Slightly OT, I think we might not be seeing Matt for a long time seeing his ex-partner committed suicide?

I agree entirely Jan.

That particular word (and a handful of others) are totally out of bounds as far as I'm concerned.

Context is irrelevant (and becomes used as an excuse far too often).

I know hes not helping at all by saying its a harmless word.

The reason its come 2B seen as an insulting term is cos it has been used as an insult so much. It was only ever humerous to people who haven't been on the receiving end of it when its used as a hate-word.

Anton's apologized, noone needs Bruce chucking petrol on fire.

Gawd I hope he doesn't mention it on Saturday - he'll make the whole thing flare up again. I was cringing when he kept saying Aleesha was doing well the other week cos it was just drawing attention 2 her more.

This is the point with some of these old 70's comedies though; you were supposed to laugh at the reaction of Margot/Basil Fawlty/Alf Garnet types because their reactions were so ridiculous. You were never really meant to agree with them, although there will always be a minority that will etc etc. But I will stick up for the old comedies because that was the point; in some cases like those brought up in Fawlty Towers and the Good Life they were actually challenging that behaviour by ridiculing it as apposed to supporting it.

BTW, how many of you collectively groaned when were saw that Brucie had waded in on this one? Surely it stands a better chance of blowing over if no-one on the team mentions it?
Last edited by lupie123 : 08-10-2009 at 13:25

I don't understand why Brucie can't air his opinion about this. There are plenty of people on this site airing their views!!! Right or wrong we all have an opinion.

I don't think so. 35 years ago the viewers' reaction was along the lines of 'gotcha!', if we'd known the word then. It really was, That'll teach you to complain about hippies, you're getting far worse now and it serves you right.
This is 'Life on Mars' time.

You bet he'll be making a "gag" about it on Saturday. Doh.

And it has never been a word that amused. As a teacher I have heard most taunts and **** is always an insult.

Sikhs say it to Hindus. Pakistanis say it to other Pakistanis. Pakistanis even say it to "whites". It is never meant as joshing or playful fun.

He can air his views if he wants but it will just drag the whole thing out more. If he makes these comments about it being a harmless word that used 2B humerous on Saturday's show I guarantee there will B more complaints cos too many people don't agree with him.

Bruce is right and everyone of a certain age knows he is. Even a much loved sitcom like Only Fools & Horses has used the term in the early episodes.

Is it known who leaked Anton saying it by the way as it wasn't said in public as far as I know?

Anton and Laila are meant to be on ITT Friday to clear everything up. Until we here from the two of them together, not just apparent quotes, then we do not know the whole story or context, regardless of whether we think it exonorates Antons use of the word or not.

This whole episode has made me eternaly grateful that I am not famous as some of the things I come out with on a daily basis would have me publically stoned. No malice is ever meant by it but when you speak without judging every single thing you say, the harm you can cause to yourself and others is enormous.

My personal opinion is yes, I wish our Brucie hadn't got involved, but when someone you know is being slated and you know what a lovely person they are you do want to stick up for them.

As I said, both Anton and Laila are hopefully on ITT tomorrow and I feel that everyone will be told to zip it Saturday rather than keeping on fanning the flames.

I don't know who spoke to the press but some reports suggested it happened in front of around 15 people, that would indicate the Strictly celebs and dancers waiting for their turn in the tanning booth wouldn't it? Plus crew etc. Lots of people and a bad thing for this series to be remembered for.

But it is true that even people of my generation (45) used the word to describe the "corner shop". I certainly never used it or meant to use it in an offensive way, but the difference is that as a halfway decent adult I can see that even using the word Pak* just shoves an entire group of similarly coloured people all under the same banner. It's like someone saying "all black people look the same". He really should have thought before he opened his mouth, but I do believe that his quick apology and her acceptance of it should be an end to it. Hopefully it just reminds people how easy it is to offend...whether meant or not.

Just when interest in the story seemed to be dying down, and nothing new was coming out, leaving the media with nothing to say but recycle old points and report the latest number of complaints, ...

Quite an error of judgment on Bruce's part, imo.

I don't see how an ITT appearance can clear everything up, or tell us the whole story and context.

What are they going to do? Show a VT of the incident?

It will just give the media more to report, keeping the story going, ... which used to matter, before Bruce did it another way.

It's funny, I was thinking something similar earlier today. Given the need for the press and the public to rip to shreds anyone who gets in the public eye - and I mean clothes, body shape, personality, speech, the lot - who the hell would want to put themselves out there? You're basically asking to be beaten to a pulp.

And yet still we get the hordes of deluded wannabees queuing up for X Factor and BB audtions and so on. The whole thing's quite depressing.

It makes no difference what age you are or what was classed as funny 30 years ago, times change and things move on and we have to move on with them, I have.

I had a long discussion with my mother (86) about the 'N' word as she felt she should be able to still call the colour of a piece of clothing 'N' Brown as that was what they had called it when she was young. Sorry Mum not right you cant and thats the end of it.

There are many many words that used to be in common use years ago not only to do with race but some to do with disabled people which are no longer acceptable even as a joke.

What an idiot (Bruce). He should have kept his mouth shut.

Anton is an idiot too (not that I've ever been a fan), but hopefully he is aware of that now and that should be the end of it.

Unfortunately, this will go and on and on and is one of the reasons why I'm not taking much of an interest in SCD this year; the media/tabloid obsession with the thing is suffocating it.

There have been attempts by younger Pakistanis to reclaim "P*ki" as an informal contraction/noun for Pakistanis recently (like p*ki.com), but it will take a long time to succeed because memories of the word being used as a racial epiphet for most asians are still very fresh (contrary to what Bruce thinks).

Common sense should be applied before using words which can either be banter or highly offensive depending on the context; if the chance of causing offence is higher than zero percent, then don't use them. Unfortunately, common sense is something which Anton the Berk seems to lack.

Bruce is right, lots of words that are now considered racist were accepted as normal and nobody thought anything about it, but now if these words are said all hell is let loose.We often used the word ****** in relation to a shade of brown material, shoes, paint and to us it was just a shade of brown, nothing else, nothing racist, it never entered our heads.

Also Bruce has every right to say what he thinks, we do still live in a free country don't we?and still have free speech.

I like Anton a lot he makes me smile, as for his calling Laiha a '****' it was obvious it was said in jest and whoever it was who listened to a private conversation with their flapping ears and then repeated it when it had nothing to do with them at all after all it wasn't said to them should be ashamed of themselves, I wonder if we will ever know who it was.

These are my opinions and I know I will most likely have upset some of you with them, but it is what I think about all this sorry mess.

I hope they dance well on Saturday and get through to the next round and hopefully further still.

Spelt Laila's name wrong, sorry.

So, we used to have a slave trade, womans earnings were taxed as if they were their husbands, woman couldn't vote


....doesn't make it right to do it now though, does it?

I hate the overly PC brigade but he really is showing his age if he thinks because things were like that, they are still acceptable. It's why he needs to move on - just being able to turn up for work doesn't make you capable.

The parts in bold seem contradictory.

If Bruce is entitled to free speech, so is the person who blabbed, surely?

Well I don't know what all the fuss is about to be honest, how many of us have heard or told Irish jokes and not thought that it is racist, is calling a person from Scotland a Scot racist, is calling anyone from the Uk in Oz a pommie racist, I'm fed up with it, it's enough to make anyone a racist the way they go on about it

He didn't actually say that though. If anything, his comments highlight the fact that he knows that how it used to be, and that it isn't any more.

I accept that Anton might not have meant to use the word in a racist manner, but it's not comparable to the other words you've cited.

The terms "Aussie" and "Poms," have no racial overtones, the latter, over the years, like "Kiwi," have become terms of friendly jibing, or endearment, on a grander scale, between various nations which have shared a wealth of history between us.

The term "Brit," can be applied to any resident of the UK, regardless of their colour, it's a shortened description of an inhabitant of the UK, who believes themselves to be British.

The other word, is anything but. In using the abbreviated term it becomes a far more loaded comment.

There's a difference between abbreviation and a word that has been used as a racial slur for decades.

Not my interpretation.

Forsyth said it would have been treated lightheartedly in the past and then says........

the nation should get a "sense of humour" about the Strictly Come Dancing race row.

That brings it into the present in my view.