In many ways, this thread has become just like the old Five Live message board. I wasn't surprised when that closed because it was a deeply unpleasant place to visit. All this thread needs now is Wendy's conspiracy theories and it's job done. It would be nice to discuss Five Live without the torches being lit but it seems that's an impossibility.
For the record, I don't particularly like Victoria's show. I think she was better suited to breakfast/drive but many of the comments aimed in her direction are uncalled for. I do wonder what the real motivation is behind some of them.
Surprised Mickey Clark is on being a former Evening Standard Journalist.
Curious to see if Shelagh Fogarty is on today as she has crossed picket lines in the past.
You would think the BBC would accept calls by the NUJ to extend consultation on redundancies by six months especially with a new DG starting, a new Director of News to be appointed, a new 5 live controller and the weaknesses in news highlighted by Savile / Newsnight.
Surely the quality of news output is one of the most important justifications for the existence of the BBC and the level of cuts should be reviewed by the the incoming management.
It is indeed a rare day today streaky - I agree with you!
The NUJ is striking over compulsory redundancies affecting about 30 members. A quick glance at the BBC internal jos site yesterday showed there were plenty of journalists jobs being advertised.
Now of course, not every job will be a perfect match every time. But the number of contracts and attachments up for grabs demonstrates that there are posts within the BBC for those affected.
Paying off redundancies and hiring new staff will cost a good deal more than extending the deadline as you sensibly suggest.
By the way - to others - it's not all about the egos here. The BBC pays reasonably well, but many of those on strike today are lower grade journalists and broadcast assistants, of whom losing a day's pay will make a big dent in the monthly household budget.
George Riley in for Forgarty, bloody hell they are scraping the barrel.
On the whole, sports departments have far lower NUJ membership ratios - and of course Five Live has a large number of sports presenters who they can call on to fill the gaps. From what I'm hearing so far it seems to be a load of reruns of earlier interviews and a heck of a lot of filling.
By the way - to others - it's not all about the egos here. The BBC pays reasonably well, but many of those on strike today are lower grade journalists and broadcast assistants, of whom losing a day's pay will make a big dent in the monthly household budget.
As you know so much..when you say the BBC pays ' reasonably well ' could you enlighten us all about what sums we are talking about here and what salaries are presenters like Derbyshire,Campbell/Bacon/Nolan on ?Because this is kept under wraps and although asked many times by government to disclose individual salaries ,nobody seems to be able to find out but obviously you know the figures ?Are the BBC journos'/workers working in line within the rules of that of an outdated closed shop ?
As you know so much..when you say the BBC pays ' reasonably well ' could you enlighten us all about what sums we are talking about here and what salaries are presenters like Derbyshire,Campbell/Bacon/Nolan on ?Because this is kept under wraps and although asked many times by government to disclose individual salaries ,nobody seems to be able to find out but obviously you know the figures ?Are the BBC journos'/workers working in line within the rules of that of an outdated closed shop ?
I don't, because few network presenters are paid on standard salary scales which are open and transparent. As is the case with every broadcaster in this country and most of the world. And I stand by my line that this should remain the case in a commercially competitive environment.
For a jobbing radio journo, salaries range from about £20k to about £40k depending on experience and the nature of the job. A senior journalist (eg producer, local radio news editor) might earn up to £45k, though this level is the exception rather than the rule.
These figures would exclude London weighting and the allowance paid to longer serving staff for flexible/unpredictable working hours. This is a flat fee of either £5k or £2.5k depending on when people joined the BBC. Many new starters don't get anything.
There's no "closed shop" at the BBC. Journos are encouraged to join the NUJ and tecchies are encouraged to join Bectu, but it's certainly not a pressurised environment in that sense. The unions still enjoy collective bargaining to an extent, but in recent years there's been a salary freeze, and last year a small pay rise which - in real terms - barely matched the rate of inflation.
In many ways, this thread has become just like the old Five Live message board. I wasn't surprised when that closed because it was a deeply unpleasant place to visit. All this thread needs now is Wendy's conspiracy theories and it's job done. It would be nice to discuss Five Live without the torches being lit but it seems that's an impossibility.
For the record, I don't particularly like Victoria's show. I think she was better suited to breakfast/drive but many of the comments aimed in her direction are uncalled for. I do wonder what the real motivation is behind some of them.
I'm sorry you feel that way but its what you make of it - if you don't like a particular focus just move on & post your own ideas - I already suggested an ideal (for me presenter list) what's yours - any ideas for new formats etc?
We have a right to know how much public servants are paid because we pay their wages. If new jobs are available, journalists who are concerned they won't have a job should apply for them.
If new jobs are available, journalists who are concerned they won't have a job should apply for them.
Why go to the expense of making them redundant?
It is the same with the NHS with the scrapping of PCTs, a lot of the staff made redundant walk into the same jobs with the new Clinical Commissioning Groups.
Much as I moan about some of the presenters / output of 5 live, it is hard to argue that the presenters and output today padded out with repeats of interviews from Sports Week, Double take and in Pienaar’s Politics is an improvement.
I don't enjoy listening to George for an extended period of time so thought I'd switch over to BBC London and listen to Robert Elms
He's on strike as well !
They're playing a repeat of a previous program. Bit disconcerting at first as I thought It was deja vu as I recognised a couple of the calls.....:D
We have a right to know how much public servants are paid because we pay their wages. If new jobs are available, journalists who are concerned they won't have a job should apply for them.
They have been. Except in some cases, the redeployment policy - which is meant to help identify those jobs - hasn't worked and those affected have only found out after someone else has been appointed.
They have been. Except in some cases, the redeployment policy - which is meant to help identify those jobs - hasn't worked and those affected have only found out after someone else has been appointed.
As I said earlier restructuring and redeployment isn't exactly new in business.If you don't like the new terrms and conditions..move on and take the redundancy on offer.I did in my industry and I won't be the last,along with other millions of workers over the years.The BBC and the media aren't the special case they like to think they are.If their skills are so great then getting another job shouldn't be a problem or retrain in something else.Lots of people do it.I came to the conclusion that half the people in management haven't got a clue about whats going on in their company or what they are doing.Good staff would leave or get fed up and the business would slide down hill.Thats there problem but most of the staff that left went on to better things and better jobs.My very intelligent two kids, graduated but hated the work environment in the UK and are now doing great working in China and Japan respectively, as teachers.They love it and won't be coming back !
Cyril,, I think you're missing my point. Last autumn the BBC and the Unions came to an agreement which reaffirmed and strengthened a commitment to a redeployment policy. This actually avoided strike action at the time.
Lots of large organisations have such policies, whereby existing staff who are at risk of redundancy in one area are prioritised for vacancies which may arise in another area.
The NUJ says this policy has been overlooked or even ignored by some managers, or in some cases HR recruiters (who are often outsourced to Capita) and reps have examples of this. In the main, these are the 30 or so people who are the focus of today's strike.
By the way - they still have to go through a competitive interview process with other applicants, but at least have a guarantee of an interview. This isn't a matter of "special cases". It's the principle of having an agreed policy, only for one side to break the agreement.
12.00 Men's Hour
1.00 Out in the Cold
2.00 Hillsborough: Faith and Justice
3.00 Cricket Without Boundaries
4.00 Beyond Disability: Adventures of a Blue Badger
4.30 Black Armband - the Full Story
5.30 Wake Up to Money With Mickey Clark.
6.00 5 live Breakfast With Clare McDonnell and Ian Payne. Including at 9.00 Your Call with Clare McDonnell.
10.00 Rachael Hodges
12.00 George Riley
2.00 Seth Bennett
4.00 5 live Drive With Adrian Goldberg and Giles Dilnot.
I understand you are probably rejoying that people are losing their jobs, and detest that anyone nowadays dare support a union, but get real. 5 Live is today just a shell service, and you'd the the 1st to moan when they don't/can't react to the next huge news story.
Or do you really not have a heart? You condone job losses? You condone people losing their livelyhoods?
Rejoying??? How does one do that? What's a livelyhood? Is that a hoodie who's a bit boisterous? Nope, that doesn't make a lot of sense here either.
I find this whole strike thing ironic. On the one hand the BBC is keen to cut its costs, hence redundancies. On the other hand there is the near £1bn cost of relocating to Salford, a scandalous waste of public money and the hidden cost of putting employees personal relationships under strain.
Presumably the jobs are considered redundant. It would be simpler to just ransfer people in jobs that won't exist any more to jobs they can do that will exist, but for that to work all sides have to be in agreement.
[/B]They have been. Except in some cases, the redeployment policy - which is meant to help identify those jobs - hasn't worked and those affected have only found out after someone else has been appointed.
So weren't the new jobs advertised in such a way as to enable anybody who looked for them to find them?
Comments
..and if you don't we'll send the boys around.
Even the women aren't spared.
For the record, I don't particularly like Victoria's show. I think she was better suited to breakfast/drive but many of the comments aimed in her direction are uncalled for. I do wonder what the real motivation is behind some of them.
They sound interesting.......
I'm fairly new round these parts and haven't heard of them
George Riley in for Forgarty, bloody hell they are scraping the barrel.
It is indeed a rare day today streaky - I agree with you!
The NUJ is striking over compulsory redundancies affecting about 30 members. A quick glance at the BBC internal jos site yesterday showed there were plenty of journalists jobs being advertised.
Now of course, not every job will be a perfect match every time. But the number of contracts and attachments up for grabs demonstrates that there are posts within the BBC for those affected.
Paying off redundancies and hiring new staff will cost a good deal more than extending the deadline as you sensibly suggest.
By the way - to others - it's not all about the egos here. The BBC pays reasonably well, but many of those on strike today are lower grade journalists and broadcast assistants, of whom losing a day's pay will make a big dent in the monthly household budget.
On the whole, sports departments have far lower NUJ membership ratios - and of course Five Live has a large number of sports presenters who they can call on to fill the gaps. From what I'm hearing so far it seems to be a load of reruns of earlier interviews and a heck of a lot of filling.
As you know so much..when you say the BBC pays ' reasonably well ' could you enlighten us all about what sums we are talking about here and what salaries are presenters like Derbyshire,Campbell/Bacon/Nolan on ?Because this is kept under wraps and although asked many times by government to disclose individual salaries ,nobody seems to be able to find out but obviously you know the figures ?Are the BBC journos'/workers working in line within the rules of that of an outdated closed shop ?
I agree.....really enjoyed listening to 5live today and no ego's to ruin it.
I don't, because few network presenters are paid on standard salary scales which are open and transparent. As is the case with every broadcaster in this country and most of the world. And I stand by my line that this should remain the case in a commercially competitive environment.
For a jobbing radio journo, salaries range from about £20k to about £40k depending on experience and the nature of the job. A senior journalist (eg producer, local radio news editor) might earn up to £45k, though this level is the exception rather than the rule.
These figures would exclude London weighting and the allowance paid to longer serving staff for flexible/unpredictable working hours. This is a flat fee of either £5k or £2.5k depending on when people joined the BBC. Many new starters don't get anything.
There's no "closed shop" at the BBC. Journos are encouraged to join the NUJ and tecchies are encouraged to join Bectu, but it's certainly not a pressurised environment in that sense. The unions still enjoy collective bargaining to an extent, but in recent years there's been a salary freeze, and last year a small pay rise which - in real terms - barely matched the rate of inflation.
What? A load of extended repeated interviews?
I'm sorry you feel that way but its what you make of it - if you don't like a particular focus just move on & post your own ideas - I already suggested an ideal (for me presenter list) what's yours - any ideas for new formats etc?
Why go to the expense of making them redundant?
It is the same with the NHS with the scrapping of PCTs, a lot of the staff made redundant walk into the same jobs with the new Clinical Commissioning Groups.
I assume the likes of Micky Clarke are either not NUJ or don't agree with the striker.
He's on strike as well !
They're playing a repeat of a previous program. Bit disconcerting at first as I thought It was deja vu as I recognised a couple of the calls.....:D
They have been. Except in some cases, the redeployment policy - which is meant to help identify those jobs - hasn't worked and those affected have only found out after someone else has been appointed.
As I said earlier restructuring and redeployment isn't exactly new in business.If you don't like the new terrms and conditions..move on and take the redundancy on offer.I did in my industry and I won't be the last,along with other millions of workers over the years.The BBC and the media aren't the special case they like to think they are.If their skills are so great then getting another job shouldn't be a problem or retrain in something else.Lots of people do it.I came to the conclusion that half the people in management haven't got a clue about whats going on in their company or what they are doing.Good staff would leave or get fed up and the business would slide down hill.Thats there problem but most of the staff that left went on to better things and better jobs.My very intelligent two kids, graduated but hated the work environment in the UK and are now doing great working in China and Japan respectively, as teachers.They love it and won't be coming back !
Lots of large organisations have such policies, whereby existing staff who are at risk of redundancy in one area are prioritised for vacancies which may arise in another area.
The NUJ says this policy has been overlooked or even ignored by some managers, or in some cases HR recruiters (who are often outsourced to Capita) and reps have examples of this. In the main, these are the 30 or so people who are the focus of today's strike.
By the way - they still have to go through a competitive interview process with other applicants, but at least have a guarantee of an interview. This isn't a matter of "special cases". It's the principle of having an agreed policy, only for one side to break the agreement.
12.00 Men's Hour
1.00 Out in the Cold
2.00 Hillsborough: Faith and Justice
3.00 Cricket Without Boundaries
4.00 Beyond Disability: Adventures of a Blue Badger
4.30 Black Armband - the Full Story
5.30 Wake Up to Money
With Mickey Clark.
6.00 5 live Breakfast
With Clare McDonnell and Ian Payne. Including at 9.00 Your Call with Clare McDonnell.
10.00 Rachael Hodges
12.00 George Riley
2.00 Seth Bennett
4.00 5 live Drive
With Adrian Goldberg and Giles Dilnot.
Rejoying??? How does one do that? What's a livelyhood? Is that a hoodie who's a bit boisterous? Nope, that doesn't make a lot of sense here either.
I find this whole strike thing ironic. On the one hand the BBC is keen to cut its costs, hence redundancies. On the other hand there is the near £1bn cost of relocating to Salford, a scandalous waste of public money and the hidden cost of putting employees personal relationships under strain.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/the-hidden-cost-of-bbcs-move-north--marriages-and-families-forced-to-split-6447544.html
Robbie Savage on, come back Bacon all is forgiven
Presumably the jobs are considered redundant. It would be simpler to just ransfer people in jobs that won't exist any more to jobs they can do that will exist, but for that to work all sides have to be in agreement.
So weren't the new jobs advertised in such a way as to enable anybody who looked for them to find them?