It's an interesting point - who has won more times in the clashes - The X Factor or Strictly?

Why haven't the BBC been emphasising this numeric fact to shut up everyone, especially thick, ignorant, bandwagon-jumping politicans, who's been going on about this clash?

It is just basic supply/demand. Perhaps this explains better than I did:


http://tvbythenumbers.com/numbers-102

SCD vs TXF - less of a battle, more a park walk for the latter. Hopefully ITV will be content with that result as it's still excellent, provides a load of free (positive) publicity, and no doubt it'll be back over 10m tonight with the BBC chasing an entirely different audience.

Elsewhere from the two reality giants, The Cube is standing out as a very solid performer and continues to be consistent despite the earlier slot and tougher competition. I think we're going to be seeing a lot more of this show over the next few years. Last night's instalment was terrific as well so it deserves it.

Casino Royale meanwhile was wasted in the slot it was in last night. But with a 9pm slot essential due to content and News at Ten clogging up weeknights, this was the only real option. They could have made room tonight perhaps but I doubt it would have made that much of a difference, with the benefits of starting 15 minutes earlier soon countered by the fact that it's a work night and viewers would be less likely to stay up late to watch the end.

It has to be said a really poor night for Ch4 and Five although the film on Ch4 performed somewhat better than the E.R. repeats of late.

Shame no Sky3 figures have emerged yet but I suspect the usual sources like MG and Broadcast might publish some on Monday. I'm genuinely quite interested to know how the likes of I Am Legend and the Guiness Premiership rugby match performed free-to-air.

I wouldn't really call 5.1m for Casino Royale "low", but bare in mind that unlike previous Bond films that have been shown first on ITV, Casino Royale has been shown to death on Sky Movies before ITV got the rights, therefore it's safe to assume that most viewers that the film appeals to will already have seen it recently on Sky or DVD/Blu Ray. Regardless though, surely ITV can see that sticking a stupid news programme in the middle of a film loses them viewers, 1.1m turned off while the news was on!

Also, the deal that netted ITV first run rights to the Bond films expired with Die Another Day, hence why Casino Royale was on Sky first. The same thing will happen with Quantum of Solace as per the deal with Sony, so don't expect to see QoS on ITV anytime before 2011 at the earliest. It'll probably be on Sky this Christmas though.

I don't know.

I knew there had been plenty of clashes in the past, but even I was surprised there had been 40 of them before last night!

Just goes to show, it was just the press and ITV making a mountain out of a molehill for cynical reasons.

Five are an interesting case because their dramas would skew older because they're crime dramas and I think the purchase of FlashForward is a way of getting more 16-34s to watch the channel, Lost for example skews quite young as does Fringe.

I imagine The Gadget Show which has a loyal audience of over 1m makes more money than say Brighton Beach Patrol because it skews more male and advertisers would want to put the likes Sky+ or iPhone in the ads between that because they know that that audience would more than likely buy the products. I imagine if Top Gear was on a commericial channel, they would charge a premium because it attracts males and a younger audience.

Haven't most of the 40 clashes been something like 10 or 15 minutes?

Last night was the first time in a long while that an entire X Factor show has clashed against Strictly.

For those saying about Casino Royale. Having just checked Media Guardian and BARB, the last Bond film before Royale, 'Die Another Day' premiered on Wednesday, October 27th, 2004. Below are the official and overnight ratings:

21:00 to 22:30 - 7.9m (33%) [official: 7.55m]
22:30 to 23:00 - ITV News: 5.13m [official]
23:00 to 00:05 - 5.6m (46%) [official: under 4.83m]

So ITV did last night exactly the same as what they did for the previous premiere in the 'Bond' film strand.

Some were definitely short, but unfortunately the BBC spokesperson didn't provide any more details other than there had been forty previous clashes.

I suspect 2006 might have been one of the worst years for that, as there were something like four consecutive weeks of both shows having identical start-times.

The James Bond series have been exclusive to ITV for a long time but I wonder if anyone would be brave enough to poach them like when Channel 4 got the Simpsons from the BBC despite a strong bid from Five. The BBC would never make a bid as they would be criticised too much, Channel 4 might but they have been pleading poverty and I think would damage their bid to fill their funding gap and while I think Five would try and make a bid, I reckon it would probably too expensive to justify paying over the odds.

Arguably, neither SCD or X Factor were as big 3 years ago as they are now.

I've just said something about this here - http://www.offthetelly.co.uk/?p=7559 - but yes, many times they've clashed for almost their entire length, plus their results shows. In fact in 2004, the finals were on the same night, with Strictly at 7pm and The X Factor at 6.30pm, and again the results shows at the same time.

Good article, Steve.

It might be worth e-mailling that to ITV.... or to Simon Cowell in person.

There have not been many where the clash has been more that 30 mins I reckon. However I have a feeling that prior to last year SCD was ahead of X Factor in the number of wins. I neither like nor dislike Simon Cowell, but he is certainly the most influential tv presence of this generation(certainly where entertainment is concerned).ITV is very lucky that he quite obviously "roots" for them.

True, that's probably in part due to them being scheduled apart from each other. Years ago they did clash regularly then it just turned into the smallest possible overlap and eventually none at all. The last time it really happened for any length of time was the first 2 or 3 shows of 2007 before ITV moved X Factor to a later time. Even with all the new judge hype and what is apparently a far better timeslot, Strictly was still down on last year. X Factor is down from last week (and I think maybe a touch down on last year?) and Merlin is down as well. Makes you wonder what was wrong with last years arrangement?

And of course the tv anoraks who count the number of previous tv clashes. Nobody died last night (apart from SCD's illusions). Lets enjoy the spin. When you are the underdog up against a Goliath with a mountain of cash & cross promotion opportunites, a bit of guerilla marketing goes a long way. Well done ITVs PR team for earning their keep.

TXF's credits rolled at 9.13pm by the clock on my PVR. So the ads were in the last 90 seconds or so of its designated slot.


That presupposes that they moved it for the sole reason of "trying to beat TXF".

I must have missed this statement of intent in the press release - can you point me towards it George?


Ditto.

Perhaps the Beeb are happy that they have avoided SCD starting with 5/6m and having to build throughout the show for once? And as a bonus, they didn't bequeath their 8-9m audience to what remains of TXF, giving it the chance to get 11m as last year. (Though next week TXF has a clear 30 mins after SCD finishes)

And as the primetime shares will confirm, it was not a bad night for BBC1 at all.


And yet...


Barely a gnat's fart between them.


Oh come on, what about all of ITV's outlets promoting TXF and really bigging up the 'battle of the shows' to mobilise the core viewership? Plus all the papers and mags that tend to be more chav/TXF-friendly.


I think it does show that, whilst both were dented a bit, there is a core viewership for both shows that is distinct and probably doesn't actually watch the other one.


Yep, that's the difference for me, and that's no doubt why ITV have 'BGT-ised' TXF still further to make it all but the same show apart from in name.


Whilst WTD will clearly take a knock as a result of TXF running over the 9pm junction (it so obviously will... ), I would be astonished if Doc M gets 9.4m over the hour it is actually on. Or anything close to it. 6m+ would be very strong, given ITV's drama woes of the last couple of years.


Or possibly, viewers who had drifted came back just before SCD's scheduled finish time to see who had been voted out?

Hm?


This front page story was based around some lazy staffer reading forums on DS and quoting what posters on here were saying about her!

And we know how anti-Beeb much of DS and its most regular contributors are...


It did rather better with Die Another Day though than Casino Royale! And DAD won't have had a lead-in from TXF I guess...

Far be it for me to criticise this forum's BBC Champion (being a mostly-BBC viewer myself) but Strictly and The X Factor both have exactly the same slot next Saturday as this.

But you're right about primetime audience shares. BBC1 will be well satisfied with that result.

Though to be fair like with The X Factor I imagine demographics are quite different.


Actually isn't Corrie the nations most watched show by 16-34 year olds.

There is talk of demographics, but networks only really care about demographics when the overall figure isn't too good. Always used to make me laugh when ITV kept pointing out the high proportion of 16-34 year olds who watched Echo Beach, overlooking the fact that the lower rating meant there were less 16-34s watching than would watch a repeat of A Touch of Frost.


Doesn't surprise me, and just goes to show that the networks need to be careful of supply and demand when it comes to advertising. ITV of course want more, but there is an argument that slightly less might bring in more revenue when it comes to the networks biggest programmes.

The BBC line up is very watchable and Merlin and Casualty may well see BBC1 win a number of Saturdays this Autumn-I dont imagine they won any last year. It seems to have been passed over that X Factor had its lowest audience this year and lost a million viewers.

I must work on my posts here-Robbie Sykes has quoted about 15 people but not me.

Nah. It gets around 1-1.5m during the summer (probably rises in winter).

EastEnders gets close to 2m. X Factor has around 3m. Britain's Got Talent is higher than Corrie as well.

There's other shows also which get more 16-34s watching. In a recent report, it said that 31.5% of Coronation Street's audience were aged over 65.

I read in another thread on here though that the 5th audition show last year averaged 9.4m without a clash with SCD.

So, against that, last nights 9.3m is excellent.

Next week will be interesting, don't the Bootcamp episodes usually dip a bit ?

I think the issue is that before The X Factor and Strictly Come Dancing always clashed, that people got used to it. Neither were as big as they are now (possibly because they were weakening each other), and when ITV moved The X Factor later, people got used to having the opportunity to watch their two programmes without any mucking about. The situation came about because BBC1 had no reason to move Strictly Come Dancing later to start the clash again (and many 'fantasy' schedules have been written to prove as such).

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OK rant over, and I shall never ever make a prediction again. Pizza (or anyone who predicted The X Factor would beat Strictly Come Dancing) - why did you think that, when Strictly had a 35 minute lead in, had it's results show on the same night and was the opening weekend of the programme. This against a show which has reached something like it's fifth week, has numerous repeats and whose audition format had been much derided. I'd understand if it dipped during the filler, but Strictly was lower throughout the clash. I'm astounded to be honest.

Elsewhere - great that The Cube held up in an earlier timeslot, but Merlin performed well as well, albeit lower than what it was getting last year, obviously hindered by the lower slot. Channel 4 did ok, better than it's previous Saturday's with Lord of the Rings dominating the schedule. Five struggled below 1m for most of the primetime.