That's the entire point, following etiquette is all about manners.
Conversation for me last night was about the neurobiophysiological symptomatology of bi-polar disorder.
No there are manners, and there is etiquette.
You can eat perfectly well and fit in almost anywhere without etiquette, but not without manners.
I just cant get my head around people, who watch other people, while in the company of good friends or acquaintances. I listen to what people say, rather than watch what they, or other people are doing. Only if someone does something that is outrages, bad manners wise, would I notice.
Worrying about the 'correct' way to hold a wine glass, the 'correct' manner in which to hold a knife or fork or the amount of food you can safely place on a fork is certainly not conducive to a relaxed meal. Unless your friends are as pretentious as you, they must hate the fact that you're constantly monitoring their table etiquette and pointing out errors with it.
We don't worry about it. It never enters my head. I was taught a certain way and it's what I do naturally. I don't spend mealtimes thinking 'How do I do this?'. I just do it. And I have never commented on another person's table manners during a meal either.
I can just imagine how interesting (or not) the conversation round the table if everyone was watching how everyone else, was holding there fork or glass.
Come on! As long as everyone is eating with manners, then who cares! I would love to talk to some of their friends. Bet they could tell a thing or two about how riveting the conversation is around their dining table .
Enjoy your meal and stop watching everyone else for goodness sake.
Why on earth would we spend a nice meal with friends watching how other people eat!? That is not what happens. It's certainly not what we talk about.
This thread is about that subject though. So we are commenting.
We don't worry about it. It never enters my head. I was taught a certain way and it's what I do naturally. I don't spend mealtimes thinking 'How do I do this?'. I just do it. And I have never commented on another person's table manners during a meal either.
Why on earth would we spend a nice meal with friends watching how other people eat!? That is not what happens. It's certainly not what we talk about.
This thread is about that subject though. So we are commenting.
Who said I was talking about you?
Plenty on this thread have said how they cant help looking at how other people eat or hold their cutlery, and judge them for it.. that is who my post was aimed at.
Who said I was talking about you?
Plenty on this thread have said how they cant help looking at how other people eat or hold their cutlery, and judge them for it.. that is who my post was aimed at.
I was speaking for those of us who think it matters. I didn't for a moment think you were speaking solely about me what an odd idea
We don't worry about it. It never enters my head. I was taught a certain way and it's what I do naturally. I don't spend mealtimes thinking 'How do I do this?'. I just do it. And I have never commented on another person's table manners during a meal either.
I was speaking for those of us who think it matters. I didn't for a moment think you were speaking solely about me what an odd idea
I think I'll jump in here too. I was responding to ChristmasCake - not you. ChristmasCake mentioned she notices bad etiquette and tries to correct it and it was that that I was referring to. I'm not sure why you had to jump in and bore us with details of how YOU don't watch people eat or their table etiquette, in response to a post about a member who does observe other people's table etiquette.
I think I'll jump in here too. I was responding to ChristmasCake - not you. ChristmasCake mentioned she notices bad etiquette and tries to correct it and it was that that I was referring to. I'm not sure why you had to jump in and bore us with details of how YOU don't watch people eat or their table etiquette, in response to a post about a member who does observe other people's table etiquette.
Rather rude don't you think?
Can I point out that I am a guy, and I'd only point it out to someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be to shame them, but to educate:).
I think etiquette is extremely important, and it's a shame that many people do not follow it.
I'm with the OP on this one.
People may say that makes me 'sad,' or is a reflection on me, but for me, it's more about being respectful and polite.
I do notice when people are not using their cutlery in the correct way, or if they hold their wine glass the wrong way, or if they use their fish knife at the wrong time, or whatever.
I'd only comment on it if I knew the person well, and I'd never do it to shame them.
To each his own, I suppose. Condescendingly correcting the table manners your dining companions is the height of bad manners in my book.
I voted 'it does not matter'.
I really couldn't care less how people use their cutlery, in fact I don't think I've ever noticed. My sons are both left handed and I used to put the knife and fork the other way round to make it easier for them. We don't follow silly made up rules in our house.
To each his own, I suppose. Condescendingly correcting the table manners your dining companions is the height of bad manners in my book.
Did you read my post?
Where did I suggest that I would do it in a condescending manner?
It's only something I would even mention with someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be in a manner to shame them. It'd be in the interest of educating them on etiquette.
For those who insist that using the correct table etiquette is important, presumably you are aware that different countries and cultures have different rules?
So when you're abroad, do you alter your own eating style to match the local one or do you always eat in the 'correct' British style?
For example if you were visiting the USA would you continually swap your fork from left hand to right like the Americans do or hold it permanently in your left hand like the British? Presumably the polite thing to do would be to adopt the local etiquette rather than doggedly stick to your own?
Where did I suggest that I would do it in a condescending manner?
It's only something I would even mention with someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be in a manner to shame them. It'd be in the interest of educating them on etiquette.
Correcting someone else's table manners is condescending all on its own, you don't need to make a special effort to be so. In my mind it doesn't matter how well you know the person, it's still shockingly bad manners.
Can I point out that I am a guy, and I'd only point it out to someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be to shame them, but to educate:).
Oops..
It's strange how a posting style can be perceived as male or female, often incorrectly. Someone was surprised I was a male poster a week or so back so I think I must post in a feminine manner!!
For those who insist that using the correct table etiquette is important, presumably you are aware that different countries and cultures have different rules?
So when you're abroad, do you alter your own eating style to match the local one or do you always eat in the 'correct' British style?
For example if you were visiting the USA would you continually swap your fork from left hand to right like the Americans do or hold it permanently in your left hand like the British? Presumably the polite thing to do would be to adopt the local etiquette rather than doggedly stick to your own?
Correcting someone else's table manners is condescending all on its own, you don't need to make a special effort to be so. In my mind it doesn't matter how well you know the person, it's still shockingly bad manners.
How else would someone become aware of etiquette, unless they were taught about it?
When I received instruction as a four year old from my headmistress, was she being condescending?
I find it is often important to exchange and impart knowledge, as without this, said knowledge often gets lost/forgotten.
You seem to be under the impression that I'd pull out a spotlight, and accost someone across the table, which would be quite rude, and is not an approach I'd ever dream of taking.
I only found out rather recently that I had been holding my whisky glass in the incorrect manner, and I was appreciative of the correction.
How else would someone become aware of etiquette, unless they were taught about it?
When I received instruction as a four year old from my headmistress, was she being condescending?
I find it is often important to exchange and impart knowledge, as without this, said knowledge often gets lost/forgotten.
You seem to be under the impression that I'd pull out a spotlight, and accost someone across the table, which would be quite rude, and is not an approach I'd ever dream of taking.
I only found out rather recently that I had been holding my whisky glass in the incorrect manner, and I was appreciative of the correction.
Your headmistress was your headmistress. I don't think it's your place to treat your peers like you would a four year old.
I voted 'it does not matter'.
I really couldn't care less how people use their cutlery, in fact I don't think I've ever noticed. My sons are both left handed and I used to put the knife and fork the other way round to make it easier for them. We don't follow silly made up rules in our house.
How else would someone become aware of etiquette, unless they were taught about it?
When I received instruction as a four year old from my headmistress, was she being condescending?
I find it is often important to exchange and impart knowledge, as without this, said knowledge often gets lost/forgotten.
You seem to be under the impression that I'd pull out a spotlight, and accost someone across the table, which would be quite rude, and is not an approach I'd ever dream of taking.
I only found out rather recently that I had been holding my whisky glass in the incorrect manner, and I was appreciative of the correction.
Haha, poor sentence construction on my part, and your comment raised a smile:).
There is a difference between a paid educator teaching a 4 year old , and a person giving unasked for 'knowledge' (which is actually just a matter of opinion) to an adult in a social situation. Personally I wouldf find the 2nd situation rather condescending.
Comments
...especially during the soup course.
No there are manners, and there is etiquette.
You can eat perfectly well and fit in almost anywhere without etiquette, but not without manners.
I just cant get my head around people, who watch other people, while in the company of good friends or acquaintances. I listen to what people say, rather than watch what they, or other people are doing. Only if someone does something that is outrages, bad manners wise, would I notice.
There is absolutely no class left in this country. The dumbing down has concluded
We don't worry about it. It never enters my head. I was taught a certain way and it's what I do naturally. I don't spend mealtimes thinking 'How do I do this?'. I just do it. And I have never commented on another person's table manners during a meal either.
Why on earth would we spend a nice meal with friends watching how other people eat!? That is not what happens. It's certainly not what we talk about.
This thread is about that subject though. So we are commenting.
Plenty on this thread have said how they cant help looking at how other people eat or hold their cutlery, and judge them for it.. that is who my post was aimed at.
I was speaking for those of us who think it matters. I didn't for a moment think you were speaking solely about me
Why are you speaking for others then? As I already said plenty on here have already stated that they did watch and judge others.
Well pardon me for having an opinion.
Fear not! Rampant exaggeration is alive and well!
You think speaking for others is good manners.
Hmmm
I think I'll jump in here too. I was responding to ChristmasCake - not you. ChristmasCake mentioned she notices bad etiquette and tries to correct it and it was that that I was referring to. I'm not sure why you had to jump in and bore us with details of how YOU don't watch people eat or their table etiquette, in response to a post about a member who does observe other people's table etiquette.
Rather rude don't you think?
Can I point out that I am a guy, and I'd only point it out to someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be to shame them, but to educate:).
To each his own, I suppose. Condescendingly correcting the table manners your dining companions is the height of bad manners in my book.
I really couldn't care less how people use their cutlery, in fact I don't think I've ever noticed. My sons are both left handed and I used to put the knife and fork the other way round to make it easier for them. We don't follow silly made up rules in our house.
Did you read my post?
Where did I suggest that I would do it in a condescending manner?
It's only something I would even mention with someone I knew well, and it wouldn't be in a manner to shame them. It'd be in the interest of educating them on etiquette.
Are you being serious? Why on earth would you think a person would want to be 'educated' on how to use their cutlery?
So when you're abroad, do you alter your own eating style to match the local one or do you always eat in the 'correct' British style?
For example if you were visiting the USA would you continually swap your fork from left hand to right like the Americans do or hold it permanently in your left hand like the British? Presumably the polite thing to do would be to adopt the local etiquette rather than doggedly stick to your own?
Correcting someone else's table manners is condescending all on its own, you don't need to make a special effort to be so. In my mind it doesn't matter how well you know the person, it's still shockingly bad manners.
Oops..
It's strange how a posting style can be perceived as male or female, often incorrectly. Someone was surprised I was a male poster a week or so back so I think I must post in a feminine manner!!
Why would it shame someone to know that you were a guy?
(:D)
I tend to adopt local etiquette.
How else would someone become aware of etiquette, unless they were taught about it?
When I received instruction as a four year old from my headmistress, was she being condescending?
I find it is often important to exchange and impart knowledge, as without this, said knowledge often gets lost/forgotten.
You seem to be under the impression that I'd pull out a spotlight, and accost someone across the table, which would be quite rude, and is not an approach I'd ever dream of taking.
I only found out rather recently that I had been holding my whisky glass in the incorrect manner, and I was appreciative of the correction.
Haha, poor sentence construction on my part, and your comment raised a smile:).
Your headmistress was your headmistress. I don't think it's your place to treat your peers like you would a four year old.
Aren't all rules made up by someone?