That is what I thought, but ages ago Sandy posted a link to OJ Simpson's lawyer, Shapiro, discussing the Oscar case and I am sure he said he always always always wanted his clients to tell him everything, guilty or not. That really surprised me because I always thought it was as you said in your post above
Quote from shorty
No barrister wants to know his client was guilty . He would leave himself open to all sorts of accusations of aiding and abetting . Perjury etc.
he may have his suspicions but that's as far as it goes. To suggest that barristers go into court and lie and perjure themselves is just fantasy.
They don't. They can still defend a guilty client as long as they don't mislead the court on his or her behalf, nor assist the client in doing so. They can still challenge the prosecution's case for instance.
probably nothing and already covered, but has OP been asked why he actuality decided to get up and move the fans into the room and close the curtains that night
Both he and Reeva were awake and the heat that night seems to be an issue, Having the fans placed where they were in the doorway made the most sense by dragging the cooler air in from outside.
Can understand if it was to turn them off because of the noise, but that doesn't seem to be the case
The fans were always brought inside. Pistorius asked Steenkamp to bring them in when she went to sleep. She didn't so he did it himself when he woke up.
I thought it was odd that Nel is catching OP up on relatively small things, but the small things add up and can also rattle someone.
It isn't insignificant to say that someone didn't scream when if you shot in error you would more likely say, She could have but I didn't hear it, or I now think she did. It is an important point in his level of remorse that he still has to contradict the witnesses on all counts.
It is important for the lawyer to know everything and not be surprised in court. At the same time the defense is not supposed to lie to protect a guilty person.
The stuff i see as insignificant is the house painting stuff, the burglar alarm setting stuff, the spoke quietly versus whispering, Jaysus if I had a whole team of lawyers sitting ready to pounce on every tiny thing I would be a gibbering wreck.
I think the screaming versus not screaming stuff is actually going to make a lot more sense once we hear from other defence witnesses. OP said no witnesses could have heard her scream and Roux intervened. Very carefullŷ. Trying to say without saying too much as to be seen to be leading OP.
His reputation can only be damaged should he lose a case he ought to have won. I don't think he's at risk of that here, whichever way it goes. On the contrary, sometimes its mounting a great defence in a futile situation that barristers see as important achievements.
Dont worry francie. just make sure my words are after the (start) quote and before the forward slash and quote (end quote)and yours are after, anyway, even with messed up quotes we can normally work it out lol
I do and did and it still messed up. It seems to happen to some of us at times
The fans were always brought inside. Pistorius asked Steenkamp to bring them in when she went to sleep. She didn't so he did it himself when he woke up.
But she hadn't gone to sleep yet. Someone just commented (sorry dont know who) very pertinently.......if she was still awake, why would he bring the fans in without asking her if she was ok with it .
Ladder under the balcony window. OP did not hear it getting dragged round to the side which is interesting as the doors were open and ladders are big heavy things. Burglar was so stealthy he carried those ladders to the bathroom window in total silence but damn, he slammed open the window and alerted OP to his imminent entry .
pathetic isnt it, bumbling burgler!
Op was so in fear of crime, he comes home, doesnt check ladders are all in, doesnt know if alarm is working, cos the house painters MAY have compromised it etc, goes to sleep and leaves his GF up with open doors ..ok
I suppose he has his talon bullet gun to hand so thats ok
His reputation can only be damaged should he lose a case he ought to have won. I don't think he's at risk of that here, whichever way it goes. On the contrary, sometimes its mounting a great defence in a futile situation that barristers see as important achievements.
Do you think he's putting up a good defence? (obviously we haven't seen it all yet).
His reputation can only be damaged should he lose a case he ought to have won. I don't think he's at risk of that here, whichever way it goes. On the contrary, sometimes its mounting a great defence in a futile situation that barristers see as important achievements.
Op was so in fear of crime, he comes home, doesnt check ladders are all in, doesnt know if alarm is working, cos the house painters MAY have compromised it etc, goes to sleep and leaves his GF up with open windows....ok
I couldn't believe Nel didn't pounce on that at the time, when OP said he was happy to have the doors open as long as he was awake. It makes a bit of a mockery of his insistence he was scared for Reeva's safety, given he was happy to go to sleep and leave her awake with the open doors.
The stuff i see as insignificant is the house painting stuff, the burglar alarm setting stuff, the spoke quietly versus whispering, Jaysus if I had a whole team of lawyers sitting ready to pounce on every tiny thing I would be a gibbering wreck.
I think the screaming versus not screaming stuff is actually going to make a lot more sense once we hear from other defence witnesses. OP said no witnesses could have heard her scream and Roux intervened. Very carefullŷ. Trying to say without saying too much as to be seen to be leading OP.
BIB. I can't wait until we get back to the screaming. Thats whats going to be the decider.
Interesting what you say about Roux there - I'll have to go watch that back I think.
His reputation can only be damaged should he lose a case he ought to have won. I don't think he's at risk of that here, whichever way it goes. On the contrary, sometimes its mounting a great defence in a futile situation that barristers see as important achievements.
I agree with you. But that only applies if your client works with you and not against you.
I think Roux will garner some sympathy from defending a difficult client.
OP is not working with Roux, that is clear.
I just read how after an evening out when they were in the car, OP played the song 'b**ch dont kill my vibe" by Kendrick Lamar which he was clearly referencing to Reeva.
He really didnt like her did he?!?
The stuff i see as insignificant is the house painting stuff, the burglar alarm setting stuff, the spoke quietly versus whispering, Jaysus if I had a whole team of lawyers sitting ready to pounce on every tiny thing I would be a gibbering wreck.
I think the screaming versus not screaming stuff is actually going to make a lot more sense once we hear from other defence witnesses. OP said no witnesses could have heard her scream and Roux intervened. Very carefullŷ. Trying to say without saying too much as to be seen to be leading OP.
Agreed, and that's why IMO Pistorius isn't doing too badly (apart from the nonsense on the lesser charges). I think he could've been better but he could've also fared much, much worse.
I agree, but found it hard to believe that it really was OP who was driving the defence - thought they'd have easily given him a slap and told him what was good for him! I truly imagined there was a brilliant (expensive) masterplan that must be in play.
Re: Ammo in Safe
Maybe there's some legal precedent - someone who never actually had ammo in their physical, personal possession and the ammo is stored in a locked safe ?
I just read how after an evening out when they were in the car, OP played the song 'b**ch dont kill my vibe" by Kendrick Lamar which he was clearly referencing to Reeva.
He really didnt like her did he?!?
He knew how to put her down anyway. Horrible song to play to your girlfriend to labour a point.
I just read how after an evening out when they were in the car, OP played the song 'b**ch dont kill my vibe" by Kendrick Lamar which he was clearly referencing to Reeva.
He really didnt like her did he?!?
Shows a disgusting lack of respect.
Humiliating for her
I couldn't believe Nel didn't pounce on that at the time, when OP said he was happy to have the doors open as long as he was awake. It makes a bit of a mockery of his insistence he was scared for Reeva's safety, given he was happy to go to sleep and leave her awake with the open doors.
Give him time, i reckon he has loads of aces up his sleeve for his summing up, not everything in it will have been put to OP in cross exam
Comments
They don't. They can still defend a guilty client as long as they don't mislead the court on his or her behalf, nor assist the client in doing so. They can still challenge the prosecution's case for instance.
IMO, Roux's reputation is intact… and will remain intact win or loose
All attorneys comprehend the situation with OP as the client.
Remember how many times Nel said 'that Roux would never make the mistake of…' whenever OP tried to put blame on Roux.
The fans were always brought inside. Pistorius asked Steenkamp to bring them in when she went to sleep. She didn't so he did it himself when he woke up.
The stuff i see as insignificant is the house painting stuff, the burglar alarm setting stuff, the spoke quietly versus whispering, Jaysus if I had a whole team of lawyers sitting ready to pounce on every tiny thing I would be a gibbering wreck.
I think the screaming versus not screaming stuff is actually going to make a lot more sense once we hear from other defence witnesses. OP said no witnesses could have heard her scream and Roux intervened. Very carefullŷ. Trying to say without saying too much as to be seen to be leading OP.
His reputation can only be damaged should he lose a case he ought to have won. I don't think he's at risk of that here, whichever way it goes. On the contrary, sometimes its mounting a great defence in a futile situation that barristers see as important achievements.
I do and did and it still messed up. It seems to happen to some of us at times
But she hadn't gone to sleep yet. Someone just commented (sorry dont know who) very pertinently.......if she was still awake, why would he bring the fans in without asking her if she was ok with it .
pathetic isnt it, bumbling burgler!
Op was so in fear of crime, he comes home, doesnt check ladders are all in, doesnt know if alarm is working, cos the house painters MAY have compromised it etc, goes to sleep and leaves his GF up with open doors ..ok
I suppose he has his talon bullet gun to hand so thats ok
Do you think he's putting up a good defence? (obviously we haven't seen it all yet).
Yes, good point
I couldn't believe Nel didn't pounce on that at the time, when OP said he was happy to have the doors open as long as he was awake. It makes a bit of a mockery of his insistence he was scared for Reeva's safety, given he was happy to go to sleep and leave her awake with the open doors.
BIB. I can't wait until we get back to the screaming. Thats whats going to be the decider.
Interesting what you say about Roux there - I'll have to go watch that back I think.
I agree with you. But that only applies if your client works with you and not against you.
I think Roux will garner some sympathy from defending a difficult client.
OP is not working with Roux, that is clear.
Well he does have the added value that while he just stands there listening OP is doing his job for him
Ooh yes, do, I'd be interested in your take on it.
He really didnt like her did he?!?
Agreed, and that's why IMO Pistorius isn't doing too badly (apart from the nonsense on the lesser charges). I think he could've been better but he could've also fared much, much worse.
Maybe there's some legal precedent - someone who never actually had ammo in their physical, personal possession and the ammo is stored in a locked safe ?
He knew how to put her down anyway. Horrible song to play to your girlfriend to labour a point.
Shows a disgusting lack of respect.
Humiliating for her
That is correct m'lady
And yet it's zero proof that he killed her deliberately.
Give him time, i reckon he has loads of aces up his sleeve for his summing up, not everything in it will have been put to OP in cross exam
Deckchair, shades and a drink at hand, just chillin'..
And no one said it was. I commented on the fact that it was a rotten thing to do, no more and no less.
It shows his contempt and lack of consideration for her and considering he killed her I think its pertinent. Don't you?