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Foxsat LNB1 output. Any problems?


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Old 12-03-2009, 20:39
beberex
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Hi Guys.

Nobody seems to have mentioned whether they`ve had any problems using this function. There`s some stuff about using it to link through to the LNB2 input as a stop gap until a correct quad LNB with the dual cable is installed but that seems to be all at the momment. Or maybe I`ve misunderstood just what this feature is intended for.

I`ve recently ditched Sky so I`ve now got a completely worthless Sky HD box. So I tried connecting the LNB1 O/P to the LNB1 input on the Sky box to see what would happen.

Doing this seemed to not only report "No Satellite Signal Being Received" on the Sky box but a much reduced signal strength/quality on the Foxsat.
Is this something to do with altering impedances etc? - or Mismatch.

Then I decided to try it with the Foxsat switched to standby and lo and behold the Sky box now worked fine. There was just one rather strange thing. In services/system setup/signal detection on the Sky it reported a zero signal strength (all blue) but a normal signal quality indication (over 75%). The picture was absolutely fine on all stations

I`m only doing it to receive Ch4 HD so it`s not a big issue but it just seemed to be a little strange.

So, is the Foxsat designed to output LNB1 to another STB without any problems or have I just got a slightly strange problem somewhere.

I`m sure that Graham will come up with an answer if he doesn`t get too bored reading all this drivel!
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Old 13-03-2009, 00:02
gkite
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Hi Guys.

Nobody seems to have mentioned whether they`ve had any problems using this function. There`s some stuff about using it to link through to the LNB2 input as a stop gap until a correct quad LNB with the dual cable is installed but that seems to be all at the momment. Or maybe I`ve misunderstood just what this feature is intended for.

I`ve recently ditched Sky so I`ve now got a completely worthless Sky HD box. So I tried connecting the LNB1 O/P to the LNB1 input on the Sky box to see what would happen.

Doing this seemed to not only report "No Satellite Signal Being Received" on the Sky box but a much reduced signal strength/quality on the Foxsat.
Is this something to do with altering impedances etc? - or Mismatch.

Then I decided to try it with the Foxsat switched to standby and lo and behold the Sky box now worked fine. There was just one rather strange thing. In services/system setup/signal detection on the Sky it reported a zero signal strength (all blue) but a normal signal quality indication (over 75%). The picture was absolutely fine on all stations

I`m only doing it to receive Ch4 HD so it`s not a big issue but it just seemed to be a little strange.

So, is the Foxsat designed to output LNB1 to another STB without any problems or have I just got a slightly strange problem somewhere.

I`m sure that Graham will come up with an answer if he doesn`t get too bored reading all this drivel!
I've saw pretty much exactly this when outputting LNB1 to an old Sky digibox. However, I had to completely power down my Foxsat to get any signal to my Sky box (at least, I thought I did, I'm pretty sure standby didn't work). I also noticed the same signal reading anomalies, (but got quality about 60% on sky), and yet on Foxsat I get 100% quality and 90% strength. Picture was fine on the Sky box. Sky box is only to keep a viewing card active so not an issue for me.
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Old 13-03-2009, 04:13
beberex
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Morning gkite.

It`s nice to know that we`re not alone in the universe sometimes. I`m sure that there`s a perfecly acceptable reason for this happening.
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Old 13-03-2009, 04:31
gkite
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Morning gkite.

It`s nice to know that we`re not alone in the universe sometimes. I`m sure that there`s a perfecly acceptable reason for this happening.
I guess the answer is, it's not designed to output to another STB (from memory that is not a scenario that is in the manual), only to loop-through to itself. One might infer that is one and the same thing. We'll have to wait for someone to come up with a technical answer as to why it's not!
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Old 13-03-2009, 08:09
buttery
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I would think that doing it that way both recievers would be outputting power to the lnb at the same time.
On some recievers you can switch power to the lnb off
and I would think that this is what you would have to do on one of the recievers
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Old 13-03-2009, 09:38
grahamlthompson
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Hi Guys.

Nobody seems to have mentioned whether they`ve had any problems using this function. There`s some stuff about using it to link through to the LNB2 input as a stop gap until a correct quad LNB with the dual cable is installed but that seems to be all at the momment. Or maybe I`ve misunderstood just what this feature is intended for.

I`ve recently ditched Sky so I`ve now got a completely worthless Sky HD box. So I tried connecting the LNB1 O/P to the LNB1 input on the Sky box to see what would happen.

Doing this seemed to not only report "No Satellite Signal Being Received" on the Sky box but a much reduced signal strength/quality on the Foxsat.
Is this something to do with altering impedances etc? - or Mismatch.

Then I decided to try it with the Foxsat switched to standby and lo and behold the Sky box now worked fine. There was just one rather strange thing. In services/system setup/signal detection on the Sky it reported a zero signal strength (all blue) but a normal signal quality indication (over 75%). The picture was absolutely fine on all stations

I`m only doing it to receive Ch4 HD so it`s not a big issue but it just seemed to be a little strange.

So, is the Foxsat designed to output LNB1 to another STB without any problems or have I just got a slightly strange problem somewhere.

I`m sure that Graham will come up with an answer if he doesn`t get too bored reading all this drivel!
Just a thought, not having a Sky box but I think that the Sky boxes report signal strength and quality from a specific transponder. If the tuner 1 on the foxsat happened to be tuned to a band that this transponder was not in then it would not find any signal. Repeat the experiment changing the foxsat channels as follows (one on each band) 105 (low band horizontal), 108 (low band vertical), 200 (high band horizontal), 137 (high band vertical)
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Old 13-03-2009, 10:53
nwhitfield
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When the Humax is powered up, it's going to be controlling the LNB, and so the Sky box is going to report problems. Power it down, and the Sky box on the passthrough can do more or less what it wants.

The main reason for the loopthrough would seem to be in single cable distribution (Unicable) installations, but those aren't presently a supported configuration for the Humax.
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Old 13-03-2009, 12:01
beberex
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Thanks guys.

I think that Mr Whitfield has put the hammer and nails together here. The Foxsat does indeed seem to take control of the LNB when it`s powered up.

The Sky box always reports No Satellite signal whenever the Foxsat is switched on but just seems to operate as a loop through while it`s off.

I only tried it because of the following description from the manuel[sic]

http://s231.photobucket.com/albums/e...Foxsatrear.jpg
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Old 13-03-2009, 12:33
grahamlthompson
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Thanks guys.

I think that Mr Whitfield has put the hammer and nails together here. The Foxsat does indeed seem to take control of the LNB when it`s powered up.

The Sky box always reports No Satellite signal whenever the Foxsat is switched on but just seems to operate as a loop through while it`s off.

I only tried it because of the following description from the manuel[sic]

http://s231.photobucket.com/albums/e...Foxsatrear.jpg
When on the foxsat tuner 1 out must output all the channels in the band that it's currently using. If it did not then using a foxsat on one cable with the 2nd tuner looped to tuner 1 out would not work. As hundreds will testify it works pretty well this way. Nigel simply saying that only a subset of available channels is available for the sky box (depending on what channel tuner 1 is tuned to). The same subset that tuner 2 is given when connected on one cable

Last edited by grahamlthompson : 13-03-2009 at 12:35. Reason: extra info
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Old 17-03-2009, 01:14
winterwarmer
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When on the foxsat tuner 1 out must output all the channels in the band that it's currently using. If it did not then using a foxsat on one cable with the 2nd tuner looped to tuner 1 out would not work. As hundreds will testify it works pretty well this way. Nigel simply saying that only a subset of available channels is available for the sky box (depending on what channel tuner 1 is tuned to). The same subset that tuner 2 is given when connected on one cable
I have just bought the Foxsat HDR. Up to now I had been using a Hauppaugr NOVA-HD-S2 card in my PC to pick up satelite channels. I am certainly also confussed by the way the LNB 1 Out port seems to work.

Up to when my Foxsat was installed I typically could get at total of 500+ (last scan a month ago was 519) channels.

The FOXSat seems to be running fine with two satellite feeds and picks up all of the freessat (and if a manual tune the non-freesat) stations. However my PC now connected via the LNB 1 out port is missing a lot of chanels. To check so far I have tried 3 scans

1 - with Foxsat on (BBC 1) - PC found 252 channels
2- with Foxsat on standby - PC found 327 channels
3- with Foxsat powered off - PC found 346 channels

Clearly these are from a range of different transponders but I can't get close to the previous recetion I had.

I guess there must be somthing droping the signal quality down on route which is a pity as it would have been good to continue to use my PC to watch programmes when SO wants the TV
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Old 17-03-2009, 04:26
CPN
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Repeat the experiment changing the foxsat channels as follows (one on each band) 105 (low band horizontal), 108 (low band vertical), 200 (high band horizontal), 137 (high band vertical)
You're on the right track...

Looks like only the high band f's allow the Signal Test screen to work on either 200 or 137. No indications on either of the other 2.

The real pitta is that the only time that the Skybox will work fully is if the HDR is actually switched off at the back panel while running on the HDR's LNB1 Out pass through. To put it another way, if the HDR is on but in Standby, it still retains control over the LNB switching (which is as it should be really) and the Sky box will only receive the channels related to how the HDR last switched the LNB.
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Old 17-03-2009, 04:33
CPN
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I guess there must be something dropping the signal quality down on route which is a pity as it would have been good to continue to use my PC to watch programmes when SO wants the TV
See my previous post... It's not that it's "dropping the signal quality" on LNB1 out, it's simply that the Foxsat is not allowing the NOVA to control the LNB switching the way that it needs to... If you simply switch the Foxsat OFF by the rear panel switch, all your channels will return on the PC ...of course, I doubt the SO will be impressed!
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Old 17-03-2009, 07:47
awo1949
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Have a look at this thread.

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...php?p=29182274
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Old 17-03-2009, 09:14
gkite
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See my previous post... It's not that it's "dropping the signal quality" on LNB1 out, it's simply that the Foxsat is not allowing the NOVA to control the LNB switching the way that it needs to... If you simply switch the Foxsat OFF by the rear panel switch, all your channels will return on the PC ...of course, I doubt the SO will be impressed!
I think winterwarmer is saying that even with the Foxsat powered off, he is still not getting the same number of channels (346 instead of 500+). Certainly when I had my Foxsat powered off my Sky box gave me a degraded quality reading and I think a 0 strength (unless I read the meter wrongly?) I get 90% strength and 100% quality on the Foxsat.
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Old 17-03-2009, 21:25
woolfynorm
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When the Humax is powered up, it's going to be controlling the LNB, and so the Sky box is going to report problems. Power it down, and the Sky box on the passthrough can do more or less what it wants.

The main reason for the loopthrough would seem to be in single cable distribution (Unicable) installations, but those aren't presently a supported configuration for the Humax.
What controlling does the PVR do with the LNB. I assume something much more fancy than just receiving a satellite signal??

Woolfynorm
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Old 17-03-2009, 21:53
awo1949
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What controlling does the PVR do with the LNB.
1) It selects the polarisation of the LNB (horizontal or vertical) by the voltage it sends to power it.

2) It selects the band the LNB receives in (low or high) by the presence or absence of a tone. The difference between the highest and lowest frequencies that the satellites use is more than can conveniently be sent on the cable to the STB, so it is split into two. A bit like selecting LW or MW on an AM radio before adjusting the tuning dial.
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Old 22-03-2009, 11:33
winterwarmer
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I think winterwarmer is saying that even with the Foxsat powered off, he is still not getting the same number of channels (346 instead of 500+). Certainly when I had my Foxsat powered off my Sky box gave me a degraded quality reading and I think a 0 strength (unless I read the meter wrongly?) I get 90% strength and 100% quality on the Foxsat.
Sorry for the delay in getting back to people here but just to confirm I get the restricted list even with the Foxsat powered off at the rear. I have not had any oppotunity to try some of the other suggestions or cable swaping which I will do at some point.
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Old 22-03-2009, 12:04
grahamlthompson
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Sorry for the delay in getting back to people here but just to confirm I get the restricted list even with the Foxsat powered off at the rear. I have not had any oppotunity to try some of the other suggestions or cable swaping which I will do at some point.
Have you turned off power saving in Sby ? You need to leave box powered but in non power saving sby to pass the Sky box control signals to the lnb.
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Old 23-03-2009, 00:10
gkite
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Have you turned off power saving in Sby ? You need to leave box powered but in non power saving sby to pass the Sky box control signals to the lnb.
Just out of interest I'll give this particular set-up a go next time I connect up my Sky box - might be a few weeks time.
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