Yes, the retailer is contractually obliged to provide a free HDMI lead if one isn't included in the box - part of the Freesat contract they signed.

I'm guessing that when they added the HDR to the catalogue, there was no point in creating a new category for a single product. Now there's more products they have forgotten to move the HDR into the new category.

Has anyone news whether any of these forthcoming models will have diseq control for multiple lnb dishes to receive eg 19.2E etc satellites / motorised dishes?

Also whether they will do timer recording on non-freesat mode?

From the manufacturers sites and listings on maplin, argos, very, joinfreesat etc these points have not been addressed. The manuals of the non-recording versions of Goodmans/Grundig receivers also do not mention whether they have diseqc (or even non-freesat although previous posts have referred to there being a non-freesat capability)

For a Goodmans the price don't seem too appealing to me I'm afraid.

Well, the question for me is whether the killer faults (for me, I accept not for others) in the Humax product will still apply in the Goodmans or Sagem ones.

A PVR which loses all scheduled recordings if there is a powercut and where you cannot delete recordings if it is recording is not one I'm going to buy, I'm afraid. Having used both Tivo and Sky Plus/Sky HD - where neither of those problems occurred - I am not going to purchase a system which, again to my mind and perhaps not to others, fails dismally on the basics of what being a PVR is.

On the other hand, I would accept (slightly) lower PQ in the Goodmans or Sagem models if they do not have those killer faults.

Fair enough,but I would never accept poorer PQ.I'm on the lookout now for an HDD dvd recorder which has the best PQ.I have a Pioneer 42" plasma and am considering the Pioneer dvd recorders in the hope the output from the source would be as good as the V+stb.Trouble is the reviews from people who have bought them just say "good picture".I know for a fact that some people have said the Foxsat sd picture can look near to HD quality.I know different TV's play a part but I don't like the sd picture on the Foxsat at all and just record HD progs with it.
So if anyone can recommend an HDD dvd recorder with excellent source output PQ I'd be very grateful........Sorry for going off topic.
Thanks.

One would indeed hope Sagem and Harvard plc (Goodmans/Grundig) have been reading the list of Humax gripes which for me includes;
Diseqcontrol (which the Humax has but Panasonic not)
and
Non-freesat timer recording (which the Humax does not but Panny has)
as "killer" items without which there is no point buying an all in one product which I would expect at the price.

I agree the pure pvr fundamentals have to be right too!!!

My hopes are slightly dashed already having found old posts on the non-recording Harvard versions where there was no diseqc and even not so old french forum posts on the Sagem's sold there not having diseqc and reliability / PQ issues.