Auto padding bug , or just a glitch ??

all4free · 14-09-2009, 21:30

Tonight the vision boxx was recording Eastenders 2000 / Coronation st & Mastchef to start at 2030 , the wife started watching eastenders around 2020 from the recorded menu, then at 2025 the box came up saying unable to view as recording two programmes ( or something like that) i went into the recorded menu and it was showing that it was recording the 3 items at the same time which we know is impossible, anyway she had to wait until after 2030 before she could carry on watching it.
Then after she had watched it we tried to watch masterchef, chosse it from the menu and just a black screen , tried to FF but it just came up as if the programme was finished i.e play again , deleate etc....
Is this a known bug , or just a bit of a glitch ???
Thanks

BTW i have posted this on BT Beta forums .. if i get a reply on there i will update in here

all4free · 15-09-2009, 21:13

happened to somone else over on BT forums and to me again tonight !!!

This has happened again tonight.

BBC 2 2000 - 2100 Masterchef

ITV1 2100-2200 The Fixer

CH4 2100- 2200 Jamies USA road trip

was watching Masterchef , started watching around 2030 , then at 2058 black screen and message saying that because i am recording 2 items i cannot watch..... had to wait until 2100 to carry on watching from a recording ???? surley this is a BUG.

and the same thisng as last night 1 of the recording that started at 2100 ( jamie on ch4) is just a black screen...

Is there any solution to the above??? can i backdate my firmware as i prefered it the way its was with the conflicts as I could control it and never got black screen recordings .

has anybody else had problems like this since the update ??

all4free · 17-09-2009, 09:51

I take it this is just effecting me and the other person over on Bt forums.... would anyone advise a reset of the box ? if so which ... soft or hard

BT Support · 17-09-2009, 14:27

Hey all4free,

Sorry to hear about the problems with your Vision service. I have sent you a PM with a little bit more information.

Conan
BT Support

BT Support · 17-09-2009, 16:12

Hey all4free,

I am posting the information here for other users who may be having the same problem. With BT Vision you cannot record two programs and watch another. You can either watch one program and record another or you can record two programs but you will be unable to watch anything else. The recordings will always start a minute or so before the schedule says it starts, eg starts recording at 20.58 for a programme that starts at 21.00

Hope this helps.

Conan
BT Support

all4free · 17-09-2009, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by BT Support

Hey all4free,

I am posting the information here for other users who may be having the same problem. With BT Vision you cannot record two programs and watch another. You can either watch one program and record another or you can record two programs but you will be unable to watch anything else. The recordings will always start a minute or so before the schedule says it starts, eg starts recording at 20.58 for a programme that starts at 21.00

Hope this helps.

Conan
BT Support

You say that i cannot watch anything while recording two programmes , if you read my post I was watching something that was being recorded, the programme had started 20 mins earlier , this is something we have done since getting vision 3 years ago , so now with the new update this is not avaliable ?? if so then that is a backward step.

Do you have any reason as to why when the prepadding kicks in that I.E

bbc1 20-00 - 2100
bbc2 20-00 - 2100
CH4 21-00 - 22-00

That the programme starting at 2100 does not record , you just get a blank screen , if you read my full postings in the thread you will see this has happened to me twice and only since the update , when you look at recordings around this time the vision box shows that it is recording 3 items... so the auto cut off of the prepadding does not seem to work , that is why the later recording is blank as there is no tuner for it.

barnpiece · 17-09-2009, 18:55

I believe there is a difference between watching something that is being recorded and watching the recording.

I am still on 601 and know that if I am due to record two things as specified, then I need to be watching the actual recording rather than the live version of the same channel - even if I am some time behind the 'live' time.

Richard

BT Support · 18-09-2009, 15:23

Hi All4free - and others

On the latest software the 'padding' (extra time before / after a recording) is 'soft' so the VBox can manage to start / stop recordings at the same time. It's actually possible to have up to 4 programmes start / stop recording at the same time as the VBox takes the padding off each programme as needed.

The following scenarios are possible and I'm testing them again at the moment to confirm that they work on our vision box:

2 recordings on one channel, while watching live TV (confirmed)
AAAAAABBBBBB

2 recordings on different channels, while watching live TV (confirmed)
AAAAAA
.............BBBBBB

4 recordings on 2 channels, while watching a recording/VOD (confirmed)
AAAAAABBBBBB
CCCCCCDDDDDD

4 recordings on 4 different channels, while watching a recording/VOD (confirmed)
AAAAAA
.............BBBBBB
CCCCCC
.............DDDDDD

Based on All4free's description of the issue he either had a simple recording failure or may have a tuner problem in the VBox. The next thing to try is to watch live TV while recording a different channel and check that the recording works correctly. If TV and recording at the same time works normally then the tuners are OK and he's had a single failed recording. Whilst this is regrettable it is not a huge concern unless it continues to happen.

If recording and viewing fails then the you should factory reset the box, but be advised that this will wipe all the recordings you currently have stored. If you are still unable to record and view at the same time then respond here and I'll raise a fault for you to call in an book for an engineer visit. Please note that if the engineer determines that the problem was due to mis-operation or damage to the equipment the visit will be charged.

Robbie

all4free · 21-09-2009, 15:21

over the weekend i had to unplug hub & vision box for around 1/2 hour , since the reboot of both it all now seems ok , evrything is recording NO BLANK SCREENS... ..fingers crossed... but looking over at beta forums , there are others suffering the same problem as i had...

wcyjmltrou · 23-09-2009, 12:48

Just got the 835 upgrade and have been doing some experiments in the spirit of scientific inquiry.

I have a bunch of series recordings which were set up on the old 601 software. Looking at these it seems they are all still set to add 5 mins to the end of the recording which was the old default. Am I right in thinking that this has now become a hard padding and to get the super new soft padding you need to change these previously set up recordings to finish at the scheduled time?

My experiments all point to this being the case but I haven't seen anything here or over on the BT forums to indicate that you would need to alter all previously set up recordings to take advantage of the new auto padding feature. Could this be what is causing some people problems?

All new recordings on 835 default to finish at the scheduled time and seem to add the automatic padding as expected so it looks like only previously set up recordings are affected.

wwwebber · 23-09-2009, 14:03

A little background first : - The new system software adds pre & post padding automatically and removes them where necessary to enable the continuation of your recordings without interruption. This is at the cost of padding at some point but there's no other way around it with just two tuners to be honest.

Anyway, I think I understand All4free's issue here. It seems that what All4free is trying to do is perfectly reasonable. If you are "chasing" a recording then you are not actually using up a tuner - just veiwing a recording. So your viewing should not be interrupted.

It could be that the system wanted to drop the post padding from Eastenders to allow the two new recordings to start at 830pm but couldnt because it was "locked" due to it being viewed by the user. Maybe the pre - padding from one of the new recordings should have been dropped instead and thus allowing Eastenders to be continue to be recorded & viewed without user consultation / intervention. Maybe its just not that flexible ?. Just a theory but something is not right here and BT needs to look at it in more detail.

I would suggest that the scanarios that BT have already mentioned here are not specific enough. Maybe they need to add one that says :-

3 recordings on 3 different channels, watching / chasing recording AAAAAA whilst the recording for channels BBBBBB & CCCCCC tries to initiate

AAAAAA
.............BBBBBB
.............CCCCCC

I think this would replicate your issue All4free. Lets hope BT tries this one out.

14-09-2009, 21:30	#1
all4free Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22	Auto padding bug , or just a glitch ?? Tonight the vision boxx was recording Eastenders 2000 / Coronation st & Mastchef to start at 2030 , the wife started watching eastenders around 2020 from the recorded menu, then at 2025 the box came up saying unable to view as recording two programmes ( or something like that) i went into the recorded menu and it was showing that it was recording the 3 items at the same time which we know is impossible, anyway she had to wait until after 2030 before she could carry on watching it. Then after she had watched it we tried to watch masterchef, chosse it from the menu and just a black screen , tried to FF but it just came up as if the programme was finished i.e play again , deleate etc.... Is this a known bug , or just a bit of a glitch ??? Thanks BTW i have posted this on BT Beta forums .. if i get a reply on there i will update in here

15-09-2009, 21:13	#2
all4free Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22	happened to somone else over on BT forums and to me again tonight !!! This has happened again tonight. BBC 2 2000 - 2100 Masterchef ITV1 2100-2200 The Fixer CH4 2100- 2200 Jamies USA road trip was watching Masterchef , started watching around 2030 , then at 2058 black screen and message saying that because i am recording 2 items i cannot watch..... had to wait until 2100 to carry on watching from a recording ???? surley this is a BUG. and the same thisng as last night 1 of the recording that started at 2100 ( jamie on ch4) is just a black screen... Is there any solution to the above??? can i backdate my firmware as i prefered it the way its was with the conflicts as I could control it and never got black screen recordings . has anybody else had problems like this since the update ??

17-09-2009, 09:51	#3
all4free Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22	I take it this is just effecting me and the other person over on Bt forums.... would anyone advise a reset of the box ? if so which ... soft or hard

17-09-2009, 14:27	#4
BT Support BT Support Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 459	Hey all4free, Sorry to hear about the problems with your Vision service. I have sent you a PM with a little bit more information. Conan BT Support

17-09-2009, 16:12	#5
BT Support BT Support Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 459	Hey all4free, I am posting the information here for other users who may be having the same problem. With BT Vision you cannot record two programs and watch another. You can either watch one program and record another or you can record two programs but you will be unable to watch anything else. The recordings will always start a minute or so before the schedule says it starts, eg starts recording at 20.58 for a programme that starts at 21.00 Hope this helps. Conan BT Support

17-09-2009, 18:29	#6
all4free Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22	Quote: Originally Posted by BT Support Hey all4free, I am posting the information here for other users who may be having the same problem. With BT Vision you cannot record two programs and watch another. You can either watch one program and record another or you can record two programs but you will be unable to watch anything else. The recordings will always start a minute or so before the schedule says it starts, eg starts recording at 20.58 for a programme that starts at 21.00 Hope this helps. Conan BT Support You say that i cannot watch anything while recording two programmes , if you read my post I was watching something that was being recorded, the programme had started 20 mins earlier , this is something we have done since getting vision 3 years ago , so now with the new update this is not avaliable ?? if so then that is a backward step. Do you have any reason as to why when the prepadding kicks in that I.E bbc1 20-00 - 2100 bbc2 20-00 - 2100 CH4 21-00 - 22-00 That the programme starting at 2100 does not record , you just get a blank screen , if you read my full postings in the thread you will see this has happened to me twice and only since the update , when you look at recordings around this time the vision box shows that it is recording 3 items... so the auto cut off of the prepadding does not seem to work , that is why the later recording is blank as there is no tuner for it.

17-09-2009, 18:55	#7
barnpiece Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 35	I believe there is a difference between watching something that is being recorded and watching the recording. I am still on 601 and know that if I am due to record two things as specified, then I need to be watching the actual recording rather than the live version of the same channel - even if I am some time behind the 'live' time. Richard

18-09-2009, 15:23	#8
BT Support BT Support Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 459	Hi All4free - and others On the latest software the 'padding' (extra time before / after a recording) is 'soft' so the VBox can manage to start / stop recordings at the same time. It's actually possible to have up to 4 programmes start / stop recording at the same time as the VBox takes the padding off each programme as needed. The following scenarios are possible and I'm testing them again at the moment to confirm that they work on our vision box: 2 recordings on one channel, while watching live TV (confirmed) AAAAAABBBBBB 2 recordings on different channels, while watching live TV (confirmed) AAAAAA .............BBBBBB 4 recordings on 2 channels, while watching a recording/VOD (confirmed) AAAAAABBBBBB CCCCCCDDDDDD 4 recordings on 4 different channels, while watching a recording/VOD (confirmed) AAAAAA .............BBBBBB CCCCCC .............DDDDDD Based on All4free's description of the issue he either had a simple recording failure or may have a tuner problem in the VBox. The next thing to try is to watch live TV while recording a different channel and check that the recording works correctly. If TV and recording at the same time works normally then the tuners are OK and he's had a single failed recording. Whilst this is regrettable it is not a huge concern unless it continues to happen. If recording and viewing fails then the you should factory reset the box, but be advised that this will wipe all the recordings you currently have stored. If you are still unable to record and view at the same time then respond here and I'll raise a fault for you to call in an book for an engineer visit. Please note that if the engineer determines that the problem was due to mis-operation or damage to the equipment the visit will be charged. Robbie

21-09-2009, 15:21	#9
all4free Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22	over the weekend i had to unplug hub & vision box for around 1/2 hour , since the reboot of both it all now seems ok , evrything is recording NO BLANK SCREENS... ..fingers crossed... but looking over at beta forums , there are others suffering the same problem as i had...

23-09-2009, 12:48	#10
wcyjmltrou Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Stirling Posts: 16	Just got the 835 upgrade and have been doing some experiments in the spirit of scientific inquiry. I have a bunch of series recordings which were set up on the old 601 software. Looking at these it seems they are all still set to add 5 mins to the end of the recording which was the old default. Am I right in thinking that this has now become a hard padding and to get the super new soft padding you need to change these previously set up recordings to finish at the scheduled time? My experiments all point to this being the case but I haven't seen anything here or over on the BT forums to indicate that you would need to alter all previously set up recordings to take advantage of the new auto padding feature. Could this be what is causing some people problems? All new recordings on 835 default to finish at the scheduled time and seem to add the automatic padding as expected so it looks like only previously set up recordings are affected.

23-09-2009, 14:03	#11
wwwebber Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Nottingham Posts: 3,536	A little background first : - The new system software adds pre & post padding automatically and removes them where necessary to enable the continuation of your recordings without interruption. This is at the cost of padding at some point but there's no other way around it with just two tuners to be honest. Anyway, I think I understand All4free's issue here. It seems that what All4free is trying to do is perfectly reasonable. If you are "chasing" a recording then you are not actually using up a tuner - just veiwing a recording. So your viewing should not be interrupted. It could be that the system wanted to drop the post padding from Eastenders to allow the two new recordings to start at 830pm but couldnt because it was "locked" due to it being viewed by the user. Maybe the pre - padding from one of the new recordings should have been dropped instead and thus allowing Eastenders to be continue to be recorded & viewed without user consultation / intervention. Maybe its just not that flexible ?. Just a theory but something is not right here and BT needs to look at it in more detail. I would suggest that the scanarios that BT have already mentioned here are not specific enough. Maybe they need to add one that says :- 3 recordings on 3 different channels, watching / chasing recording AAAAAA whilst the recording for channels BBBBBB & CCCCCC tries to initiate AAAAAA .............BBBBBB .............CCCCCC I think this would replicate your issue All4free. Lets hope BT tries this one out.

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Auto padding bug , or just a glitch ??