How much does Victoria Leigh actually say or talk about Cornwall and Cornwall issues? Are the Heart listenership in Cornwall going to lose anything if they one day find they receive Emma Scott on 105.1 and 107?
The problem is she doesn't. It's all pretty standard radio fare generally, rather than anything specifically local. But what they would lose is a semi-decent presenter, who actually can present radio, compared to Emma Scott, who is a music promoter outside of her radio show, and really, she should probably stick to being a promoter, because her radio work is painful to listen to.
The problem is she doesn't. It's all pretty standard radio fare generally, rather than anything specifically local. But what they would lose is a semi-decent presenter, who actually can present radio, compared to Emma Scott, who is a music promoter outside of her radio show, and really, she should probably stick to being a promoter, because her radio work is painful to listen to.
Bad radio presenters, don't get gigs on Kerrang! or Heart.
With its population of 500 thousand? They said much the same about Norfolk (800k) and Suffolk (700k) and look at them.
But, both Norfolk and Suffolk are practically next door to London, so comparatively, far less distinctive, than Cornwall, which is further away from London than Wales is.
Bad radio presenters, don't get gigs on Kerrang! or Heart.
Have you actually listened to her? She is painful to listen to. Compared to a number of different presenters I've heard on commercial radio, she is the worst by a long way.
Seriously, it's not even close to being good, and that's nothing to do with Heart, it's just her as a presenter.
Have you actually listened to her? She is painful to listen to. Compared to a number of different presenters I've heard on commercial radio, she is the worst by a long way.
I will say no, I don't have any memory of listening to her, I've long known of her however. I'd imagine she suits a station like Kerrang! better from what you're telling me. But if she was a bad presenter she wouldn't have worked at such big stations.
I'd say that's only possible if the stations are trying to bring listeners in on someones 'celeb status' and she don't have any.
But, both Norfolk and Suffolk are practically next door to London, so comparatively, far less distinctive, than Cornwall, which is further away from London than Wales is.
With respect you're talking tripe. And being further away from big cities just proves that point it's gonna be even less viable.
Emma Scott has worked on various formats over the years from the Chiltern Radio network, Power FM where she presented a successful CHR show in addition to an alternative show on Sundays, Kerrang! and now Heart. Doesn't that show versatility in a presenter?
With respect you're talking tripe. And being further away from big cities just proves that point it's gonna be even less viable.
What a load of total bollocks. There are plenty of businesses in Cornwall, that are profitable and viable and have no interest in the big cities at all. If you're understanding of business is based on big city=profitable and rural=unprofitable, you really have a lot to learn.
Oh and Pirate FM are profitable, so the fact Atlantic wasn't is down to their actions, not anything else.
What a load of total bollocks. There are plenty of businesses in Cornwall, that are profitable and viable and have no interest in the big cities at all. If you're understanding of business is based on big city=profitable and rural=unprofitable, you really have a lot to learn.
We're talking about the business of radio, not a cake shop
What a load of total bollocks. There are plenty of businesses in Cornwall, that are profitable and viable and have no interest in the big cities at all. If you're understanding of business is based on big city=profitable and rural=unprofitable, you really have a lot to learn.
Oh and Pirate FM are profitable, so the fact Atlantic wasn't is down to their actions, not anything else.
He's right though, rural areas usually have very small buisnesses that won't pay the amount you need to make a profit. Big cities have lots of large but not national business, these are exactly the people you want because they can spend large amounts but at the same time are not national so you can also chase those as well.
Oh and Pirate FM are profitable, so the fact Atlantic wasn't is down to their actions, not anything else.
At 30 September 2011 Pirate FM Limited had accumulated losses of £400k, but the accumulated losses have halved since September 2010.
As they are only required to publish abbreviated accounts it's impossible to tell from these whether EBITDA is positive for the year or if there is an exceptional item in here
I'd have to question how much Atlantic tried to make it pay. There were things they could have done to make a profitable service, including increased automation and syndicated programming, but they didn't use any of those.
.
Firstly you carp on about the importance of local radio and listener choice. Then, when Atlantic fails, you criticise it for not trying hard enough. So they were deliberately trying to run it into the ground?
Yet you also inisist that there are enough local advertisers to make two commercial stations in Cornwall profitable.
Were you, perchance, one of the unsuccessful bidders for the licence?
The problem is she doesn't. It's all pretty standard radio fare generally, rather than anything specifically local. But what they would lose is a semi-decent presenter, who actually can present radio, compared to Emma Scott, who is a music promoter outside of her radio show, and really, she should probably stick to being a promoter, because her radio work is painful to listen to.
Can I just defend Victoria and Emma, Both are excellent competent DJs and very easy to listen to.
With its population of 500 thousand? They said much the same about Norfolk (800k) and Suffolk (700k) and look at them.
Most of the Ofcom "mini" regions (within which total networking is allowed) are over a million people now. Sparsely-populated areas just aren't going to win that argument. And unless Cornwall wins home rule, it isn't going to go on an Ofcom list of 'distinctive' places either.. any more than the other historic counties or kingdoms of England.
In which case it would seem that local content would then be left primarily up to community radio stations to provide such as Falmouth's Source FM.
The consultation document is here and any Cornish residents would be best advised to alert their MPs to comment in addition to their own personal comments because that would help make the case for rejecting the proposed changes.
Firstly you carp on about the importance of local radio and listener choice. Then, when Atlantic fails, you criticise it for not trying hard enough. So they were deliberately trying to run it into the ground?
Yet you also inisist that there are enough local advertisers to make two commercial stations in Cornwall profitable.
Were you, perchance, one of the unsuccessful bidders for the licence?
Nope, was not involved in any of the bids, However, I was a very interested observer of the whole process, and like so many others, I was shocked when the licence went to Atlantic Broadcasting. CK FM was definitely the better set of proposals.
Also, somebody else said Atlantic was independent. It wasn't totally independent, it was part owned by Tindle Radio.
I know this sounds like an alien concept, but there are ways to reduce costs, and yet maintain the localness at the important times. But when you're doing 18 hours of live programming every day, including some specialist dance mixes on Fridays and Saturdays, the kind of specialist mixes that take ages to do, and get it correctly beat-to-beat, that costs.
Pirate FM this year have focused exclusively on daytime live programming, and I think it's working for them. Atlantic should have done the same a couple of years ago, and maybe cut down the weekend live output as well, maybe down to 8 hours. Syndicated programming at the weekend would have helped as well.
Some people on here say that people who advocate local radio do not understand that it's a business. Actually some of us really do understand, which is why you guys get the shock of your lives when somebody actually comes out and says something that doesn't match your pre-conceived notions.
Oh, and also, Heart are currently proving that there are enough advertisers to keep both stations running. 95% of the adverts on Heart Cornwall are actually for local advertisers, compared with Heart Plymouth where about half the ads are for national companies rather than local ones. In fact on Heart Cornwall, hearing a national ad outside of the newslink ads is practically unheard of. Pirate FM as well is mostly local advertisers, with about 10% of the spots being for national advertisers.
But when you're doing 18 hours of live programming every day, including some specialist dance mixes on Fridays and Saturdays, the kind of specialist mixes that take ages to do, and get it correctly beat-to-beat, that costs.
Pirate FM this year have focused exclusively on daytime live programming, and I think it's working for them. Atlantic should have done the same a couple of years ago, and maybe cut down the weekend live output as well, maybe down to 8 hours. Syndicated programming at the weekend would have helped as well.
Some people on here say that people who advocate local radio do not understand that it's a business. Actually some of us really do understand, which is why you guys get the shock of your lives when somebody actually comes out and says something that doesn't match your pre-conceived notions.
Oh, and also, Heart are currently proving that there are enough advertisers to keep both stations running. 95% of the adverts on Heart Cornwall are actually for local advertisers, compared with Heart Plymouth where about half the ads are for national companies rather than local ones. In fact on Heart Cornwall, hearing a national ad outside of the newslink ads is practically unheard of. Pirate FM as well is mostly local advertisers, with about 10% of the spots being for national advertisers.
So in other words, Atlantic was trying too hard with live and local programming?
Syndicated weekend shows? Much like Heart's networking then...
And you've conveniently ignored the fact that Heart Cornwall's "95% local" adverts don't have to pay for any live and local programming originating from Cornwall, whereas a full time county station would have to.
A very good well balanced debated on here. Unsually I can't make up my mind on this one so I'll just give both the posts I was deliberating over.
Post 1 (for)- To put things in perspective, the station that was Atlantic had just 3% of the Cornish market. The station has already changed its name and lost all of its Cornish programing save this token drive show. The added speech content of this show (outwith the news and travel) has been described as responses to facebook topics. Anyone who wants meaningful local content can get it from Pirate and Radio Cornwall. Why not just let Global give their regular Heart offering to the market and see where it takes us.
Post 2 (against)- Global bought Atlantic in the full knowledge of this obligation. In their press releases they stressed that it would remain so they have to say the least a great deal of chutzpa in requesting this change after just 3 months when they can have no reliable data for doing so. Yes, OFCOM have made lots of fundemental changes to licences they themselves granted- such as Citytalk in particular.......but these changes were granted, arguably,in response to market reality and the big impact the credit crunch/ recession(s) have and are having on the radio market. Global can't....and aren't.....arguing this is the case here as it isn't. It smacks of pettiness.......they simply don't want to do it, rather like a child not wanting to do its homework or eat its greens. End of. It's an easy one for OFCOM to say no to.
So there you have both my 'Sliding Doors' style posts. Make up your on mind because I sure as heck can't.
So in other words, Atlantic was trying too hard with live and local programming?
If it's not making money, and Atlantic wasn't, then you have to cut back. Evenings are not key timeand never will be, so that show should have been replaced with automation. Heart by comparison, aren't trying.
Syndicated weekend shows? Much like Heart's networking then...
I don't think you really understand the issue about Global and networking. It's got nothing to do with networking evenings and overnight and weekends. That was being done back in the 1980s, with little to no compalints. The issue is networking during weekday daytime. By networking 10am - 4pm Monday to Friday, you have reduced local stations to nothing more than opt-outs.
But, if Cornwall is going to be nothing more than an opt-out to Global, then I'd rather it was an opt-out on it's own, rather than shared with Devon. And I know I'm not alone in that sentiment. According to an OFCOM study that was done back in 2004, whilst they were trying to decide what to do with the licences that eventually became Atlantic FM/Radio Plymouth etc, listeners in Cornwall had no interest at all in regional programming. Making Heart Devon and Heart Cornwall into Heart South West will be something that the listeners will not care for at all.
And you've conveniently ignored the fact that Heart Cornwall's "95% local" adverts don't have to pay for any live and local programming originating from Cornwall, whereas a full time county station would have to.
But that's no different from what Atlantic were doing before being bought. 12 minutes an hour of mainly local commercials. You cannot tell me that Atlantic were not making plenty of revenue, they plainly were. If they mispent it, then it's their fault. And do you honestly think Global would have bought Atlantic if it wasn't producing good revenue numbers? As so many on here are so fond of saying, Global isn't a charity, it's not in the business of saving failing stations out of the goodness of it's heart. The fact is it is producing more than enough revenue to run Global's 7 hour breakfast and drivetime opt-outs, if Global wanted to. But no, it's cheaper to merge it with Heart Devon.
Or down to the fact Pirate already had the profitable format in town nailed down.
Not necessarily. When Atlantic FM first launched, they launched with a bunch of new advertisers. Most of their adverts were for companies who had never advertised on Pirate FM. Even now, there are a large number of companies across Cornwall that could afford the advertising. Indeed a number of companies that advertise in the Cornish weeklies, don't advertise on commercial radio at all, and some of them could certainly afford it. So, the available evidence indicates that there is more than enough potential advertisers available. Even a number of companies that used to advertise, some of them for a number of years, and then just decided to stop advertising on commercial radio, thinking their job was done I suppose, could become advertisers again if they so chose to.
if Cornwall is going to be nothing more than an opt-out to Global, then I'd rather it was an opt-out on it's own, rather than shared with Devon.
This is no different to what's happened across the country in other Ofcom mini-regions. Cities like Leicester and Nottingham share one "local" service with Derby. Herts, Bucks, Beds and Northants share one "local" service. Norfolk and Sufflok have a merged East Anglia service.
This consultation isn't about "localness" - the localness rules are very clear. It's about changing the Format of the Cornwall station to the same as the Devon ones. If Ofcom won't let them, Global could go ahead with a merged drivetime show, but give it the (slightly) higher speech percentage of the Cornwall service.
You cannot tell me that Atlantic were not making plenty of revenue, they plainly were.
You don't know that. You don't know how cheaply Atlantic were selling ad space for.
do you honestly think Global would have bought Atlantic if it wasn't producing good revenue numbers?
Yes, because they knew they could provide a service at much lower cost.
The fact is it is producing more than enough revenue to run Global's 7 hour breakfast and drivetime opt-outs, if Global wanted to. But no, it's cheaper to merge it with Heart Devon.
You're guessing at how much revenue it was producing. But, yes, it's cheaper to merge it with Devon, so that's what they've done.
This is no different to what's happened across the country in other Ofcom mini-regions. Cities like Leicester and Nottingham share one "local" service with Derby. Herts, Bucks, Beds and Northants share one "local" service. Norfolk and Sufflok have a merged East Anglia service.
He'll tell you now how Cornwall is different to all those areas.
This consultation isn't about "localness" - the localness rules are very clear. It's about changing the Format of the Cornwall station to the same as the Devon ones. If Ofcom won't let them, Global could go ahead with a merged drivetime show, but give it the (slightly) higher speech percentage of the Cornwall service.
Or just just record extra links for Cornwall with the same presenter?
Comments
The problem is she doesn't. It's all pretty standard radio fare generally, rather than anything specifically local. But what they would lose is a semi-decent presenter, who actually can present radio, compared to Emma Scott, who is a music promoter outside of her radio show, and really, she should probably stick to being a promoter, because her radio work is painful to listen to.
But, both Norfolk and Suffolk are practically next door to London, so comparatively, far less distinctive, than Cornwall, which is further away from London than Wales is.
Have you actually listened to her? She is painful to listen to. Compared to a number of different presenters I've heard on commercial radio, she is the worst by a long way.
Seriously, it's not even close to being good, and that's nothing to do with Heart, it's just her as a presenter.
I'd say that's only possible if the stations are trying to bring listeners in on someones 'celeb status' and she don't have any.
What a load of total bollocks. There are plenty of businesses in Cornwall, that are profitable and viable and have no interest in the big cities at all. If you're understanding of business is based on big city=profitable and rural=unprofitable, you really have a lot to learn.
Oh and Pirate FM are profitable, so the fact Atlantic wasn't is down to their actions, not anything else.
Or down to the fact Pirate already had the profitable format in town nailed down.
It's also worth noting Pirate FM had the backing of UKRD whereas Atlantic was independent and thereby vunerable.
He's right though, rural areas usually have very small buisnesses that won't pay the amount you need to make a profit. Big cities have lots of large but not national business, these are exactly the people you want because they can spend large amounts but at the same time are not national so you can also chase those as well.
At 30 September 2011 Pirate FM Limited had accumulated losses of £400k, but the accumulated losses have halved since September 2010.
As they are only required to publish abbreviated accounts it's impossible to tell from these whether EBITDA is positive for the year or if there is an exceptional item in here
Firstly you carp on about the importance of local radio and listener choice. Then, when Atlantic fails, you criticise it for not trying hard enough. So they were deliberately trying to run it into the ground?
Yet you also inisist that there are enough local advertisers to make two commercial stations in Cornwall profitable.
Were you, perchance, one of the unsuccessful bidders for the licence?
Can I just defend Victoria and Emma, Both are excellent competent DJs and very easy to listen to.
Will agree about Victoria, but cannot agree about Emma.
In which case it would seem that local content would then be left primarily up to community radio stations to provide such as Falmouth's Source FM.
The consultation document is here and any Cornish residents would be best advised to alert their MPs to comment in addition to their own personal comments because that would help make the case for rejecting the proposed changes.
Nope, was not involved in any of the bids, However, I was a very interested observer of the whole process, and like so many others, I was shocked when the licence went to Atlantic Broadcasting. CK FM was definitely the better set of proposals.
Also, somebody else said Atlantic was independent. It wasn't totally independent, it was part owned by Tindle Radio.
I know this sounds like an alien concept, but there are ways to reduce costs, and yet maintain the localness at the important times. But when you're doing 18 hours of live programming every day, including some specialist dance mixes on Fridays and Saturdays, the kind of specialist mixes that take ages to do, and get it correctly beat-to-beat, that costs.
Pirate FM this year have focused exclusively on daytime live programming, and I think it's working for them. Atlantic should have done the same a couple of years ago, and maybe cut down the weekend live output as well, maybe down to 8 hours. Syndicated programming at the weekend would have helped as well.
Some people on here say that people who advocate local radio do not understand that it's a business. Actually some of us really do understand, which is why you guys get the shock of your lives when somebody actually comes out and says something that doesn't match your pre-conceived notions.
Oh, and also, Heart are currently proving that there are enough advertisers to keep both stations running. 95% of the adverts on Heart Cornwall are actually for local advertisers, compared with Heart Plymouth where about half the ads are for national companies rather than local ones. In fact on Heart Cornwall, hearing a national ad outside of the newslink ads is practically unheard of. Pirate FM as well is mostly local advertisers, with about 10% of the spots being for national advertisers.
So in other words, Atlantic was trying too hard with live and local programming?
Syndicated weekend shows? Much like Heart's networking then...
And you've conveniently ignored the fact that Heart Cornwall's "95% local" adverts don't have to pay for any live and local programming originating from Cornwall, whereas a full time county station would have to.
Yep, your figures are already adding up...
Post 1 (for)- To put things in perspective, the station that was Atlantic had just 3% of the Cornish market. The station has already changed its name and lost all of its Cornish programing save this token drive show. The added speech content of this show (outwith the news and travel) has been described as responses to facebook topics. Anyone who wants meaningful local content can get it from Pirate and Radio Cornwall. Why not just let Global give their regular Heart offering to the market and see where it takes us.
Post 2 (against)- Global bought Atlantic in the full knowledge of this obligation. In their press releases they stressed that it would remain so they have to say the least a great deal of chutzpa in requesting this change after just 3 months when they can have no reliable data for doing so. Yes, OFCOM have made lots of fundemental changes to licences they themselves granted- such as Citytalk in particular.......but these changes were granted, arguably,in response to market reality and the big impact the credit crunch/ recession(s) have and are having on the radio market. Global can't....and aren't.....arguing this is the case here as it isn't. It smacks of pettiness.......they simply don't want to do it, rather like a child not wanting to do its homework or eat its greens. End of. It's an easy one for OFCOM to say no to.
So there you have both my 'Sliding Doors' style posts. Make up your on mind because I sure as heck can't.
If it's not making money, and Atlantic wasn't, then you have to cut back. Evenings are not key timeand never will be, so that show should have been replaced with automation. Heart by comparison, aren't trying.
I don't think you really understand the issue about Global and networking. It's got nothing to do with networking evenings and overnight and weekends. That was being done back in the 1980s, with little to no compalints. The issue is networking during weekday daytime. By networking 10am - 4pm Monday to Friday, you have reduced local stations to nothing more than opt-outs.
But, if Cornwall is going to be nothing more than an opt-out to Global, then I'd rather it was an opt-out on it's own, rather than shared with Devon. And I know I'm not alone in that sentiment. According to an OFCOM study that was done back in 2004, whilst they were trying to decide what to do with the licences that eventually became Atlantic FM/Radio Plymouth etc, listeners in Cornwall had no interest at all in regional programming. Making Heart Devon and Heart Cornwall into Heart South West will be something that the listeners will not care for at all.
But that's no different from what Atlantic were doing before being bought. 12 minutes an hour of mainly local commercials. You cannot tell me that Atlantic were not making plenty of revenue, they plainly were. If they mispent it, then it's their fault. And do you honestly think Global would have bought Atlantic if it wasn't producing good revenue numbers? As so many on here are so fond of saying, Global isn't a charity, it's not in the business of saving failing stations out of the goodness of it's heart. The fact is it is producing more than enough revenue to run Global's 7 hour breakfast and drivetime opt-outs, if Global wanted to. But no, it's cheaper to merge it with Heart Devon.
Not necessarily. When Atlantic FM first launched, they launched with a bunch of new advertisers. Most of their adverts were for companies who had never advertised on Pirate FM. Even now, there are a large number of companies across Cornwall that could afford the advertising. Indeed a number of companies that advertise in the Cornish weeklies, don't advertise on commercial radio at all, and some of them could certainly afford it. So, the available evidence indicates that there is more than enough potential advertisers available. Even a number of companies that used to advertise, some of them for a number of years, and then just decided to stop advertising on commercial radio, thinking their job was done I suppose, could become advertisers again if they so chose to.
This is no different to what's happened across the country in other Ofcom mini-regions. Cities like Leicester and Nottingham share one "local" service with Derby. Herts, Bucks, Beds and Northants share one "local" service. Norfolk and Sufflok have a merged East Anglia service.
This consultation isn't about "localness" - the localness rules are very clear. It's about changing the Format of the Cornwall station to the same as the Devon ones. If Ofcom won't let them, Global could go ahead with a merged drivetime show, but give it the (slightly) higher speech percentage of the Cornwall service.
You don't know that. You don't know how cheaply Atlantic were selling ad space for.
Yes, because they knew they could provide a service at much lower cost.
You're guessing at how much revenue it was producing. But, yes, it's cheaper to merge it with Devon, so that's what they've done.
How would you have done it?