NBC needs new leadership and someone with a vision who can pull them out of this mess, they managed it before in 1985 when The Cosby Show started to beat Dynasty and no doubt it can happen again but it needs to happen soon.

The networks that fall from grace and then rise again is like a cycle, CBS struggled in the 90s and then slowly became Number 1 again thanks to Survivor and CSI and later on NCIS, ABC struggled in the early 2000s although they had a hit with Millionaire which they managed to kill off due to overexposure then they had hits with Lost, Desperate Housewives, Grey's Anatomy and DWTS and FOX struggled too before striking gold with American Idol followed by House and Bones.

CBS is proof that if you give people decent shows, they will watch. They don't have a megahit like Idol or Dancing with the Stars but the majority of their shows average 10m or so although they aren't immune to struggle as their Sunday lineup languishes in fourth every week.

Provisional schedules out:

Saturday 14th November
BBC1
14:00 - Rugby Union
16:30 - TBA
17:10 - BBC News
17:30 - Hole in the Wall
18:00 - Merlin
18:45 - Strictly Come Dancing
20:25 - Lottery Draws
20:35 - Casualty
21:25 - The Impressions Show
21:55 - BBC News
22:15 - TBA
23:00 - The Football League Show

ITV1
16:15 - TBA (England v Brazil)
19:00 - New You've Been Framed
19:30 - Harry Hill's TV Burp
20:00 - The X Factor
21:30 - Piers Morgan's Life Stories
22:30 - ITV News

Sunday 15th November
BBC1
19:00 - Countryfile
20:00 - Antiques Roadshow
21:00 - Garrow's Law

ITV1
18:45 Harry Hill's TV Burp
19:15 Family Fortunes
20:00 X Factor
21:00 TBA (I'm a Celebrity)

I think BBC1's schedule for the Saturday will end up like this, which may be seen as far from ideal, and puts Merlin in a horrible slot:

14:00 - Rugby Union
16:40 - BBC News
17:00 - Hole in the Wall
17:30 - Merlin
18:15 - Doctor Who: Waters of Mars
19:15 - Strictly Come Dancing
20:55 - Lottery Draws
21:05 - Casualty
21:55 - The Impressions Show
22:25 - BBC News
22:45 - The Football League Show

Actually I think it's Jay Hunt who needs to take note....although looking at the ratings for SCD, it could be too late

Won't the 16.30 TBA be Final Score on BBC1 Saturday? There's the international matches and Football League matches to go through there. Then everything else will fit into slot.

Even the BSI wouldn't put Merlin and Dr Who out at 5.30/6.15, surely?

And The Football League Show seems highly unlikely to air as early as 10.45pm.

If they don't want to have a Super Saturday on 19th December (and get blockbuster ratings), then it has to be Sunday 15th November at 7pm. There's no suitable slot on the Saturday.


The ratings that are on average the same as last year's series?

Can't see them having a Final Score for League 1 and League 2 games to be honest. The International matches will be kicking off at different times as well - England for instance kicks off @ 5pm on ITV1.

The last time there was no premier league or championship football on a Saturday (10th October), Final Score was replaced with Bruce Goes Dancing (repeat).

Bit of a contradiction there isn't it. And lame accusation at Mr Cowell, one of the few producers around at the minute seeing his shows grow, and significantly too, year on year.



Doubt you'd be saying the same if it was ITV handing over two-hours of primetime to such an event.

Just pointing out that Millionaire was the biggest thing on TV, growing its ratings substantially, getting 14-19m several nights a week for several weeks of the year, demolishing all in its wake, causing a scheduling crisis for the Beeb, and being sold all round the world to great acclaim. But ITV's desire to milk its golden goose resulted in people getting fed up of it, it becoming over-exposed, and padded out so much it became less a quiz show and more a chat show.

Now it gets thrashed week in, week out by Holby City in a Tuesday night ratings backwater.

I think it's perfectly pertinent to compare BGT-TXF, a show that is out of control with regards to its hype and over-exposure, with the Millionaire scenario.

Fair enough. They could always place a Total Wipeout repeat in the slot to tie them over. I can't see them trying out Merlin at 5.30. Doctor Who at 6.15...maybe. They could always ditch The Impressions Show for a week though...

14:00 - Rugby Union
16:40 - BBC News
17:00 - Total Wipeout
17:45 - Hole in the Wall
18:15 - Merlin
19:00 - Strictly Come Dancing
20:40 - Doctor Who: Waters of Mars
21:40 - Lottery Draws
21:50 - Casualty
22:40 - BBC News
23:00 - The Football League Show

They'll never do it because they'd argue that Doctor Who and Casualty are on too late. Also, Doctor Who might be hurt by starting after The X Factor.

EDIT: With this one they could swap Strictly and Doctor Who around so it:

18:15 - Merlin
19:00 - Doctor Who
20:00 - Strictly Come Dancing

What'd people say about the clash then. Could really hurt Strictly, though.

A more likely possibility is just ditching Merlin (again):

14:00 - Rugby Union
16:40 - BBC News
17:00 - Total Wipeout
17:45 - Hole in the Wall
18:15 - Doctor Who
19:15 - Strictly Come Dancing
20:55 - Lottery Draws
21:05 - Casualty
21:55 - The Impressions Show
22:25 - BBC News
22:45 - The Football League Show

Another alternative...I think 5.30pm would be too early, even for a family drama. Might just get away with six o'clock...depends how brave BBC1 are in regards to Strictly:

14:00 - Rugby Union
16:40 - Question of Sport (R)
17:10 - BBC News
17:30 - Hole in the Wall
18:00 - Merlin
18:45 - Doctor Who
19:45 - Strictly Come Dancing
21:25 - Lottery Draws
21:35 - Casaulty
22:25 - The Impressions Show
22:55 - BBC News
23:15 - The Football League Show

A bit late for Casualty/The Impressions Show? And a major clash between Strictly/The X Factor.

Of course they could just move Doctor Who to a Sunday:

18:00 - Countryfile
19:00 - Doctor Who
20:00 - Antiques Roadshow
21:00 - Garrow's Law

Saying that it doesn't exactly fit it in with the feel of the night. Merlin might fit in a bit better with Doctor Who taking the Saturday slot...

18:15 - Merlin
19:00 - Countrywise
20:00 - Antiques Roadshow
21:00 - Garrow's Law

The BBC certainly haven't made it easy on themselves!

BGT is only on for a couple of months each year. Apart from the one week where it's stripped there is absolutely no comparison to be made.

You may have a fair point if we were to throw in The X Factor as well but even then as a weekly show it's no more overexposed than a lot of shows out there.

And I don't think it takes a prophet to predict that Britain's Got Talent won't last forever. But then not many hits of their time did.

True, but both TXF and BGT have enjoyed growth this year. Why hasn't Strictly?

It has been 9 years since these shows started (with Popstars). We've had 6 series of The X Factor and the show is still growing its audience. Every year people predict the end, over-exposure and burn out. Even ITV thought the talent show genre was waning in 2004!

What exactly is your point with the Millionaire comparisons? Every time one of these series is on you wheel out the comparison yet every series the numbers go up. Now, eventually, you will be right. Formats come and go. The X Factor will almost certainly not be on TV in 10 years. But that's not likely to be do to with any of the issues you point out. Because as sure as X Factor won't be on TV in 10 years, neither will Strictly.

The show started a week later this year and aired the same number of hours before the live shows this year as it did last year (and the year before that). There's now an extra 15 minutes on the results shows. It's hardly a huge increase and when you're "padding" with Robbie Williams and Whitney Houston, it's not too big a problem.

Showing a 45 minute result show on Sundays isn't going to prolong the format in the long run. It's just going to lose money in the short run.

I wouldn't say over-exposure is Millionaire's only problem (although it's certainly a big part of its downfall). Another big contributing factor to its decline is actually something which has had the opposite effect on X-Factor.

When a contestant on Millionaire achieved the show's highest prize (Judith Keppel winning the million), it robbed the show of its momentum and much of the excitement. It suddenly stopped being a big deal because we'd already seen the biggest moment the show could offer. The anticipation was gone and can't be regained. That makes it just a regular quiz show now so there's no reason for it to feel like an event.

When an X-Factor contestant hit the show's jackpot (Leona Lewis being successful internationally), it had the reverse effect by making the show more exciting. Now that we know X-Factor can actually deliver on its promise of stardom, the stakes are higher and the show is stronger as a result.

Brilliant analysis.

I completely agree about Judith's win - once that had happened the show's biggest hook was gone.

True although the funny thing is, WWTBAM wasn't the first show to have someone win £1m, Chris Evans did it twice firstly on his Virgin Radio Breakfast and on TFI Fridays.

NBC haven't had anybody with vision since Brandon Tartikoff or Warren Littlefield.

I wonder if part of it is to do with the contenders. Are they lacking in name value and Strictly might need a refresh with a newer set, larger studio, different light scheme.

Avalanche is bang on the money. It's the same with Deal or No Deal; in it's heyday it was getting 3-4m viewers for each episode. Now a few years on and 2 x £250k winners later, it's rare that it has even 2m. The drop in viewership has been stark, particularly over the past year.

The new guy that they've got running things, Jeff Gaspin, was heavily involved in their cable networks which are very successful. And Angela Bromstad only arrived at the start of this year so her impact won't be felt yet. But they've got a huge task on their hands. There's no strength to build on. The Office could provide a lead-in at 9.30pm but I suspect that the second they move 30 Rock from that slot, it would drop sharply so there wouldn't be any real benefit.

They need a few noisy shows to get things running again. Big name stars and producers or sci-fi/cult shows which always generate buzz. Reality can be a great platform to turn a network around but it's very hit and miss. Maybe adapting a hit film for TV or even a video game (an area which seems under-developed, IMHO).

NBC have Parenthood which is based on a film plus upcoming remakes of The Rockford Files and Prime Suspect. Shows based on video games seems risky as they've been hit and miss when turned into films although saying that, Im looking forward to Prince of Persia.

I think NBC needs to develop more multicamera comedies, it's clear that the single camera shows get the praise but not viewers. Or keep single camera comedies but make them more accessible to audiences, maybe remake something like Outnumbered, Gavin and Stacey or even Benidorm although what the US equivalent of Benidorm?

Surprised that no one has ever attempted to remake the two UK hit dramas, Doc Martin and New Tricks. New Tricks would be a hard sell due to the older cast but Doc Martin would fairly easy to adapt with just change of location.

Correct, the sky's the limit for X Factor, but there was only ever one prize from Millionaire, and we didn't care about a contestant enough to see it again.

I think ITV should have been crafty, and waited until someone had won the jackpot (probably peaking its audience), then sell the show worldwide, and pull it off air for a year or even a few.

Then, it bring it back when the public appetite is restored. It did feel overexposed, but it was very serious unlike most gameshows. It had a very unique format.

And I can't believe people have mentioned the revamp, with the dancy titles and the new money amounts. That has weakened the show, if anything. Makes it look real cheap. It should never have been changed.

I don't like the celebrity specials either.

The whole thing about Millionaire was building up momentum, with the viewer seeing who can get closest, or who can win a million.

It's a more successful day-in, day-out gameshow than the BBC have ever created, and obviously the BBC could be blamed more than ITV for unnecessary padding.

- Strictly Come Dancing - very long shows with no breaks
- Countryfile - 50 weeks
- Watchdog - an hour of dumbed down rubbish
- The One Show - ALL THE TIME, plus an hours episode on a Friday. I know it deals with current events, but its a bit much isn't it?

Robbie can talk about padding

Silly man.

Yes, some have said that the Leona Lewis Effect is one of the reasons for X Factor's increased popularity - that her win, with her talent, give the programme credibility.

Which begs the question, if John and Edward win this year does the programme lose that credibility abd, subsequently, all the extra viewers it's won this year?

No wonder Simon's storming around in a filthy mood. But he ought to be careful. Look what happened with Strictly last year. The more obviously angry the judges got at the public continually voting for John Sergeant, the more public support John got. And if John hadn't decided the joke had worn thin, and so quit, who's to say he wouldn't have won it. Like Jodie Preger winning I'd Do Anything when Cameron Mackintosh so didn't want her to win.

I can't imagine John and Edward doing a John Sergeant and saying "We only entered this for a laugh. We don't deserve to win, we're not the best act. Let's quit the contest." And I bet they get loads of kids voting for them. And the Irish. And anyone who likes to see Simon Cowell annoyed.

Come on, John and Edward!!!!

Wednesday 28th October 2009
BBC One
18:00 - BBC News at Six: 4.7m (24.6%)
18:30 - Regional News and Weather: 5.5m (26.9%)
19:00 - The One Show: 4.4m (21.3%)
19:30 - Jimmy's Food Factory: 4.1m (18.3%)
20:00 - Waterloo Road: 5m (21.3%)
21:00 - Crimewatch: 4.2m (17.6%)
22:00 - BBC News at Ten: 4.6m (23.2%)
22:25 - Regional News and Weather: 4.6m (25.3%)
22:35 - The National Lottery Draws: 3.5m (21.5%)
22:45 - Crimewatch Update: 2.3m (15.8%)
22:55 - The League Cup Show: 1.5m (14.9%)

BBC Two
18:00 - Eggheads: 2.3m (11.9%)
18:30 - Strictly Come Dancing - It Takes Two: 2.5m (12.2%)
19:00 - Coast: 1.7m (7.9%)
20:00 - Natural World: 2.4m (10%)
21:00 - Andrew Marr's The Making of Modern Britain: 2.2m (9.2%)
22:00 - Never Mind the Buzzcocks: 1.9m (9.9%)

ITV1
18:30 - ITV Evening News and Weather: 3.8m (18.6%)
19:00 - Emmerdale: 6.8m (33.1%)
19:30 - Coronation Street: 8.4m (37.5%)
20:00 - Midsomer Murders: 5.9m (24.9%)
22:00 - News at Ten and Weather: 2.5m (12.7%)
22:35 - Cops with Cameras: 1.8m (14%)

Channel 4
18:00 - The Simpsons: 2.2m (11.4%)
18:30 - Hollyoaks: 1.6m (7.9%)
19:00 - Channel 4 News: 700,000 (3.2%)
19:55 - 3 Minute Wonder: The Wall: 600,000 (2.8%)
20:00 - Ruth Watson's Hotel Rescue: 1.4m (5.9%)
21:00 - Did Heston Change Little Chef?: 2.2m (9.1%)
22:00 - True Blood: 1.1m (6.6%)

Five
17:00 - Five News with Natasha Kaplinsky: 800,000 (6.3%)
17:30 - Neighbours: 1.4m (9.1%)
18:00 - Home and Away: 1.1m (5.9%)
18:25 - Live From Studio Five: 200,000 (1.2%)
19:30 - Highland Emergency: 400,000 (1.8%)
20:00 - Britain's Best Brain: 700,000 (3%)
21:00 - FILM: Collateral Damage: 900,000 (4.7%)
23:10 - Vice Squad: 300,000 (3.9%)

Good night for ITV, Midsomer around the 5.9m like previous new episodes. In fact, good night for all terrestrials, excluding Five who appeared to have an appauling night.

Waterloo Road got off to a very good start.

Fantastic start for Waterloo Road. Not one episode in the previous series managed 5m and considering BBC1 have comissioned 40 new episodes of the show it needs to be getting decent ratings. Hopefully it can build on the 5m and become a solid hit on Wednesdays, like Holby is on Tuesdays.

Buzzcocks slotted in nicely to its new slot on BBC2, but it does seem like it's being messed around a lot this series.

Good night for ITV1, but Midsomer would be around the 6.5m mark I reckon if it had a consistent slot. Also surprising Corrie keeps managing over 8m when out of its normal slot. Also strangely when Collision airs Corrie is back in the Wednesday 7.30pm slot. What's the point in this now both of the 2 Friday episodes have been used up?? Surely this is just going to confuse and anger Corrie viewers??

Tonights episode should get a boost with the big Tony storyline and no Masterchef competition.

Extremely poor night for FIVE. Their first try at an entertainment show in ages and it flops big style. Not a good start. FIVE's Wednesdays are like ITV1's Tuesdays. They have no big hitters. Every other day of the week on FIVE has at least one big hitter which runs for at least half the year, but Wednesdays have nothing as far as I can recall.