding out who Jimmy Saville knew resulting in his confidence that he'd get away with it. That's the bigger story.
Lack of evidence to bring a case does not automatically mean a crime was not committed.
I don't believe the exact reasons Leslie was not brought to court were ever placed in the public domain.
No it doesn't but it's still innocent until proved guilty. Nothing was proved, so in the eyes of the law nothing happened.
Regardless of why it never went to court, it doesn't matter. You can only deal with the facts and the facts are... he didn't get taken to court, it was never put before a judge saying he had to answer to something, even if he is wrongly found not guilty after a trial.
I recall her mentioning this groping incident a few years back - I think she might have even named the guy or alluded to his identity...t'was an older man.
I don't get how anyone could do this without it being on camera or without it being obvious that they're 'too' close. Could you really imagine Lorraine Kelly presenting Daybreak whilst someones hand travels up her skirt and viewers remain oblivious?
I recall her mentioning this groping incident a few years back - I think she might have even named the guy or alluded to his identity...t'was an older man.
If it took place it's wrong but I really can't be bothered to care. If victims aren't prepared to name their alledged abusers then just keep quiet about it. It just makes you sound like you are attention seeking.
It does rather smack of 'jumping on the bandwagon'. I'm not completely comfortable with all the 'celebrities' speaking out via the media now about their own random experiences (not that I disbelieve them). Although I'm not implicating Vanessa Feltz, some will do anything to revive their flagging careers and although not lying, airing their experiences for the wrong reasons.
As Stockingfiller says, the current major issue is with the abuse of underage children among celebrity circles. Female celebrities coming forward to the press and social media and relating how they were groped back in some past incident- unless the same people were involved- is muddying the waters, to a degree. Instead of conveying what happened to the media, if they have concerns they should perhaps either make a formal complaint or report what happened to the police. No, they might not have any realistic chance of a prosecution if 'evidence' is minimal or if an incident happened a long time ago and yes, it could be extremely difficult for them but they would be setting an example for others.
All of this has made me wonder if there are any male celebrities/ high profile personalities who were molested either as children or in their adult years while working in media/entertainment. I'm guessing that there are but imagine it would be much harder for them to speak out- whether formally or via the media.
Actually I disagree because it enforces to all and sundry just how bad women/girls had it back then!
I just hope that the investigation into JS et al will once and for all break down the all boys culture and stop something like this ever happening again.
Altho I have to say I am very disappointed in Vanessa not actually naming and shaming unless she is frightened of a libel rap and without proof that could be the case
I recall her mentioning this groping incident a few years back - I think she might have even named the guy or alluded to his identity...t'was an older man.
If the tape hasn't been wiped, presumably there's filmic evidence of this 'grope'? If there was as she says ' a posse' of people in the studio, then presumably they were witness to it as well?
I think female celebs should keep quiet about these things for the moment, as it's detracting from the real issue - that of Savile's abuse of innocent children.
Comments
I think it's best left just to the victims who were underage at the time to relate to the police what happened rather than for celebs to leap out of the woodwork relating their stories. It's not irrelevant but it's a more general issue ie ' Should men keep their hands off women who don't want to be groped'. Yes- but that's not as relevant at the moment I think as finding out who Jimmy Saville knew resulting in his confidence that he'd get away with it. That's the bigger story.
So we wouldn't believe her if she said who it was? And why should we believe her if she doesn't have the courage to say who it was? It's a nonsense I'm afraid.
I just don't get this attitude that still prevails that some people are so important and bastions of the establishment that they are untouchable. This is precisely the load of crap that enabled Jimmy Savile to get away with things for his whole life. Now people talk about removing his knighthood etc. as if it's ever going to matter to him now. He's dead and he got away with it scot-free because people thought that his television celebrity and charity work made him some kind of saint that could never be questioned.
Surely, if we can learn anything from the Jimmy Savile story it is that NOBODY is whiter than white.
As Stockingfiller says, the current major issue is with the abuse of underage children among celebrity circles. Female celebrities coming forward to the press and social media and relating how they were groped back in some past incident- unless the same people were involved- is muddying the waters, to a degree. Instead of conveying what happened to the media, if they have concerns they should perhaps either make a formal complaint or report what happened to the police. No, they might not have any realistic chance of a prosecution if 'evidence' is minimal or if an incident happened a long time ago and yes, it could be extremely difficult for them but they would be setting an example for others.
All of this has made me wonder if there are any male celebrities/ high profile personalities who were molested either as children or in their adult years while working in media/entertainment. I'm guessing that there are but imagine it would be much harder for them to speak out- whether formally or via the media.
Was Ulrika better friends with Matthew than his fellow John Noel client?
That was Paula Yates.
And Vanessa did too on Big Breakfast.
As I've just found out Goaty!
If this person was allegedly trying to twang her knicker elastic, doing it on a bed would mean easier access.......
And the groper should have gone to Specsavers!
It's true that Ulrika chose not to report the matter, but as a result of this publicity two other women did come forward and reported John Leslie who was subsequently arrested.
And not charged presumably owing to lack of evidence. So his career is destroyed for nothing. IF he is innocent how is that justice for him?
IMO he was well within his rght to go after them and sue them for loss of earnings which considering what he was earning at the time would have destroyed their lives.
Lack of evidence to bring a case does not automatically mean a crime was not committed.
I don't believe the exact reasons Leslie was not brought to court were ever placed in the public domain.
Good post.
No it doesn't but it's still innocent until proved guilty. Nothing was proved, so in the eyes of the law nothing happened.
Regardless of why it never went to court, it doesn't matter. You can only deal with the facts and the facts are... he didn't get taken to court, it was never put before a judge saying he had to answer to something, even if he is wrongly found not guilty after a trial.
If it took place it's wrong but I really can't be bothered to care. If victims aren't prepared to name their alledged abusers then just keep quiet about it. It just makes you sound like you are attention seeking.
Actually I disagree because it enforces to all and sundry just how bad women/girls had it back then!
I just hope that the investigation into JS et al will once and for all break down the all boys culture and stop something like this ever happening again.
Altho I have to say I am very disappointed in Vanessa not actually naming and shaming unless she is frightened of a libel rap and without proof that could be the case
I think female celebs should keep quiet about these things for the moment, as it's detracting from the real issue - that of Savile's abuse of innocent children.