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Ratings Thread (Part 4) |
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#1301 |
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Join Date: Sep 2005
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It looks like BBC1 was dented the most with nothing bar the news over 3m from 8.30pm onwards.
Usually that Live at the Apollo repeat would probably have done good business. A half hour edit of Traffic Cops on a Friday is very lazy scheduling |
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#1302 |
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Just been doing a few calculations regarding The X Factor and the 75 minute audition format:
Segment 1 - 19:01 to 19:11 (10 minutes) Segment 2 - 19:15 to 19:26 (11 minutes) Segment 3 - 19:30 to 19:44 (14 minutes) Segment 4 - 19:49 to 19:58 (09 minutes) Segment 5 - 20:02 to 20:10 (08 minutes) Total = 52 minutes So, 52 minutes for a 75 minute show, that means only 69% of the programme is actually the programme itself. When it was on for 60 minutes, I'd say there was about 45 minutes of content which would have worked out as 75% programme content compared to ads. I think, in this area, ITV are trying to play "the Big Brother trick" like Channel 4 did by extending their shows by 10 minutes with an extra short segment(s). In the 7pm hour, there were 16 minutes of adverts on ITV. |
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#1303 |
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Well, that's ITV screwed for next week, no going back now. Even if they're hoping that The Cube is more protected from Strictly, it has still got Merlin to worry about and it has a head-start as well. It launched with 6.7m last year.
ITV should have gone: 5.50pm - People Do The Funniest Things 6.50pm - The X Factor 8.05pm - The Cube 9.05pm - Casino Royale I don't really think Casino Royale can be on before 9pm, so The X Factor would have to start after Merlin. But this way, CR starts just as SCD finishes. I think The Cube would do better and The X Factor would definitely do far better than it will. But with things the way they are, I think Strictly will come out comfortably on top next week against X Factor and crush The Cube (I think something like 3.3m is likely). |
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#1304 |
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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Quote:
It looks like BBC1 was dented the most with nothing bar the news over 3m from 8.30pm onwards.
Usually that Live at the Apollo repeat would probably have done good business. A half hour edit of Traffic Cops on a Friday is very lazy scheduling Saying that EastEnders was little better. Emmerdale seems to be the only soap out of the big 3 to meet expectations at the moment. Derren Brown did excellently for Channel 4, and it'll be interesting to see how he fairs against BBC1's behemoth next week. Rebus will be down to the high 2Ms I reckon, though the repeats are doing ok for ITV at the moment. |
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#1305 |
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Quote:
Well, that's ITV screwed for next week, no going back now. Even if they're hoping that The Cube is more protected from Strictly, it has still got Merlin to worry about and it has a head-start as well. It launched with 6.7m last year.
ITV should have gone: 5.50pm - People Do The Funniest Things 6.50pm - The X Factor 8.05pm - The Cube 9.05pm - Casino Royale I don't really think Casino Royale can be on before 9pm, so The X Factor would have to start after Merlin. But this way, CR starts just as SCD finishes. I think The Cube would do better and The X Factor would definitely do far better than it will. But with things the way they are, I think Strictly will come out comfortably on top next week against X Factor and crush The Cube (I think something like 3.3m is likely). The other thought I had was maybe they should switch Family Fortunes and The Cube around. Family Fortunes had a tested core fan base - The Cube hasn't. |
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#1306 |
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I think ITV believe they're defending The Cube more by pitching it against Merlin. But they're deluded - Merlin has the lead in and The Cube'll flounder. A shame, because they do have a moderate hit on their hands at the moment.
The other thought I had was maybe they should switch Family Fortunes and The Cube around. Family Fortunes had a tested core fan base - The Cube hasn't. They should have a family drama, IMO. It's not that hard, the BBC family drama slate consists of one remake (Doctor Who) and two based on legends. Hardly great creativity at work, just pick a popular fictional character or a film and make a TV show! Plus, do it right and you can sell some merchandise. All they have is TV Burp but at 30 minutes, it's not enough. Family Fortunes falls to around 4m without a strong lead-in. ITV have never made good use of The X Factor. Just look at Sundays, they're putting on Doc Martin! And they wonder why they struggle with young viewers?! |
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#1307 |
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In the 7pm hour, there were 16 minutes of adverts on ITV.
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#1308 |
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I think ITV urgently need a decent show for Saturday nights to go alongside The X Factor. Ever since they stopped taking an autumn run of Saturday Night Takeaway, it has been very bare.
They should have a family drama, IMO. It's not that hard, the BBC family drama slate consists of one remake (Doctor Who) and two based on legends. Hardly great creativity at work, just pick a popular fictional character or a film and make a TV show! Plus, do it right and you can sell some merchandise. All they have is TV Burp but at 30 minutes, it's not enough. Family Fortunes falls to around 4m without a strong lead-in. ITV have never made good use of The X Factor. Just look at Sundays, they're putting on Doc Martin! And they wonder why they struggle with young viewers?! The Fixer would've been an interesting programme to use The X Factor lead out on. The lead out's are rubbish this year TBH - Doc Martin would do well wherever it goes, so why not use it to strengthen a weak night's schedule? Quick question - I thought Match of the Day had to be aired by at least 10.30pm every Saturday, but tonight it's not on until 11.05pm. I guess the BBC have a special agreement to do this because of the Proms? |
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#1309 |
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No there weren't. The ofcom limit is 12 minutes per hour.
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#1310 |
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Are you sure? I'm sure broadcasters like Channel 4 go over that limit often with Big Brother episodes and stuff.
Of course though they might try and push the boundaries a bit and see if they get away with it. Having only taped the BB final this year and literally skimmed through it I noticed the final ad break was actually six minutes long - 2 minutes more than the legal limit. OFCOM really screwed up with their latest relaxation of the ad laws. I do believe they were correct to let longer programmes have more ads, but they screwed up on the timing meaning many shows which run between 1-2 hours now also have ads on average every 15 minutes, just a year after the 20-minute rule (which required 20 minutes of running time between the start of one internal part and the start of the next) was abolished. This has meant rather than the extra breaks being sneaked in pretty much unnoticed, they've been widely commented on, notably with Wuthering Heights and the C4 9/11 documentary last week. |
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#1311 |
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No there weren't. The ofcom limit is 12 minutes per hour.
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Are you sure? I'm sure broadcasters like Channel 4 go over that limit often with Big Brother episodes and stuff.
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No, what they do is time the ads carefully enough as the rule applies to a clock hour (say 7-8pm or 10-11pm), so with 3.5 minutes per ad break (plus 20 seconds of promo) if they get the timing right the last ad break will spill over by at least 2 minutes into the next clock hour, keeping them within the limits.
Of course though they might try and push the boundaries a bit and see if they get away with it. Having only taped the BB final this year and literally skimmed through it I noticed the final ad break was actually six minutes long - 2 minutes more than the legal limit. OFCOM really screwed up with their latest relaxation of the ad laws. I do believe they were correct to let longer programmes have more ads, but they screwed up on the timing meaning many shows which run between 1-2 hours now also have ads on average every 15 minutes, just a year after the 20-minute rule (which required 20 minutes of running time between the start of one internal part and the start of the next) was abolished. Quote:
Quick question - I thought Match of the Day had to be aired by at least 10.30pm every Saturday, but tonight it's not on until 11.05pm. I guess the BBC have a special agreement to do this because of the Proms?
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#1312 |
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Isn't the new Ofcom rule do "Do what the eff you like. We don't care anymore."?
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#1313 |
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No there weren't. The ofcom limit is 12 minutes per hour.
Something doesn't quite "ad" up! K |
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#1314 |
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I think ITV urgently need a decent show for Saturday nights to go alongside The X Factor. Ever since they stopped taking an autumn run of Saturday Night Takeaway, it has been very bare.
They should have a family drama, IMO. It's not that hard, the BBC family drama slate consists of one remake (Doctor Who) and two based on legends. Hardly great creativity at work, just pick a popular fictional character or a film and make a TV show! Plus, do it right and you can sell some merchandise. I do sometimes wonder if TV is running out of programme ideas because they are racing through them very fast, there are so few viewers around thesedays meaning if one channel has a big show everyone else is left to pick up the scraps. Therefore far too many new shows are branded as flops and get axed after one series, meaning yet another new idea has to be found and the cycle continues. I'm thinking about stuff like the game show Duel and comedy show Thank God You're Here. |
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#1315 |
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No there weren't. The ofcom limit is 12 minutes per hour.
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They should've held Primeval back to the autumn. They've axed it, but alongside The X Factor it would've done well and stablisied their schedule. Yes, that would've been detrimental to the spring schedule, but I'm sure they could've found enough gameshows to cover what it a weak night there.
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The Fixer would've been an interesting programme to use The X Factor lead out on. The lead out's are rubbish this year TBH - Doc Martin would do well wherever it goes, so why not use it to strengthen a weak night's schedule?
The Fixer and Benidorm should have been 9pm Sunday, particularly Benidorm.
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#1316 |
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The ad breaks are 4 minutes, but 3 minutes of ads then some promo's. Plus you've got the phone in competition. It usually runs 44 minutes an hour.
19:45:00 - Break Bumper 19:45:10 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:45:20 - ITV Logo 19:45:25 - Adverts 19:48:00 - ITV Promos for Upcoming Show(s) 19:48:30 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:48:40 - Break Bumper 19:48:50 - Back to Show Where does Ofcom enforce the '12 minute limit' from? In the example above, do they do adverts only (i.e. 19:45:25 to 19:48:00) or do they do the whole break, i.e. 19:45:20 to 19:48:30? Sorry if that sounds quite confusing.
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#1317 |
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But doesn't OfCom also limit the number of internal breaks to 3 in a programme of up to 90mins? If DMNs analysis is correct, it had 4!
Something doesn't quite "ad" up! K 1 internal break in programmes of 25 minutes+ 2 in 45 minutes+ (30 minutes for non-PSB channels) 3 in 55 minutes+ 4 in 1 hr 10 minutes+ then an extra break for every 20 minutes Prior to that it was 3 in 60 minutes+, 4 in 90 minutes+ and then an extra break for every 30 minutes. OFCOM justified it saying not many shows were longer than an hour anyway, but we've seen already how hour-long shows have been stretched out by 10 minutes to take advantage, and the most popular shows on commercial TV - The X Factor, Britains Got Talent and Dancing on Ice, generally fall into that bracket too, so will all be affected. Other shows falling in the 1-2 hour mark tend to be documentary and drama premieres, and as we saw with the examples I gave earlier, extra ads don't slip into those sort of shows unnoticed. |
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#1318 |
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But when you consider that it would be going head to head with either Strictly or the BBC's own family drama, and that there is a recession on, I can see why it isn't one of their priorities at the moment, especially when You've Been Framed repeats would probably get higher ratings
They've commissioned Piers Morgan's Life Stories to replace Family Fortunes on Saturdays but that's restricted to post watershed slots whereas FF could be moved around to suit. Quote:
I do sometimes wonder if TV is running out of programme ideas because they are racing through them very fast, there are so few viewers around thesedays meaning if one channel has a big show everyone else is left to pick up the scraps. Therefore far too many new shows are branded as flops and get axed after one series, meaning yet another new idea has to be found and the cycle continues. I'm thinking about stuff like the game show Duel and comedy show Thank God You're Here.
Duel is definitely one. It was a good idea, at the very least the prize fund could have been lowered, a better host found and the show moved to a different slot. There has definitely been a slow down internationally in new formats coming around recently. Wipeout is the biggest hit recently which doesn't say much. |
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#1319 |
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What does Ofcom class as the '12 minute period'? Same a typical break is this:
19:45:00 - Break Bumper 19:45:10 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:45:20 - ITV Logo 19:45:25 - Adverts 19:48:00 - ITV Promos for Upcoming Show(s) 19:48:30 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:48:40 - Break Bumper 19:48:50 - Back to Show Where does Ofcom enforce the '12 minute limit' from? In the example above, do they do adverts only (i.e. 19:45:25 to 19:48:00) or do they do the whole break, i.e. 19:45:20 to 19:48:30? Sorry if that sounds quite confusing. ![]() |
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#1320 |
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What does Ofcom class as the '12 minute period'? Same a typical break is this:
19:45:00 - Break Bumper 19:45:10 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:45:20 - ITV Logo 19:45:25 - Adverts 19:48:00 - ITV Promos for Upcoming Show(s) 19:48:30 - Sponsorship Bumper 19:48:40 - Break Bumper 19:48:50 - Back to Show Where does Ofcom enforce the '12 minute limit' from? In the example above, do they do adverts only (i.e. 19:45:25 to 19:48:00) or do they do the whole break, i.e. 19:45:20 to 19:48:30? Sorry if that sounds quite confusing. ![]() And while we're on the topic I might as well clarify that on average ITV, C4 and Five can only show 7 minutes of ads per hour in a 24 hour period (6am-6am) - so a total of 168 minutes. The maximum of 12 minutes in an hour though means they can use their overnight quota during the day, but during primetime (6-11pm) they can only show a total of 40 minutes of ads, hence why ITV especially pack their ads around more popular programmes and lower rated programmes end up ad free - but ITV generally show promos instead, often because they have to take the break to show the sponsor credit. The "non-PSB" digital channels can show an average of 9 minutes per hour, but still no more than 12 minutes an hour. However, they are allowed longer breaks and they seem to have been increased lately too (think it's around 4 min 30) - hence why the likes of ITV2 and E4 generally show promos at the beginning and end of a break, while ITV, C4 and Five usually only screen them at the end of a break. |
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#1321 |
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That's going back a bit now. Since June the rules have basically been...
K |
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#1322 |
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Duel is definitely one. It was a good idea, at the very least the prize fund could have been lowered, a better host found and the show moved to a different slot.
Ideally the prize money wouldn't be reduced, but perhaps make them win 5 rather than 4 duels to clinch the jackpot. Also I think the contestant versus the accelerator rounds at the end of each Duel should have had the jeopardy of if they don't cover the right answer, they leave with nothing. |
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#1323 |
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I think so you think you can dance will be an 19/talkback thames production like pop idol, its interesting that the bbc entertainment department has been dropped as the producer of Andrew lloyd webber show in favour of Talkback Thames.From the press release i get the feeling that their are going to do proper audition episodes of the show this year.
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#1324 |
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You've just answered your own question. The Festival Of Rememberance would be another special exception.
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If they don't want to spend on drama, then they should probably look to do something with Ant & Dec. They're not being used enough just now, between BGT finishing in May and the end of the year, all they do is I'm A Celebrity.
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The Fixer and Benidorm should have been 9pm Sunday, particularly Benidorm.
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#1325 |
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OK, thanks, I found a report from October last year and hadn't realised it had changed again since! (I do find the Ofcom site is an absolute nightmare to navigate!)
K Anyhow, start here: http://www.ofcom.org.uk/media/news/2009/05/nr_20090526 (as you can see OFCOM try to downplay the changes) And you'll eventually get to here - though rather than rewriting the document they edit it and cross bits out and put new bits in, which makes it even more confusing: http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/cond...ment/costa.pdf ... and skip straight to page 36. Personally I'd have preferred them to have left the number of breaks alone, certainly for shows 90 minutes or less, and instead permitted an extra 5 minutes of the daily allowance to be used in primetime. I think viewers would have noticed that less as the ads are packed around the popular programmes anyway, so it would only be around the shows which currently have what you could call "fake breaks" where the extra ads would play out. |
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