BT Vision vs Sky +

Runija100 · 25-08-2009, 12:09

Hi all

I've been a BT customer for 3 years, and have a phone line, BB option 1, and BT vision. I've got speeds of over 7.0mbps in my area (with an upgrade due early next year to an estimated 9.0mbps) and have been extremely happy with their BB service, I've never had an outage or any problems at all with BT.

I mainly use the Broadband, I don't download a lot, but I am a constant user. My kids are also starting to use the internet more on their laptops, and I envisage them downloading more of their programs on I-player etc.. as they get older.

I'm happy with the Freeview channels that we get on BT Vision, I don't watch a huge amount of TV, but the kids are nagging me for more childrens channels, and I'm thinking ahead to the long dark winter months, that it may be a good idea to switch to Sky to get all the kids channels that they want.

So, what I want to ask is:
1. Should I seriously look at Sky and what they can offer vs what I currently have with BT Vision. For my needs will BT work out cheaper?

2. BT want me to renew for another 12 months,can anyone give me any hints or tips on how to negotiate with BT to get a better deal, e.g. will they upgrade me to Option 3 for the same price as Option 1, get an extra BT vision box...anything really!!

Thanks

wwwebber · 25-08-2009, 12:48

This thread has got car crash written all over it but I'll play along until the usual spoilers turn up ...

Do you subscribe to the BTVision childrens pack ? It's all down to personal choice really. If the F1 coverage on BBC went HD then I'd get Freesat like a shot and dump BTVision. As it stands I'm more than happy with BT & BTVision.

I'd look at whats on offer and decide for yourself - it's all there on the various websites.

In regards to getting a better deal I'd hold off and wait until the Vbox 2 details become available - you'll have leverage then when it comes to who gets them first.

Lastly, BT wont give you two Vbox's as they dont support it. This may change with the Vbox 2 though.

Wizross · 25-08-2009, 13:59

I have both running in a lovely harmony.

Sky+ is the far better system - although the BT Vision box does have a couple of things I'd like to see incorporated in the Sky system.

I have the BT Vision box for the extra recording facility but mainly for the on demand stuff.

paulpocket · 25-08-2009, 16:44

i recently renewed all my BT contracts. Can't be exact but...

Got free evening & weekend calls (worth £2 something)

3 months half price BT Vision

A £4something discount off my broadband.

back into a 12month contract and most of the stuff they usually offer to you anyway just in case you are thinking on leaving.

I think some other folk have got alot more off their bills so its worth a try calling them.

chris4817 · 25-08-2009, 17:16

I got a very good contract renewal discount without negotiating as it was the first thing they offered when I phoned up.

BB option 1 at £9.64 instead of £15.64. I think option 3 was £20.64?

I also got 12 months half price on the vision bronze pack at £7.34 a month.

I was very pleased

johnson293 · 25-08-2009, 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runija100

1. Should I seriously look at Sky and what they can offer vs what I currently have with BT Vision. For my needs will BT work out cheaper?

For broadband, first question has to be - are you in a Sky LLU area - if you are, then you can get Sky Everyday Broadband (up to 10mb) for £5/month, if you also use the Sky Talk Service, otherwise it costs £10/month. For both of these you also need to subscribe to Sky TV, at a min. of £17 (approx) for one mix which could be the kids package if that what you want. Sky can also do your line rental with free evening and weekends call package for £10/month.

If you aren't in a Sky LLU area they can only supply the Sky connect broadband, but that is £17/month.

You now have to compare that with what you are currently paying BT, and decide which suits you best.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runija100

2. BT want me to renew for another 12 months,can anyone give me any hints or tips on how to negotiate with BT to get a better deal, e.g. will they upgrade me to Option 3 for the same price as Option 1, get an extra BT vision box...anything really!!

I only had one offer when i was with BT - that was £2/month reduction on my broadband (opt 3) when it came to renewal time.

When i cancelled, I was offered £4 reduction for 3 months on my BB (opt 3), going back up to a £2 reduction for the remainder of the new 12 month contract.

The deals they offered me weren't as much as I was saving by switching my TV, Phone and BB to sky - but that was my own situation, and personal preferneces, and I live in a Sky LLU area.

Overall, you have to also decide whether you want linear content channels for the kids, or be happy for them to watch single episodes of programmes/channels, which can be paid for as you watch/per episode, or by subscribing to ther BT vision monthly sub.

Hope this helps.

scotty2808 · 25-08-2009, 22:16

Both Sky and BT have their benefits.

It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated.

I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?).

Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15.

scotty2808 · 25-08-2009, 22:19

Another thing Runija -

If you are not happy with the kids stuff on BTV - I'd consider complaining.
I've read a couple of people on here who want to see more kids content.

Just a thought. The more people the better i suppose.

The new free IPTV service (Canvas) has been proposed to launch in 2010 - there should be archives of free BBC / ITV / C4 / C5 kids content. Potentially with more broadcasters to join in the future. Just a thought.

Matterhorn · 25-08-2009, 22:52

I think johnson293 sums it up well with his post.

If you are in a Sky LLU area then it really is a no brainer. Go Sky, it's better and cheaper.

Alternatively if your exchange is a market 3 exchange (Ofcom classification) then plus.net do BT's equivalent of option 1 for 5.99 and option 3 for 15.99 which is a good saving. You can add phone and line rental and get free evening and weekend calls and 300 mins free international per month for 10.95 too.

with regards to deals, my brother in law who has recently re-contracted to BT for another 12 months asked for option 3 at option 1 price and BT said no problem.

Matterhorn · 25-08-2009, 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty2808

Both Sky and BT have their benefits.

It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated.

I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?).

Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15.

seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's?

scotty2808 · 25-08-2009, 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matterhorn

seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's?

all aboard the Sky Express... matterhorn is in the house!

yeah. had sky digital shortly after launch then sky+ for years. it was revolutionary, it was fantastic and modern... back in 1998, but it's just the same old same old now.

it is a case of if it ain't broke, don't fix it. it works well does its thing, but cosmetically, it's dated.

these days, the gui just looks old and tired (primarily the on screen one when you are watching a show and pressing the up/down keys).

Wizross · 25-08-2009, 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matterhorn

seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's?

It has some nice bits that would be good if added to the Sky one but as I said before, in my opinion, the Sky one is superior - and I have both so can make an informed judgement.

ashjf · 25-08-2009, 23:21

Well, how much do your kids watch?
You have:

BTV - Kids Pack / On Demand

Freeview - CBBC, cBeebies, Citv.

Also, Milkshake on Five plus a romour of its own channel, Kids on BBC iPlayer (once launched on BTV and/or Freeview)

Is that not enough?

scotty2808 · 25-08-2009, 23:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matterhorn

I think johnson293 sums it up well with his post.

If you are in a Sky LLU area then it really is a no brainer. Go Sky, it's better and cheaper.

agreed - can be a lot cheaper if are not a habitual broadband user and have the most basic tv pack.
difficult to make a comparison though as when you strip down what each service gives you at the cheapest costs.

BT is roughly £41.50 with line rental, free calls, broadband up to 20meg with a 10gig allowance, bronze TV pack with a sports channel (ESPN).

Sky is roughly £27.50 with line rental, free calls, broadband is capped at 2meg with a 2gig allowance, has sky1 and kids pack but no premium sports channel.

If you can cut down on your internet then yes it can be really cheap. If you scale up the internet to do a better comparison match BT's Option1) then at £32.50 and becomes v.good value.

Doesn't work for me though as I want a sports channel and getting ESPN for free works great. It would cost me more to go with Sky.

noise747 · 25-08-2009, 23:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty2808

Both Sky and BT have their benefits.

It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated.

Not really having used a Sky+ box to any great amount, I would really love to know what is dated about it?

I know it is getting on a bit and the EPG have been changed a few times, but at the end of the day all you do is pick what stuff you want to record and it should record it. Is that not what a PVR is about?

I never understand this idea that more features make something better.

I have a old Thomson Freeview PVr and I think it is great, it been reliable and never missed a recording, the only bad thing was no series link, which is why I got the Top up T.v box.

But you can't compare the BT vision box to a Sky+ box surely as they are two different things.

Quote:

I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?).

That is not the box, that is the content which the service provider shows.

Quote:

Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15.

It depends if he will get value out of any of the sky mixes as I doubt very much if he would have one mix unless it is the variety mix.

Lots of children channels on sky if you are prepared to pay for them, you get about 15 channels in the children pack, Mind you it depends on ages, but I think that is enough.

I don't think BT vision have the variety as sky.

Myself If I had kids I would just record a load of stuff from Freeview and let them watch that, cheap and simple.

noise747 · 25-08-2009, 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty2808

The new free IPTV service (Canvas) has been proposed to launch in 2010 - there should be archives of free BBC / ITV / C4 / C5 kids content. Potentially with more broadcasters to join in the future. Just a thought.

Canvas will fail, if it even gets started in the first place, with no QOS, more and more ISPs shaping or charging more for extra bandwidth it will not take off

stuntmaster · 26-08-2009, 00:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by noise747

Not really having used a Sky+ box to any great amount, I would really love to know what is dated about it?

I know it is getting on a bit and the EPG have been changed a few times, but at the end of the day all you do is pick what stuff you want to record and it should record it. Is that not what a PVR is about?

I never understand this idea that more features make something better.

I have a old Thomson Freeview PVr and I think it is great, it been reliable and never missed a recording, the only bad thing was no series link, which is why I got the Top up T.v box.

But you can't compare the BT vision box to a Sky+ box surely as they are two different things.

That is not the box, that is the content which the service provider shows.

It depends if he will get value out of any of the sky mixes as I doubt very much if he would have one mix unless it is the variety mix.

Lots of children channels on sky if you are prepared to pay for them, you get about 15 channels in the children pack, Mind you it depends on ages, but I think that is enough.

I don't think BT vision have the variety as sky.

Myself If I had kids I would just record a load of stuff from Freeview and let them watch that, cheap and simple.

no it doesn't, because sky is live channels and BT is On demand. like chalk and cheese really.

Sky's interface is rather outdated. they improoved it on the new HD boxes only tho. good old SD, or + users are lumbered with a lovely 256 colour flat interface.

Bt has a nice vibrant colour scheme to it and the menus do look rather aesthetically pleasing. The library is good too, sky has quite a few symbols that mean nothing unless you read the manual.

it works and I'm not disputing that, it does the jib as intended to do, and sky have succeeded on that part. but cmon guys lets have the decorators in for a revamp.

Wizross · 26-08-2009, 01:26

I still prefer the old EPG on the sky+ box compared to the new HD one. It's more responsive.

Wish Sky's EPG had the search functionality of the Vision box. That's far better.

swills · 26-08-2009, 01:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wizross

I still prefer the old EPG on the sky+ box compared to the new HD one. It's more responsive.

Wish Sky's EPG had the search functionality of the Vision box. That's far better.

Agreed. the new EPG is no too bright at all! and damn difficult to read for some people.

I was told the font is the same size, but I'm not so sure on that.

The old EPG was just fine, it did what it said on the tin, and that's all you want really

and whoever thought of orange on blue ! ?

also you can turn of the small picture =, but not the sound that goes with it

Wizross · 26-08-2009, 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by swills

also you can turn of the small picture =, but not the sound that goes with it

Yes, that can be very annoying if you're recording a sporting event or something you don't want to see the end of whilst dual recording. Have to mute the sound when you switch on the box and go the planner/guide.

I like in the Vision box (which Sky have copied on the HD EPG) was setting recordings from the guide doesn't take you into the planner everytime. Was annoying when setting several recordings.

What I'd like to see added to Vision box would be pre padding and option to set your own defaults for that, post padding and setting programmes to Delete when needed/Until I delete. Annoying having to do it for every programme. Also series links could be greatly improved.

noise747 · 26-08-2009, 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuntmaster

no it doesn't, because sky is live channels and BT is On demand. like chalk and cheese really.

In the way they work yes, but they are both services that allows you to get pay T.V and the OP asked about content and sky have got the content simple as that.

Quote:

Sky's interface is rather outdated. they improoved it on the new HD boxes only tho. good old SD, or + users are lumbered with a lovely 256 colour flat interface.

Bt has a nice vibrant colour scheme to it and the menus do look rather aesthetically pleasing. The library is good too, sky has quite a few symbols that mean nothing unless you read the manual.

it works and I'm not disputing that, it does the jib as intended to do, and sky have succeeded on that part. but cmon guys lets have the decorators in for a revamp.

What is it that everything got to look flashy? I want a product to do the job and if the GUI is usable then that is what matters. Look at the TUTV EPG it is plain and simple, but works, the same with my old Thomson box, nothing flash about it, but it does what it is suppose to do.

Microsoft is the same, and started from Xp to make the GUI look like something a child have done.

Maybe Sky symbols should be replaced, but apart from that it does the job and have done for years.

If it is not broke.

scotty2808 · 26-08-2009, 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by noise747

Canvas will fail, if it even gets started in the first place, with no QOS, more and more ISPs shaping or charging more for extra bandwidth it will not take off

with the proposed infrastructure - QoS becomes less of an issue. it also blows the current arguments over limiting video traffic out of the water.

i also think traffic shaping will not be relevant as it shapes specific data packets as required. i will speculate that packet tagging will ensure that Canvas VOD contents will not be subject to traffic shaping rules (unless of course the ISP does not correctly configure their infrastructure correctly to give it a free ride).

scotty2808 · 26-08-2009, 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wizross

What I'd like to see added to Vision box would be pre padding and option to set your own defaults for that, post padding and setting programmes to Delete when needed/Until I delete. Annoying having to do it for every programme. Also series links could be greatly improved.

pre padding - see the latest thread on firmware updates (first post has the details)

delete options - is that not the same with sky+ (i thought you had to mark every program as keep so a (K) symbol appeared on the right hand side of the screen) ?

cheers.

Wizross · 26-08-2009, 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty2808

pre padding - see the latest thread on firmware updates (first post has the details)

delete options - is that not the same with sky+ (i thought you had to mark every program as keep so a (K) symbol appeared on the right hand side of the screen) ?

cheers.

Will take a look at the pre padding bit.

Yes, Sky has to set Keep individually too but it's one button press from the planner which is a lot less than Vision where you have to actually go into it and amend it. Just about speed really.

stuntmaster · 26-08-2009, 10:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by noise747

In the way they work yes, but they are both services that allows you to get pay T.V and the OP asked about content and sky have got the content simple as that.

What is it that everything got to look flashy? I want a product to do the job and if the GUI is usable then that is what matters. Look at the TUTV EPG it is plain and simple, but works, the same with my old Thomson box, nothing flash about it, but it does what it is suppose to do.

Microsoft is the same, and started from Xp to make the GUI look like something a child have done.

Maybe Sky symbols should be replaced, but apart from that it does the job and have done for years.

If it is not broke.

it doesn't have to look flashy, but the current EPG has been around for years. its boring! its not that fast either. a friend has a thomson sky box and its slow to access the menus.

on the sky+ boxes, you wouldn't know there was a planner unless you hit the red button on the main menu. Tutv have a direct link to the planner via a remote button and the main menu.

yes the planner is confusing. when I had sky+ (on a very weak signal albeit) I hated having to tag everything i wanted to keep.

tutv and BT vision interfaces are nice. they work as intended.

25-08-2009, 12:09	#1
Runija100 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2	BT Vision vs Sky + Hi all I've been a BT customer for 3 years, and have a phone line, BB option 1, and BT vision. I've got speeds of over 7.0mbps in my area (with an upgrade due early next year to an estimated 9.0mbps) and have been extremely happy with their BB service, I've never had an outage or any problems at all with BT. I mainly use the Broadband, I don't download a lot, but I am a constant user. My kids are also starting to use the internet more on their laptops, and I envisage them downloading more of their programs on I-player etc.. as they get older. I'm happy with the Freeview channels that we get on BT Vision, I don't watch a huge amount of TV, but the kids are nagging me for more childrens channels, and I'm thinking ahead to the long dark winter months, that it may be a good idea to switch to Sky to get all the kids channels that they want. So, what I want to ask is: 1. Should I seriously look at Sky and what they can offer vs what I currently have with BT Vision. For my needs will BT work out cheaper? 2. BT want me to renew for another 12 months,can anyone give me any hints or tips on how to negotiate with BT to get a better deal, e.g. will they upgrade me to Option 3 for the same price as Option 1, get an extra BT vision box...anything really!! Thanks

25-08-2009, 12:48	#2
wwwebber Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Nottingham Posts: 3,536	This thread has got car crash written all over it but I'll play along until the usual spoilers turn up ... Do you subscribe to the BTVision childrens pack ? It's all down to personal choice really. If the F1 coverage on BBC went HD then I'd get Freesat like a shot and dump BTVision. As it stands I'm more than happy with BT & BTVision. I'd look at whats on offer and decide for yourself - it's all there on the various websites. In regards to getting a better deal I'd hold off and wait until the Vbox 2 details become available - you'll have leverage then when it comes to who gets them first. Lastly, BT wont give you two Vbox's as they dont support it. This may change with the Vbox 2 though.

25-08-2009, 13:59	#3
Wizross Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,033	I have both running in a lovely harmony. Sky+ is the far better system - although the BT Vision box does have a couple of things I'd like to see incorporated in the Sky system. I have the BT Vision box for the extra recording facility but mainly for the on demand stuff.

25-08-2009, 16:44	#4
paulpocket Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Glasgow Posts: 135	i recently renewed all my BT contracts. Can't be exact but... Got free evening & weekend calls (worth £2 something) 3 months half price BT Vision A £4something discount off my broadband. back into a 12month contract and most of the stuff they usually offer to you anyway just in case you are thinking on leaving. I think some other folk have got alot more off their bills so its worth a try calling them.

25-08-2009, 17:16	#5
chris4817 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Newton Abbot, Devon Posts: 282	I got a very good contract renewal discount without negotiating as it was the first thing they offered when I phoned up. BB option 1 at £9.64 instead of £15.64. I think option 3 was £20.64? I also got 12 months half price on the vision bronze pack at £7.34 a month. I was very pleased

25-08-2009, 20:37	#6
johnson293 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Newcastle upon Tyne Posts: 1,243	Quote: Originally Posted by Runija100 1. Should I seriously look at Sky and what they can offer vs what I currently have with BT Vision. For my needs will BT work out cheaper? For broadband, first question has to be - are you in a Sky LLU area - if you are, then you can get Sky Everyday Broadband (up to 10mb) for £5/month, if you also use the Sky Talk Service, otherwise it costs £10/month. For both of these you also need to subscribe to Sky TV, at a min. of £17 (approx) for one mix which could be the kids package if that what you want. Sky can also do your line rental with free evening and weekends call package for £10/month. If you aren't in a Sky LLU area they can only supply the Sky connect broadband, but that is £17/month. You now have to compare that with what you are currently paying BT, and decide which suits you best. Quote: Originally Posted by Runija100 2. BT want me to renew for another 12 months,can anyone give me any hints or tips on how to negotiate with BT to get a better deal, e.g. will they upgrade me to Option 3 for the same price as Option 1, get an extra BT vision box...anything really!! I only had one offer when i was with BT - that was £2/month reduction on my broadband (opt 3) when it came to renewal time. When i cancelled, I was offered £4 reduction for 3 months on my BB (opt 3), going back up to a £2 reduction for the remainder of the new 12 month contract. The deals they offered me weren't as much as I was saving by switching my TV, Phone and BB to sky - but that was my own situation, and personal preferneces, and I live in a Sky LLU area. Overall, you have to also decide whether you want linear content channels for the kids, or be happy for them to watch single episodes of programmes/channels, which can be paid for as you watch/per episode, or by subscribing to ther BT vision monthly sub. Hope this helps.

25-08-2009, 22:16	#7
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Both Sky and BT have their benefits. It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated. I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?). Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15.

25-08-2009, 22:19	#8
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Another thing Runija - If you are not happy with the kids stuff on BTV - I'd consider complaining. I've read a couple of people on here who want to see more kids content. Just a thought. The more people the better i suppose. The new free IPTV service (Canvas) has been proposed to launch in 2010 - there should be archives of free BBC / ITV / C4 / C5 kids content. Potentially with more broadcasters to join in the future. Just a thought.

25-08-2009, 22:52	#9
Matterhorn Inactive Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 729	I think johnson293 sums it up well with his post. If you are in a Sky LLU area then it really is a no brainer. Go Sky, it's better and cheaper. Alternatively if your exchange is a market 3 exchange (Ofcom classification) then plus.net do BT's equivalent of option 1 for 5.99 and option 3 for 15.99 which is a good saving. You can add phone and line rental and get free evening and weekend calls and 300 mins free international per month for 10.95 too. with regards to deals, my brother in law who has recently re-contracted to BT for another 12 months asked for option 3 at option 1 price and BT said no problem.

25-08-2009, 22:54	#10
Matterhorn Inactive Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 729	Quote: Originally Posted by scotty2808 Both Sky and BT have their benefits. It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated. I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?). Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15. seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's?

25-08-2009, 23:08	#11
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Quote: Originally Posted by Matterhorn seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's? all aboard the Sky Express... matterhorn is in the house! yeah. had sky digital shortly after launch then sky+ for years. it was revolutionary, it was fantastic and modern... back in 1998, but it's just the same old same old now. it is a case of if it ain't broke, don't fix it. it works well does its thing, but cosmetically, it's dated. these days, the gui just looks old and tired (primarily the on screen one when you are watching a show and pressing the up/down keys).

25-08-2009, 23:11	#12
Wizross Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,033	Quote: Originally Posted by Matterhorn seriously, you think the BT GUI is better than Sky's? It has some nice bits that would be good if added to the Sky one but as I said before, in my opinion, the Sky one is superior - and I have both so can make an informed judgement.

25-08-2009, 23:21	#13
ashjf Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: South East Posts: 909	Well, how much do your kids watch? You have: BTV - Kids Pack / On Demand Freeview - CBBC, cBeebies, Citv. Also, Milkshake on Five plus a romour of its own channel, Kids on BBC iPlayer (once launched on BTV and/or Freeview) Is that not enough?

25-08-2009, 23:48	#14
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Quote: Originally Posted by Matterhorn I think johnson293 sums it up well with his post. If you are in a Sky LLU area then it really is a no brainer. Go Sky, it's better and cheaper. agreed - can be a lot cheaper if are not a habitual broadband user and have the most basic tv pack. difficult to make a comparison though as when you strip down what each service gives you at the cheapest costs. BT is roughly £41.50 with line rental, free calls, broadband up to 20meg with a 10gig allowance, bronze TV pack with a sports channel (ESPN). Sky is roughly £27.50 with line rental, free calls, broadband is capped at 2meg with a 2gig allowance, has sky1 and kids pack but no premium sports channel. If you can cut down on your internet then yes it can be really cheap. If you scale up the internet to do a better comparison match BT's Option1) then at £32.50 and becomes v.good value. Doesn't work for me though as I want a sports channel and getting ESPN for free works great. It would cost me more to go with Sky.

25-08-2009, 23:55	#15
noise747 Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 22,810	Quote: Originally Posted by scotty2808 Both Sky and BT have their benefits. It's down to choice. Read someone's comments on the Sky+ set top box. I actually think it is getting a bit dated. Not really having used a Sky+ box to any great amount, I would really love to know what is dated about it? I know it is getting on a bit and the EPG have been changed a few times, but at the end of the day all you do is pick what stuff you want to record and it should record it. Is that not what a PVR is about? I never understand this idea that more features make something better. I have a old Thomson Freeview PVr and I think it is great, it been reliable and never missed a recording, the only bad thing was no series link, which is why I got the Top up T.v box. But you can't compare the BT vision box to a Sky+ box surely as they are two different things. Quote: I don't really think it's better than Vision. Where it is better is that you can get Sky Sports/Sky Movies. I don't know what the GUIs are like on Sky HD they may be improved (?). That is not the box, that is the content which the service provider shows. Quote: Your main question was about getting Sky for the kids. There are lots of kids channels. It really comes down to whether or not you think you will get value out of the basic Sky Mix which is about £15. It depends if he will get value out of any of the sky mixes as I doubt very much if he would have one mix unless it is the variety mix. Lots of children channels on sky if you are prepared to pay for them, you get about 15 channels in the children pack, Mind you it depends on ages, but I think that is enough. I don't think BT vision have the variety as sky. Myself If I had kids I would just record a load of stuff from Freeview and let them watch that, cheap and simple.

25-08-2009, 23:58	#16
noise747 Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 22,810	Quote: Originally Posted by scotty2808 The new free IPTV service (Canvas) has been proposed to launch in 2010 - there should be archives of free BBC / ITV / C4 / C5 kids content. Potentially with more broadcasters to join in the future. Just a thought. Canvas will fail, if it even gets started in the first place, with no QOS, more and more ISPs shaping or charging more for extra bandwidth it will not take off

26-08-2009, 00:46	#17
stuntmaster Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southampton - Hannington - TX Posts: 4,878	Quote: Originally Posted by noise747 Not really having used a Sky+ box to any great amount, I would really love to know what is dated about it? I know it is getting on a bit and the EPG have been changed a few times, but at the end of the day all you do is pick what stuff you want to record and it should record it. Is that not what a PVR is about? I never understand this idea that more features make something better. I have a old Thomson Freeview PVr and I think it is great, it been reliable and never missed a recording, the only bad thing was no series link, which is why I got the Top up T.v box. But you can't compare the BT vision box to a Sky+ box surely as they are two different things. That is not the box, that is the content which the service provider shows. It depends if he will get value out of any of the sky mixes as I doubt very much if he would have one mix unless it is the variety mix. Lots of children channels on sky if you are prepared to pay for them, you get about 15 channels in the children pack, Mind you it depends on ages, but I think that is enough. I don't think BT vision have the variety as sky. Myself If I had kids I would just record a load of stuff from Freeview and let them watch that, cheap and simple. no it doesn't, because sky is live channels and BT is On demand. like chalk and cheese really. Sky's interface is rather outdated. they improoved it on the new HD boxes only tho. good old SD, or + users are lumbered with a lovely 256 colour flat interface. Bt has a nice vibrant colour scheme to it and the menus do look rather aesthetically pleasing. The library is good too, sky has quite a few symbols that mean nothing unless you read the manual. it works and I'm not disputing that, it does the jib as intended to do, and sky have succeeded on that part. but cmon guys lets have the decorators in for a revamp.

26-08-2009, 01:26	#18
Wizross Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,033	I still prefer the old EPG on the sky+ box compared to the new HD one. It's more responsive. Wish Sky's EPG had the search functionality of the Vision box. That's far better.

26-08-2009, 01:56	#19
swills Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Essex Posts: 3,906	Quote: Originally Posted by Wizross I still prefer the old EPG on the sky+ box compared to the new HD one. It's more responsive. Wish Sky's EPG had the search functionality of the Vision box. That's far better. Agreed. the new EPG is no too bright at all! and damn difficult to read for some people. I was told the font is the same size, but I'm not so sure on that. The old EPG was just fine, it did what it said on the tin, and that's all you want really and whoever thought of orange on blue ! ? also you can turn of the small picture =, but not the sound that goes with it

26-08-2009, 02:12	#20
Wizross Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,033	Quote: Originally Posted by swills also you can turn of the small picture =, but not the sound that goes with it Yes, that can be very annoying if you're recording a sporting event or something you don't want to see the end of whilst dual recording. Have to mute the sound when you switch on the box and go the planner/guide. I like in the Vision box (which Sky have copied on the HD EPG) was setting recordings from the guide doesn't take you into the planner everytime. Was annoying when setting several recordings. What I'd like to see added to Vision box would be pre padding and option to set your own defaults for that, post padding and setting programmes to Delete when needed/Until I delete. Annoying having to do it for every programme. Also series links could be greatly improved.

26-08-2009, 08:52	#21
noise747 Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Herefordshire Posts: 22,810	Quote: Originally Posted by stuntmaster no it doesn't, because sky is live channels and BT is On demand. like chalk and cheese really. In the way they work yes, but they are both services that allows you to get pay T.V and the OP asked about content and sky have got the content simple as that. Quote: Sky's interface is rather outdated. they improoved it on the new HD boxes only tho. good old SD, or + users are lumbered with a lovely 256 colour flat interface. Bt has a nice vibrant colour scheme to it and the menus do look rather aesthetically pleasing. The library is good too, sky has quite a few symbols that mean nothing unless you read the manual. it works and I'm not disputing that, it does the jib as intended to do, and sky have succeeded on that part. but cmon guys lets have the decorators in for a revamp. What is it that everything got to look flashy? I want a product to do the job and if the GUI is usable then that is what matters. Look at the TUTV EPG it is plain and simple, but works, the same with my old Thomson box, nothing flash about it, but it does what it is suppose to do. Microsoft is the same, and started from Xp to make the GUI look like something a child have done. Maybe Sky symbols should be replaced, but apart from that it does the job and have done for years. If it is not broke.

DS Forums

BT Vision vs Sky +

26-08-2009, 09:02	#22
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Quote: Originally Posted by noise747 Canvas will fail, if it even gets started in the first place, with no QOS, more and more ISPs shaping or charging more for extra bandwidth it will not take off with the proposed infrastructure - QoS becomes less of an issue. it also blows the current arguments over limiting video traffic out of the water. i also think traffic shaping will not be relevant as it shapes specific data packets as required. i will speculate that packet tagging will ensure that Canvas VOD contents will not be subject to traffic shaping rules (unless of course the ISP does not correctly configure their infrastructure correctly to give it a free ride).

26-08-2009, 09:05	#23
scotty2808 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 435	Quote: Originally Posted by Wizross What I'd like to see added to Vision box would be pre padding and option to set your own defaults for that, post padding and setting programmes to Delete when needed/Until I delete. Annoying having to do it for every programme. Also series links could be greatly improved. pre padding - see the latest thread on firmware updates (first post has the details) delete options - is that not the same with sky+ (i thought you had to mark every program as keep so a (K) symbol appeared on the right hand side of the screen) ? cheers.

26-08-2009, 10:12	#24
Wizross Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,033	Quote: Originally Posted by scotty2808 pre padding - see the latest thread on firmware updates (first post has the details) delete options - is that not the same with sky+ (i thought you had to mark every program as keep so a (K) symbol appeared on the right hand side of the screen) ? cheers. Will take a look at the pre padding bit. Yes, Sky has to set Keep individually too but it's one button press from the planner which is a lot less than Vision where you have to actually go into it and amend it. Just about speed really.

26-08-2009, 10:50	#25
stuntmaster Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southampton - Hannington - TX Posts: 4,878	Quote: Originally Posted by noise747 In the way they work yes, but they are both services that allows you to get pay T.V and the OP asked about content and sky have got the content simple as that. What is it that everything got to look flashy? I want a product to do the job and if the GUI is usable then that is what matters. Look at the TUTV EPG it is plain and simple, but works, the same with my old Thomson box, nothing flash about it, but it does what it is suppose to do. Microsoft is the same, and started from Xp to make the GUI look like something a child have done. Maybe Sky symbols should be replaced, but apart from that it does the job and have done for years. If it is not broke. it doesn't have to look flashy, but the current EPG has been around for years. its boring! its not that fast either. a friend has a thomson sky box and its slow to access the menus. on the sky+ boxes, you wouldn't know there was a planner unless you hit the red button on the main menu. Tutv have a direct link to the planner via a remote button and the main menu. yes the planner is confusing. when I had sky+ (on a very weak signal albeit) I hated having to tag everything i wanted to keep. tutv and BT vision interfaces are nice. they work as intended.