Oh I see! Now people have pointed out to you that it would cost rather a lot to open schools for 3 extra weeks a year, you're switching the argument. Great strategy - lose one argument, quickly switch to another and hope nobody notices.
I have switched nothing and I still don't see the point of 13 weeks holiday a year.
1. Roles in my school: teachers, teaching assistants, pastoral assistants, canteen staff, learning mentors, exams' officer, learning support admin staff (too many varied roles to name), bursar and assistants, caretaking staff, secretaries/PAs, student support staff (running school shop, medical bay etc.), technicians (science, tech, art etc.), business manager and reprographics staff. I've probably missed somebody. The fact is that in a modern average sized secondary school, this is the kind of staff needed to keep it running if you want to maximise your teachers in the classroom.
When I was at school we had what I have put in bold.
Do we REALLY need all these others?
*No idea why I'm still justifying but...*
Much of the extra work was done centrally at one point but as LA's have been cut down, responsibility for finances etc. has been devolved to schools. Things like exams, with so many exams' series, there has been a need to have somebody doing that job - used to be done by teachers, but you'd literally not have time to teach and be in lessons for about 6 weeks of the year. Like I said before, it's all about putting teachers in the classroom rather than doing admin in the increasingly demanding world of education.
Or, alternatively, schools are simply taking the government for a ride.
Much of the extra work was done centrally at one point but as LA's have been cut down, responsibility for finances etc. has been devolved to schools. Things like exams, with so many exams' series, there has been a need to have somebody doing that job - used to be done by teachers, but you'd literally not have time to teach and be in lessons for about 6 weeks of the year. Like I said before, it's all about putting teachers in the classroom rather than doing admin in the increasingly demanding world of education.
Or, alternatively, schools are simply taking the government for a ride.
The last few years, August weather has been crap. The best weather seems to be in June and Sept these days.
It does vary doesn't it. We had that long hot summer last year, but the 2 years before that (at least) it seemed to rain non-stop through the summer holidays.
You only need them if you want to invent jobs for people.
I can only suggest to go and spend some time in a reasonable sized secondary school for a few weeks. It is a very different place from 'your day' I suspect.
I can only suggest to go and spend some time in a reasonable sized secondary school for a few weeks. It is a very different place from 'your day' I suspect.
I suspect you are right. No wonder Education is so expensive.
I'm in Upper Sixth over in Northern Ireland. We only got 3 days off.
That said, we get two months off in the summer for some reason.
A lot of the schools in my area got the same this year, I wonder if they'll take slightly longer for St Patrick's weekend because of Easter being late.
I think the extra 2-3 days we had in school prior to Easter and the lack of half term in the summer term probably made up part of the extra days for the summer.
You only need them if you want to invent jobs for people.
Believe me, if schools could get rid of some of these people it could. Mine did a massive restructuring a couple of years ago in an attempt to save money due to the budget cuts. They've had to re-hire people since because it was simply impossible for the people we were left with to do everything that needs to be done. We're still very short of learning assistants and children with conditions such as dyspraxia are therefore getting no help.
Until you work in a school, you don't realise how much the pupils need that break after 6 weeks.
I have worked in a school where I worked all year round with only 4 weeks holiday and now I work in a different one where I get all of the school holidays off. Persoanlly I would prefer a higher wage and to work all year round but it's not necessary in this particular job.
However the pupils really, really need that break especially those in the Special Needs unit I work in.
Until you work in a school, you don't realise how much the pupils need that break after 6 weeks.
I have worked in a school where I worked all year round with only 4 weeks holiday and now I work in a different one where I get all of the school holidays off. Persoanlly I would prefer a higher wage and to work all year round but it's not necessary in this particular job.
However the pupils really, really need that break especially those in the Special Needs unit I work in.
Completely agree. The hours and breaks in education are for the children. They're children, not adult workers and they need it.
School times and holidays aren't about the parents or anyone else.
We didnt have half of those position when I was at school either, but schools have changed greatly since I was there!! Each government has added and changed and mucked about the education system, its beyond recognition now. Apart from teachers, those lucky secretaries that manage to negotiate full time contracts and caretakers who work all the holidays maintaining the school, all the other staff are paid term time only. So whether you like it or not, apart from the strain on children, who start school at 5 years of age, working 5 days a week, with only 4 weeks off a year, it would be financially impossible for schools to pay for this without getting more money from taxpayers!
We didnt have half of those position when I was at school either, but schools have changed greatly since I was there!! Each government has added and changed and mucked about the education system, its beyond recognition now. Apart from teachers, those lucky secretaries that manage to negotiate full time contracts and caretakers who work all the holidays maintaining the school, all the other staff are paid term time only. So whether you like it or not, apart from the strain on children, who start school at 5 years of age, working 5 days a week, with only 4 weeks off a year, it would be financially impossible for schools to pay for this without getting more money from taxpayers!
The obvious answer is to get rid of the froth. They have all these extra positions but still have to make exams far easier.
Pastoral assistants ??
Learning mentors ??
Learning support admin staff ??
Student support staff ??
Reprographics staff ??
The obvious answer is to get rid of the froth. They have all these extra positions but still have to make exams far easier.
Pastoral assistants ??
Learning mentors ??
Learning support admin staff ??
Student support staff ??
Reprographics staff ??
etc etc
You've drifted away from the point a bit. Whether there are too many overpaid workers in schools doesn't alter the fact that it would be expensive to open all schools for an extra the weeks a year. Even with a simple teaching, leadership and site staff you'd be looking at millions.
For you, would reducing the school holidays to 10 weeks from 13 be worth paying for. And where would you see the money coming from?
The obvious answer is to get rid of the froth. They have all these extra positions but still have to make exams far easier.
Pastoral assistants ??
Learning mentors ??
Learning support admin staff ??
Student support staff ??
Reprographics staff ??
etc etc
Ahem, one of those is my job title!
I do the admin in the Learning Support unit. There is a heck of a lot of paperwork especially relating to the pupils with Statements and my job is essential.
I also help out in the main office with a couple of things that used to be the responsibility of the LEA and they have now passed over to schools.
The pastoral staff are also essential, dealing with issues such as bullying and links with the pupils' homes. In a school of 1600 pupils, who would do that otherwise?
There is a part-time person in reprographics - a lot of people do their own photopying but if she didn't do the bulk photocopying it would be doen to higher paid admin staff to do it so it's a good financial decision to employ her.
ETA I am also not overpaid, the admin staff are very poorly paid in the school I work in:(
This week is half term week but is it really necessary to have weeks off in february,may and october. Should schools fall in line with other sectors of the workforce and work through to easter and christmas. I would abolish half terms and reduce easter to just a few days just like the majority of the workforce.
I love the kids having time off school, funnily enough I enjoy their company. I didn't have children so they could spend their entire childhood in a classroom.
I particularly like the October break as my son was born halfway through it and will never have to attend school on his birthday!:D
Comments
That said, we get two months off in the summer for some reason.
I have switched nothing and I still don't see the point of 13 weeks holiday a year.
When I was at school we had what I have put in bold.
Do we REALLY need all these others?
yes..
*No idea why I'm still justifying but...*
Much of the extra work was done centrally at one point but as LA's have been cut down, responsibility for finances etc. has been devolved to schools. Things like exams, with so many exams' series, there has been a need to have somebody doing that job - used to be done by teachers, but you'd literally not have time to teach and be in lessons for about 6 weeks of the year. Like I said before, it's all about putting teachers in the classroom rather than doing admin in the increasingly demanding world of education.
Or, alternatively, schools are simply taking the government for a ride.
You choose.
You only need them if you want to invent jobs for people.
The teachers in my day must have been superhuman.
I can only suggest to go and spend some time in a reasonable sized secondary school for a few weeks. It is a very different place from 'your day' I suspect.
Or, as I've pointed out a few times, the job and schools have changed.
Like everything else in the public sector. They are top heavy with employees.
And that is taxed and stretched over 12 months, pittance. Good job I love my job
And I support my family since my husband was made redundant nearly 4 years ago - but that's just extra information.
Because the kids are in exams or just back at school. It's like one of the laws of nature*.
*not really but, you know.
A lot of the schools in my area got the same this year, I wonder if they'll take slightly longer for St Patrick's weekend because of Easter being late.
I think the extra 2-3 days we had in school prior to Easter and the lack of half term in the summer term probably made up part of the extra days for the summer.
Believe me, if schools could get rid of some of these people it could. Mine did a massive restructuring a couple of years ago in an attempt to save money due to the budget cuts. They've had to re-hire people since because it was simply impossible for the people we were left with to do everything that needs to be done. We're still very short of learning assistants and children with conditions such as dyspraxia are therefore getting no help.
I have worked in a school where I worked all year round with only 4 weeks holiday and now I work in a different one where I get all of the school holidays off. Persoanlly I would prefer a higher wage and to work all year round but it's not necessary in this particular job.
However the pupils really, really need that break especially those in the Special Needs unit I work in.
Completely agree. The hours and breaks in education are for the children. They're children, not adult workers and they need it.
School times and holidays aren't about the parents or anyone else.
The obvious answer is to get rid of the froth. They have all these extra positions but still have to make exams far easier.
Pastoral assistants ??
Learning mentors ??
Learning support admin staff ??
Student support staff ??
Reprographics staff ??
etc etc
You've drifted away from the point a bit. Whether there are too many overpaid workers in schools doesn't alter the fact that it would be expensive to open all schools for an extra the weeks a year. Even with a simple teaching, leadership and site staff you'd be looking at millions.
For you, would reducing the school holidays to 10 weeks from 13 be worth paying for. And where would you see the money coming from?
Ahem, one of those is my job title!
I do the admin in the Learning Support unit. There is a heck of a lot of paperwork especially relating to the pupils with Statements and my job is essential.
I also help out in the main office with a couple of things that used to be the responsibility of the LEA and they have now passed over to schools.
The pastoral staff are also essential, dealing with issues such as bullying and links with the pupils' homes. In a school of 1600 pupils, who would do that otherwise?
There is a part-time person in reprographics - a lot of people do their own photopying but if she didn't do the bulk photocopying it would be doen to higher paid admin staff to do it so it's a good financial decision to employ her.
ETA I am also not overpaid, the admin staff are very poorly paid in the school I work in:(
I love the kids having time off school, funnily enough I enjoy their company. I didn't have children so they could spend their entire childhood in a classroom.
I particularly like the October break as my son was born halfway through it and will never have to attend school on his birthday!:D