OK so MS might be the youngest Doctor but CT was the oldest ever woman to play a female companion for more than one episode. So are the HO comments really justified?
Are the DW becoming hollyoaks comments justified?
Well given nobody has actually seen the new cast and production team's episodes I think the answer is obvious. Of course the comments aren't justified.
If those comments are solely based on there being two young lead actors in DW, then those comments are arrant nonsense (as Jon Pertwee would have said).
Originally Posted by Hot Dogg:
“Ermm.... I've never watched Hollyoaks...
Someone care to explain the analogy??
”
“Ermm.... I've never watched Hollyoaks...
Someone care to explain the analogy??
”
Well, it either means that DW is becoming a show consisting of 20-somethings struggling with relationships and being set in Chester...
...or its becoming a show where people change channel 3 seconds into the Intro after having watched The Simpsons.
Originally Posted by Hot Dogg:
“Ermm.... I've never watched Hollyoaks...
Someone care to explain the analogy??”
“Ermm.... I've never watched Hollyoaks...
Someone care to explain the analogy??
”
I've read it quite a few times across this forum, basically criticising MS age as being too young and the same with Karen. What my OP was trying to say was CT was 38(?) when she started series 4, the oldest female companion since the show began, so just because they are young now does not mean in 2/3 years time both Doctor and companion will be in their 20s.
Yeah - sex and violence, homosexuality, attractive young females we have never had anything like that on the tardis. 
Originally Posted by yorkie100:
“Yeah - sex and violence, homosexuality, attractive young females we have never had anything like that on the tardis.”
“Yeah - sex and violence, homosexuality, attractive young females we have never had anything like that on the tardis.
”
Someone's had sex on the tardis
really
Is it **** becoming like Hollyoaks. Who started saying it was?. If DW changes its intro theme with Matt Smith,Karen Gillian,sum daleks,the master and sum cybermen ponsing about to the theme tune then i will get concerned!
Originally Posted by zimnoch2007:
“Is it **** becoming like Hollyoaks. Who started saying it was?. If DW changes its intro theme with Matt Smith,Karen Gillian,sum daleks,the master and sum cybermen ponsing about to the theme tune then i will get concerned!”
“Is it **** becoming like Hollyoaks. Who started saying it was?. If DW changes its intro theme with Matt Smith,Karen Gillian,sum daleks,the master and sum cybermen ponsing about to the theme tune then i will get concerned!”
Though it would be funny just the once. To wind people up like....
No it's not like Hollyoaks, cast and crew should be insulted at the comparison really.
Originally Posted by Bezmina:
“Though it would be funny just the once. To wind people up like....
No it's not like Hollyoaks, cast and crew should be insulted at the comparison really.”
“Though it would be funny just the once. To wind people up like....
No it's not like Hollyoaks, cast and crew should be insulted at the comparison really.”
What the Hollyoaks cast being compared to a children's show.
I can see similarities at times, I've seen better acting on SJA than on Hollyoaks
Its nice to see that people don't feel the comparison is justified....I remember arguing this point so many times on the announcement of Karen....
The show has always gone for quite young female, more than usually dressed to impress the dads...assisstants.....and as for Matt, well he may be the youngest Doctor ever....byt he isn't that far behind Peter Davison when he started....with his assisstants younger than him...so unless they were making the show into HO then too....I can't see the basis of this arguement myself really.....
The show has always gone for quite young female, more than usually dressed to impress the dads...assisstants.....and as for Matt, well he may be the youngest Doctor ever....byt he isn't that far behind Peter Davison when he started....with his assisstants younger than him...so unless they were making the show into HO then too....I can't see the basis of this arguement myself really.....
<<<
its becoming a show where people change channel 3 seconds into the Intro after having watched The Simpsons
>>>
They're still making The Simpsons?!?! Blimey!
its becoming a show where people change channel 3 seconds into the Intro after having watched The Simpsons
>>>
They're still making The Simpsons?!?!
Blimey!
I'm always more bewildered by the fact they're still making Hollyoaks! I don't think I've ever seen a worse made programme. Actually, any time I've ever seen it (by accident!), it's always struck me how the cast look like the product of some weird cloning experiment (anodyne blonde Atomic Kitten look for the girls, anodyne chiselled Blue look for the boys). Maybe the Sontarans have got some secret base in Chester - if the production teams ever do fancy a link-up, there's a starting point for them....
This is a good thread, though. It's definitely worth discussing these criticisms instead of just dismissing them out of hand. Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline, and, while David Tennant can't help it if many people find him attractive, I still think the 'Doctor as heart-throb' angle has been pushed a little - does the Doctor have to snog every companion for some tenuous reason (female, that is ... unless Wilf's going to get a very special Christmas surprise )? I'm well aware that when Matt Smith starts filming he'll be little younger than Peter Davison was when he became the Doctor, yes, and I trust the Who production team enough to think that their primary consideration was Matt's acting ability but ... but .... at the back of my mind there's still the thought that, despite what Steven Moffat said about how the Doctor should ideally be a man in his 40s (I haven't got the quote to hand so forgive me if that's not 100% what he said), the BBC were concerned that the programme would lose its modern "sexy" appeal (and possibly some of its audience who tune in because of this) if some old bloke suddenly took over. I'm not saying that I agree with the Hollyoaks In Space comments (I certainly don't - the elements I don't like in New Who are still way overshadowed by the elements I do) but I can see where the people who are making these criticisms are coming from.
This is a good thread, though. It's definitely worth discussing these criticisms instead of just dismissing them out of hand. Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline, and, while David Tennant can't help it if many people find him attractive, I still think the 'Doctor as heart-throb' angle has been pushed a little - does the Doctor have to snog every companion for some tenuous reason (female, that is ... unless Wilf's going to get a very special Christmas surprise
)? I'm well aware that when Matt Smith starts filming he'll be little younger than Peter Davison was when he became the Doctor, yes, and I trust the Who production team enough to think that their primary consideration was Matt's acting ability but ... but .... at the back of my mind there's still the thought that, despite what Steven Moffat said about how the Doctor should ideally be a man in his 40s (I haven't got the quote to hand so forgive me if that's not 100% what he said), the BBC were concerned that the programme would lose its modern "sexy" appeal (and possibly some of its audience who tune in because of this) if some old bloke suddenly took over. I'm not saying that I agree with the Hollyoaks In Space comments (I certainly don't - the elements I don't like in New Who are still way overshadowed by the elements I do) but I can see where the people who are making these criticisms are coming from.
Originally Posted by brouhaha:
“Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline”
“Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline”
Of course, the Doctor never actually said 'I wuv you Rose'...
I can see where you're coming from - personally, I prefer the Doctor to stay out of all that luvey-dovey stuff, but I can understand the character's motivation: last survivor of his race looking to pro-create blah, blah, blah.
Was the Doctor supposed to be in love with Rose?
Well, yes, of course he was. RTD has made that abundantly clear, but, in terms of what was actually seen on-screen, I think fandom has over-inflated it a bit. Aside from the closing moments of 'Doomsday' and a couple of scenes in 'The Stolen Earth', precious little screentime was devoted to 'the relationship'. And the 'Journey's End' scene saw the Doctor fob her off with a carbon copy.
That only amounts to a few minutes actually on-screen in over 50 episodes. So, for that reason, I think to say that 'Doctor Who' is now soap-opera is going a bit over-the-top. It's not RTD's style, anyway - he likes that sort of stuff to remain largely unspoken, bubbling under the surface.
And, of course, the notion of romance for the male-lead is not something exclusive to soap-opera, but can be found across all types of fiction.
Does anyone deride the original series of Star Trek as 'soap opera', which saw Kirk getting off with some random hussy in almost every episode? Is James Bond 'soap opera'?
I think it just stands out more in Doctor Who, as the Classic Series had us accustomed to a character who was pretty much devoid of any kind of sexuality. Hence, one brief sentimental moment from the Doctor now stands out far more than it would do were it any other TV show.
Regards,
Cypher
Originally Posted by brouhaha:
“I'm always more bewildered by the fact they're still making Hollyoaks! I don't think I've ever seen a worse made programme. Actually, any time I've ever seen it (by accident!), it's always struck me how the cast look like the product of some weird cloning experiment (anodyne blonde Atomic Kitten look for the girls, anodyne chiselled Blue look for the boys). Maybe the Sontarans have got some secret base in Chester - if the production teams ever do fancy a link-up, there's a starting point for them....
This is a good thread, though. It's definitely worth discussing these criticisms instead of just dismissing them out of hand. Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline, and, while David Tennant can't help it if many people find him attractive, I still think the 'Doctor as heart-throb' angle has been pushed a little - does the Doctor have to snog every companion for some tenuous reason (female, that is ... unless Wilf's going to get a very special Christmas surprise )? I'm well aware that when Matt Smith starts filming he'll be little younger than Peter Davison was when he became the Doctor, yes, and I trust the Who production team enough to think that their primary consideration was Matt's acting ability but ... but .... at the back of my mind there's still the thought that, despite what Steven Moffat said about how the Doctor should ideally be a man in his 40s (I haven't got the quote to hand so forgive me if that's not 100% what he said), the BBC were concerned that the programme would lose its modern "sexy" appeal (and possibly some of its audience who tune in because of this) if some old bloke suddenly took over. I'm not saying that I agree with the Hollyoaks In Space comments (I certainly don't - the elements I don't like in New Who are still way overshadowed by the elements I do) but I can see where the people who are making these criticisms are coming from.”
“I'm always more bewildered by the fact they're still making Hollyoaks! I don't think I've ever seen a worse made programme. Actually, any time I've ever seen it (by accident!), it's always struck me how the cast look like the product of some weird cloning experiment (anodyne blonde Atomic Kitten look for the girls, anodyne chiselled Blue look for the boys). Maybe the Sontarans have got some secret base in Chester - if the production teams ever do fancy a link-up, there's a starting point for them....
This is a good thread, though. It's definitely worth discussing these criticisms instead of just dismissing them out of hand. Personally, I've been very critical of the cloying sentimentality in New Who, especially the dreary soap opera element of the "I wuv you Rose" storyline, and, while David Tennant can't help it if many people find him attractive, I still think the 'Doctor as heart-throb' angle has been pushed a little - does the Doctor have to snog every companion for some tenuous reason (female, that is ... unless Wilf's going to get a very special Christmas surprise
)? I'm well aware that when Matt Smith starts filming he'll be little younger than Peter Davison was when he became the Doctor, yes, and I trust the Who production team enough to think that their primary consideration was Matt's acting ability but ... but .... at the back of my mind there's still the thought that, despite what Steven Moffat said about how the Doctor should ideally be a man in his 40s (I haven't got the quote to hand so forgive me if that's not 100% what he said), the BBC were concerned that the programme would lose its modern "sexy" appeal (and possibly some of its audience who tune in because of this) if some old bloke suddenly took over. I'm not saying that I agree with the Hollyoaks In Space comments (I certainly don't - the elements I don't like in New Who are still way overshadowed by the elements I do) but I can see where the people who are making these criticisms are coming from.”
Just want to pick up on this point.....
As you said that DT can't help it if some fancy him.....and even though I do think he is good looking....I don't think he is in the conventional sense, neither was CE (who I also think is very handsome)...and for many, if the horrid comments in 2007 are anything to go by, CT was seen by many as a change from the usual sexy female assisstant that has been a trend since the blooming show started...although I would say she is very beautiful, but clearly some don't think so....in fact, even Billie gets the odd "she's fat/ugly" comments too.....
So basically what I am trying to say is that, all that proves is beauty is the eye of the beholder....and none of the above I have mentioned, including DT, were really chosen for their looks....but because they suited the part.....so why the hell would the BBC/Moff cast someone more on the account of their looks rather than acting and Role suitability, when the show has been successful enough without having to do that so far????????.....
Originally Posted by TimCypher:
“Of course, the Doctor never actually said 'I wuv you Rose'...”
“Of course, the Doctor never actually said 'I wuv you Rose'...
”
Agreed....
Quote:
“I can see where you're coming from - personally, I prefer the Doctor to stay out of all that luvey-dovey stuff, but I can understand the character's motivation: last survivor of his race looking to pro-create blah, blah, blah.”
“I can see where you're coming from - personally, I prefer the Doctor to stay out of all that luvey-dovey stuff, but I can understand the character's motivation: last survivor of his race looking to pro-create blah, blah, blah.”
Agreed....
Quote:
“Was the Doctor supposed to be in love with Rose?
Well, yes, of course he was. RTD has made that abundantly clear, but, in terms of what was actually seen on-screen, I think fandom has over-inflated it a bit. Aside from the closing moments of 'Doomsday' and a couple of scenes in 'The Stolen Earth', precious little screentime was devoted to 'the relationship'. And the 'Journey's End' scene saw the Doctor fob her off with a carbon copy.”
“Was the Doctor supposed to be in love with Rose?
Well, yes, of course he was. RTD has made that abundantly clear, but, in terms of what was actually seen on-screen, I think fandom has over-inflated it a bit. Aside from the closing moments of 'Doomsday' and a couple of scenes in 'The Stolen Earth', precious little screentime was devoted to 'the relationship'. And the 'Journey's End' scene saw the Doctor fob her off with a carbon copy.”
Agreed....
Quote:
“That only amounts to a few minutes actually on-screen in over 50 episodes. So, for that reason, I think to say that 'Doctor Who' is now soap-opera is going a bit over-the-top. It's not RTD's style, anyway - he likes that sort of stuff to remain largely unspoken, bubbling under the surface.”
“That only amounts to a few minutes actually on-screen in over 50 episodes. So, for that reason, I think to say that 'Doctor Who' is now soap-opera is going a bit over-the-top. It's not RTD's style, anyway - he likes that sort of stuff to remain largely unspoken, bubbling under the surface.”
Agreed very much so....and the amoount of kiising that takes place is also a largely small amount of the screen time......
Quote:
“And, of course, the notion of romance for the male-lead is not something exclusive to soap-opera, but can be found across all types of fiction.
Does anyone deride the original series of Star Trek as 'soap opera', which saw Kirk getting off with some random hussy in almost every episode? Is James Bond 'soap opera'?”
“And, of course, the notion of romance for the male-lead is not something exclusive to soap-opera, but can be found across all types of fiction.
Does anyone deride the original series of Star Trek as 'soap opera', which saw Kirk getting off with some random hussy in almost every episode? Is James Bond 'soap opera'?”
Exactley....
Quote:
“I think it just stands out more in Doctor Who, as the Classic Series had us accustomed to a character who was pretty much devoid of any kind of sexuality. Hence, one brief sentimental moment from the Doctor now stands out far more than it would do were it any other TV show.
Regards,
Cypher”
“I think it just stands out more in Doctor Who, as the Classic Series had us accustomed to a character who was pretty much devoid of any kind of sexuality. Hence, one brief sentimental moment from the Doctor now stands out far more than it would do were it any other TV show.
Regards,
Cypher”
Personally, even though it is very subtle...i sometimes see little flashes of sexual attractions between the Doctors and his companions in the classic series too.....i.e 4th Doc and Romana...and Sarah Jane.....Oh and Jamie and the Second Doctor.....love them two!!!!!!
....But other than that I agree with what you said.....again....
