BT TV and YouView for those without Infinity

I wanted to start this thread just to get it absolutely clear about those of us with YouView, BT Vision but without BT Infinity might hope to receive once BT Sport launches on 1st August.

I've just used BT's online Chat Assistance: Good idea but their scripts are able to give me the info I need. However, they told me there that I would receive BT Sport on my YouView box without Infinity. My reading of the recent press release is that I won't be able to receive it or the extra IPTV channels.

Can anyone shed any light? VisionMan?
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  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    Mr. Allen wrote: »
    I wanted to start this thread just to get it absolutely clear about those of us with YouView, BT Vision but without BT Infinity might hope to receive once BT Sport launches on 1st August.

    I've just used BT's online Chat Assistance: Good idea but their scripts are able to give me the info I need. However, they told me there that I would receive BT Sport on my YouView box without Infinity. My reading of the recent press release is that I won't be able to receive it or the extra IPTV channels.

    Can anyone shed any light? VisionMan?

    Hi. What you have been told sounds like tosh. But until the YouView announcements are made, I would just be speculating.

    General question - As far as I am aware the YV box does not have a CI card slot (often referred to as a CAM). Is this correct?
  • R410R410 Posts: 2,991
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    As far as I am aware if you do not have BT Infinity you need a BT Vision box to be able to receive the BT Sports channels.

    They will be received via an aerial, not via IPTV. This will require you to be in an area that can receive the full Freeview service, not a Freeview 'Lite' service.
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    R410 wrote: »
    As far as I am aware if you do not have BT Infinity you need a BT Vision box to be able to receive the BT Sports channels.

    They will be received via an aerial, not via IPTV. This will require you to be in an area that can receive the full Freeview service, not a Freeview 'Lite' service.

    Thats the way I understand it too. And to decode the encrypted DTT transmission one needs a box with a CI slot for a conditional access card. Which a YouView box doesn't have. But a BTV box does.

    What a strange turn of events this is.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 301
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    I agree it's a bit bizarre! BT have stated for some time that their long term strategy will be the youview box, yet they'll probably be a significant number of customers (in non-infinity areas) with a youview box that will have to be migrated onto a bt vision box in order to get the free sports channels. Feels a bit backward!

    It makes you wonder whether the Pace version of the Youview box (that BT had to bin) would have had a CI slot for exactly these instances.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 37
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    Absolutely bizarre because at this rate I will have to migrate back to an older product. Given that ADSL gives me a speed of over 15mb I'm pretty sure I will be able to stream HD quality programming as I can at the moment on other BT products. More signups for Infinity but a number of dissatisfied customers as well. Even more of a kick in the ass as I am less than 200m from my exchange!
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 301
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    Mr. Allen wrote: »
    Absolutely bizarre because at this rate I will have to migrate back to an older product. Given that ADSL gives me a speed of over 15mb I'm pretty sure I will be able to stream HD quality programming as I can at the moment on other BT products. More signups for Infinity but a number of dissatisfied customers as well. Even more of a kick in the ass as I am less than 200m from my exchange!

    I also notice that BT aren't yet taking orders for BT sport if you're in an non-infinity area, which makes me think that Openreach are working double quick to enable as many networks as possible before they have to commit to giving people sport over DTT.

    In other words, don't be surprised if you network gets enabled very soon...
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 553
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    The new BT Vision bundles pages also don't appear to mention YouView anywhere near as much as they could have done.

    Have BT made a mistake with betting the house on YouView?
  • 1andrew11andrew1 Posts: 4,088
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    Hup_73 wrote: »
    It makes you wonder whether the Pace version of the Youview box (that BT had to bin) would have had a CI slot for exactly these instances.
    I too have been convinced that this was the plan, ensuring a simple, remotely activated switch to IPTV.
  • d'@ved'@ve Posts: 45,452
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    Openreach will be introducing Multicast TV over adsl broadband later this year so if BT Retail think they can gain enough extra Sport customers they will I suspect introduce it, for areas not in the fibre rollout plan, using Youview..

    This is speculation on my part - and it would have to be a cut-down service (fewer channels, probably SD only, and excluding people with very slow adsl connections).

    They will probably have their hands full initially though, handling the Sports-Infinity sign-ups, and they may want to wait and see how that goes, first.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 99
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    This is complete make-up mode, but surely it's not beyond the wit of man to have an internet connected box check subscription status with the server and squirt a decryption key down to the YouView box. This would circumvent the need for a CI slot.
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    guilbo wrote: »
    This is complete make-up mode, but surely it's not beyond the wit of man to have an internet connected box check subscription status with the server and squirt a decryption key down to the YouView box. This would circumvent the need for a CI slot.

    Um. Agree. And on copper, a line speed of only 5Mbps would be required to recieve a Multicast signal. So say, 7Mbps for overall household internet usage.

    Strange days. And a retrograde move too.

    Bizarre...
  • rj414irj414i Posts: 147
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    I was also told that my Youview box would be able to watch BT Sport 1, BT Sport 2 and ESPN by 1st Aug,(BT copper wire internet)

    The CS rep said that I would get email or call shortly before that date to be able to use these channels.

    When I said that I had Freesat from Sky he said that he could take the card number so that it would work on 1st Aug, this being the 'preferred option'.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 99
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    VisionMan1 wrote: »
    Um. Agree. And on copper, a line speed of only 5Mbps would be required to recieve a Multicast signal. So say, 7Mbps for overall household internet usage.

    Strange days. And a retrograde move too.

    Bizarre...

    Not quite as you have to allow for 2 HD signals being received simultaneously while watching HD on demand at the same time. HD is about 7Mb, so 21Mb in total + some for domestic use.

    I don't know the hardware is in place at the exchange to allow ADSL multicast and given that the intention seems to be to send ADSL the way of dialup in the next couple of years I can't see them putting in the investment. I suppose they could do unicast for those who need it, but if there were a lot of customers on the exchange that could cause a whole set of other contention problems.

    Push comes to shove they're in a period of migration and that means growing pains. So I kind of sympathise that it's not trivial to cater for all possible permutations, but doing the best they can for the majority is about all they can do. Major bummer for those not covered by that, though. Maybe that's why they've held off this long getting this going.
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    guilbo wrote: »
    Not quite as you have to allow for 2 HD signals being received simultaneously while watching HD on demand at the same time. HD is about 7Mb, so 21Mb in total + some for domestic use.

    I don't know the hardware is in place at the exchange to allow ADSL multicast and given that the intention seems to be to send ADSL the way of dialup in the next couple of years I can't see them putting in the investment. I suppose they could do unicast for those who need it, but if there were a lot of customers on the exchange that could cause a whole set of other contention problems.

    Push comes to shove they're in a period of migration and that means growing pains. So I kind of sympathise that it's not trivial to cater for all possible permutations, but doing the best they can for the majority is about all they can do. Major bummer for those not covered by that, though. Maybe that's why they've held off this long getting this going.

    Guilbo, what D@ve said in post #10. Its true.

    And my exchange is already enabled for both fibre and ADSL Multicast TV. At first I thought it was for the TalkTalk network, but I now know different. As its now on the Openreach website -

    https://www.btwholesale.com/pages/static/Products/Broadband/TV_Connect/index.htm

    And heres a very informed article on it -

    http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/5800-bt-tv-connect-service-to-carry-live-tv-channels-over-wbc-network.html

    Interesting times. And if you've got any questions, I'll answer them if I can.
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    Oh, and guilbo, HD is streamed at 10Mbps. Which I know is contradictory information as to whats on the BT webpage. But the BT web pages are garbage.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 37
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    Just watched my first BT Sport advert. The small print states that a minimum 4mb broadband speed is required. This could, of course, just be for the 'app' but potentially enables BT Sport to be available on both Vision and YouView in SD with HD only available for those on Infinity or above 15mb. Clearly BT want to get as many people on Infinity as soon as possible to plug the gap on their capital investment but could also be good news for those for whom it hasn't reached. I continue to live in hope, just wish they'd communicate better!
  • neyney Posts: 12,516
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    I have BT Infinity and a YouView box with the BT Vision player TV unlimited. Could I in time be able to get the BT sports channels via the YouView box. I would take them at what they are offering but im in no rush to get them as I only renewed my BT Infinity contract just over 4 weeks ago when I added the BT Vision player TV unlimited and got nearly £8 of a month for BT Infinity 2.

    Darren
  • BangersBangers Posts: 3,625
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    ney wrote: »
    I have BT Infinity and a YouView box with the BT Vision player TV unlimited. Could I in time be able to get the BT sports channels via the YouView box. I would take them at what they are offering but im in no rush to get them as I only renewed my BT Infinity contract just over 4 weeks ago when I added the BT Vision player TV unlimited and got nearly £8 of a month for BT Infinity 2.

    Darren

    BT's information to date has said they are only making BT Sport 1 & 2 available to YouView users that bought their YouView box directly from BT. If I remember correctly in previous posts you have said you bought your YouView box yourself from a shop, in which case you might be out of luck - for the near future at least.
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    Bangers wrote: »
    BT's information to date has said they are only making BT Sport 1 & 2 available to YouView users that bought their YouView box directly from BT. If I remember correctly in previous posts you have said you bought your YouView box yourself from a shop, in which case you might be out of luck - for the near future at least.

    Erm... Sorry to add to this sea of confusion but does anyone know what on earth this is all about??? -

    http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/tv-dvd-audio/digital-tv-services/freeview-recorders/bt-youview-hd-recorder-500-gb-21354532-pdt.html#longDesc

    Its a BT YouView box, sold at retail. And have you seen the price!?! :eek:
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 301
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    Eh?? Now I'm really confused!! :D
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    Hup_73 wrote: »
    Eh?? Now I'm really confused!! :D

    Two people from two different forums have now emailed PC World to say they've made a mistake.
  • d'@ved'@ve Posts: 45,452
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    VisionMan1 wrote: »
    Erm... Sorry to add to this sea of confusion but does anyone know what on earth this is all about??? -

    http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/tv-dvd-audio/digital-tv-services/freeview-recorders/bt-youview-hd-recorder-500-gb-21354532-pdt.html#longDesc

    Its a BT YouView box, sold at retail. And have you seen the price!?! :eek:

    PC World prices and [lack of] competence. :rolleyes:

    Or you could get the internally identical Humax version from Amazon for £229, post free. :cool:
  • VisionMan1VisionMan1 Posts: 2,111
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    d'@ve wrote: »
    PC World prices and [lack of] competence. :rolleyes:

    Or you could get the internally identical Humax version from Amazon for £229, post free. :cool:

    Or a John Lewis 1TB YouView T1010 box for £250. :D

    http://www.johnlewis.com/humax-dtr-t1010-youview-smart-1tb-freeview-hd-digital-tv-recorder/p231880515?kpid=231880515&s_kenid=29771575-3ac8-7b09-7346-0000482fa2cd&s_kwcid=ppc_pla&tmad=c&tmcampid=73
  • R410R410 Posts: 2,991
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    VisionMan1 wrote: »
    Erm... Sorry to add to this sea of confusion but does anyone know what on earth this is all about??? -

    http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/tv-dvd-audio/digital-tv-services/freeview-recorders/bt-youview-hd-recorder-500-gb-21354532-pdt.html#longDesc

    Its a BT YouView box, sold at retail. And have you seen the price!?! :eek:
    This does sort of confuse things a little bit.

    Since it is a BT Branded YouView box, as you would get from BT, it might get the update required.

    I have taken what BT have said to mean that non BT branded YouView boxes will not receive the update and so will not be able to get the channels.
  • neyney Posts: 12,516
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    Bangers wrote: »
    BT's information to date has said they are only making BT Sport 1 & 2 available to YouView users that bought their YouView box directly from BT. If I remember correctly in previous posts you have said you bought your YouView box yourself from a shop, in which case you might be out of luck - for the near future at least.

    That dont sound to good.
    Maybe I will just have to make do with getting the BT sport channels online and via an app for now them.

    Darren
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