For next year Channel 4 should do :

3.25pm Coach Trip
4.00pm Countdown
4.45pm Deal Or No Deal
5.30pm Come Dine With Me

Nor have I, but I'd say it's ITV's biggest daytime hit, as it gets around 1.5m daily iirc, and I think iandb is right about it stealing Countdown's audience. It's done very well for itself, as it only started with about 0.7m, and it grew from then on, and I'm sure the primetime Christmas special last year boosted it. That may have flopped in itself, but it was worth it for the way it's increased the regular daytime ratings for the show. I can see it winning the 5pm slot regularly next year.


Perhaps, but DOND isn't anywhere near as big as it was two or three years ago, and only gets around 2m now, which is still excellent, but I don't think it's far ahead of ITV's drama repeats. Also, Coach Trip did well at 5pm this year, so I don't see any benefit in moving it to 3.25pm, where a large amount of its younger audience will not be able to watch.

Considering they got that wrong it's fair to say they got the time wrong too. After all officially programmes aren't slotted into specific time slots until the week the schedule has to be declared.

Talking of which, will the usual Wednesday deadline begin to be bought forward now with Christmas approaching. By my reckoning, the Christmas TV listings should be out around 8th December, so we can expect those to be confirmed around a week beforehand - and then usually the two weeks prior are published early too.

That's decision made then.


I agree. It's a shame the daytime ratings aren't reported as routinely as those in primetime, but be interesting to see how Countdown varies with the competition.

I think Collision did very well, bearing in mind Scottish Television were showing 'Greatest Ever Scot'. Maybe it could've reached over 8 million, if it were completely networked. Maybe Doc Martin could've had overnights of over 10 million, if it were completely networked. Maybe Kingdom would've been at nearly 6 million, and been saved the axe.

I think ITV and STV need to start working together. It is fair that STV should be able to drop out of ITV's schedule, but ITV needs to give STV a real opportunity. Tuesday's and Thursday's, for example, should not be soapfests, and this should be when STV comes out of generic ITV programming.

Because, ITV are broadcasting top drama, sport and entertainment on Monday's, Wednesday's, Friday's, Saturday's and Sunday's nearly all-year round.

So, Tuesday and Thursday could be an experimental night for ITV, with factual programming, risque entertainment and drama. Remember, Moving Wallpaper and Echo Beach launched on Thursday's to 5 million viewers, because people were ambitious about it. If ITV can market a show well, AND show that it's quality and has an appetite (which Echo Beach/Moving Wallpaper didn't really have), we could see some hits in the Tuesday/Thursday slots.

Whilst STV could create some hits of their own. It would be nice if Tuesday and Thursday nights became an evening where from 7:30pm-10:00pm [for most of the year], each region can decide what to broadcast. Most will stick with generic ITV, but we might see a few start to experiment.

Yorkshire Television, for example, would probably air a lot of Frost repeats on Thursday nights from 8-10pm/9-10pm maybe, with the final episodes of Heartbeat 8-9pm, premiered in the Yorkshire region, and I think that would do well. Granada might show some interesting documentary series. Tyne Tees could have some Wire in the Blood repeats as it is specific to the North East.

Actually, thinking about it, could ITV make Thursday evenings 'oldies' night. Well, Emmerdale and Countrywise seem to be getting a good audience. How could the following fare?

7:00pm Emmerdale
7:30pm Countrywise
8:00pm Heartbeat / The Royal / popular drama repeats
9:00pm Kingdom / Downton Abbey / popular drama repeats / other family drama
10:00pm News at Ten

This leaves Sunday for the soaps, Wild at Heart, Dancing on Ice, Doc Martin, X Factor and the many detective series. Monday for soapfest and thrillers, Tuesday for factual programming, Wednesday can fill in the detective gaps, showcase the many awards ceremonies and football coverage. Friday can continue to be an entertainment night, whilst Saturday continuing as it is.

Or ITV could go down the route of experimental sci-fi/other drama/gameshow/factual:-

7:00pm Emmerdale
7:30pm Grimefighters
8:00pm Dancing on Ice: The Skate-Off / The Whole 19 Yards / Primeval / Thunderbirds / The Krypton Factor [extended to an hour] / The Cube / new youth drama pilots
9:00pm Piers Morgan's Life Stories / other entertainment-factual formats / Who Wants to be a Millionaire? / Single, Married, Other / etc

This would mean Tuesday would have the advantages of Dancing on Ice, whilst Sunday's would have to have a lot of two hour drama (following on from the soaps) until Britain's Got Talent. That would mean an Agatha Christie Season, Lewis, Midsomer Murders and a possibility of drama repeats [which would probably do well on a Sunday following on from the soaps]. Wednesday's, Friday's and Saturday's as you were.

While that is true, in reality initial schedules are determined months in hand.

For instance, sporting events are slotted in first, along with the 'regular drama' and news bulletins and everything else slots into that.

Regarding Christmas, BBC Press Office will update again tomorrow with Week 49 (5th to 11th December), and then again on Monday 16th November with Week 50 (12th to 18th December).

BBC Press Office doesn't say when the two week Xmas update will come though.

Thanks. Yep I think it will likely change too I was just saying what the pencilled in time was but if you click more to read more about the programme where it tells you the publicists name etc then it does say TX: TBC.

Regional tv outside the nations is dead - why cant people accept that? The reason it worked in the 70s & 80's ws no Sky, no Five, no Ch4 (in any meangiful competitve sense), no Google, etc. The licence to print money is dead, no matter who runs ITV.

I had to laugh at the thought of STV and "risque entertainment". Does that mean no underwear under the kilts?

In terms of American ratings, i'm sure i read somewhere that there was a figure in the demos which suggests whether or not a series is likely to be renewed. I know it isn't a certainy, but apparently the figure is nearly always accurate. I have a feeling that it is 3.0 in the demo, is that correct? I'm basically working out what the chances are of How I Met Your Mother, Glee, FlashForward and Modern Family are of being renewed (I know they're all fairly safe, but would still be nice to check )

If you read the tabloids, Deal or No Deal may not be continuing forever due to budget cuts, and aren't Channel 4 looking to continue to work with Olga TV with a new teatime chat format?

I think this is quite short sighted, and I don't think you get what I mean.

I think the regional companies should be re-introduced to play creative roles too. I don't think ITV Studios can do it from such a centralised position.

ITV's long running formats: Coronation Street, Emmerdale, The South Bank Show, Heartbeat - I could go on forever - all have their own individual quirks.

A bunch of executives (who play a bigger role in TV production nowadays) do not have the life skills to make a programme like Coronation Street, which came from a very socialist thinking Granada Television, a regional company that also brought us Britain's best and most honest current affairs series ever (in my opinion), World in Action.

I do agree that TV has moved on, and I wouldn't give up many slots for regional production, but I do think time has to be given up. STV have had success with 'Made in Scotland', a rare history programme which has done brilliantly. This could become a regional brand, and do very, very well. 'Made in the North', 'Made in the Westcountry', etc.

There are ample opportunites for STV to opt out of network programming if they so wish
- Tuesday and Thursday at 7.30
- Tuesday at 8.00
- Sometimes Tuesday at 9.00
- Daily at 10.30
- Friday at 9.00 in the Summer

STV are choosing the opt out of the major drama and keep the cheap documentaries because they can't afford the drama not because they want to air more unique programming

Theres no set number, but the guy who runs the TVByTheNumbers site which is always linked to does a pretty clever renew/cancel index, where he judges each shows numbers against the network average - then colour-codes them as to what he guesses will happen to them.

Check it out here:
http://tvbythenumbers.com/the-renew-cancel-index

At the moment, most of the shows you mention look pretty good. Modern Family is doing fine for ABC and is pretty safe, and HIMYM is a steady banker for CBS. Glee seems OK - if not quite the smash lots were expecting - it could potentially get a very nice boost from a post-American Idol slot in the spring. FlashForward is the one in most danger - it had a good debut but has dropped steadily ever since. At current levels, its OK - but any further drop and a renewal after the end of the first season in May is in some doubt.

So what they should do is show a variety of profitable, established drama that will also improve the channel's reputation:-

- Monday Night Thrillers
- Doc Martin [show the latest series somewhere]
- Benidorm [show the latest series somewhere]
- Wild at Heart
- Lewis
- Foyle's War
- Midsomer Murders
- Primeval
- Taggart
- Downton Abbey

Along with stuff that usually does well for ITV.

If I was STV, I wouldn't purchase 'Married, Single, Other' for example, as that would be a waste of money.

STV need a balance.

That was the list i was looking for! Thank you I believe he was quite accurate most of the time, And i'm hoping Flashforward holds steady! Really interesting read, thank you

Does anybody know why E4's Thursday 9-10pm showing of Scrubs never gets added into the ratings round up?

Because its not reported by the 'normal' sites? Last Thursday's, according to Channel 4 Sales had 717,400 viewers by the way. This includes E4 +1.

Regarding Collision, I'll say about 5.5m/6m tonight, the hour for me seemed to fly by compared to yesterday. Won't be surprised if the audience increases through the hour this time.

Good debut for Crash, sorry, Collision.

What impressed me wasn't the headline figure (because as BGT/TXF has proved, if you break the bank on the promotional/PR budget, you will magic up millions of viewers from nowhere), but the fact that only 1.3m switched off during the hour, bucking the usual trend with ITV drama. And that's surprising given that I thought ep 1 was particularly testing for an ITV1 audience, and frankly, a bit dull.

I'd be surprised if sustains >6.5m over the same hour tonight, but we shall see.

One note of caution - I imagine Scottish viewers could have been disproportionately drawn to the heavily promoted (in Scotland) Greatest Scot series, also running nightly. Will this artificially inflate ITV1's figures this week?

Good for Miranda - seemed a strong show, rather wasted against Corrie, but you can't argue with 2.5m. I see it gets a repeat after Top Gear on Sunday, so could conceivably pick up even more for the repeat. If it's a success, I wonder if it could move to BBC1 - it felt very mainstream to me. A popular and good mainstream comedy hit is a rare beast these days, as we all know. But perhaps I'm getting ahead of myself.

I see the "Fix Factor" story is gaining traction in the papers. I tend to subscribe to the "all publicity is good publicity" view, but it does seem like the credibility of Cowell and his so-called "talent contest" is holed below the waterline. Perhaps there will indeed be a backlash as the penny finally drops for the bulk of Fix Factor's gullible audience?

Well according to another thread on this forum it didn't perform very well.

3rd place in Scotland, and a 13% share.

Interesting that in Australia, The Mentalist is now outrating FlashForward.

Back in September, Seven's FlashForward had an 800,000 strong lead over rival US import The Mentalist on Nine Network. Since then however the tables have slowly turned, with FlashForward experiencing a steady decline in ratings, recording a low of just 1.06m last Monday. The Mentalist meanwhile is now winning the crucial 8:30pm timeslot by around 100,000 viewers.

Two and a Half Men repeats and a new episode of The Big Bang Theory on Nine also outrated FlashForward on Monday. (9th) The former was the top rated show of the night with a healthy 1.46m viewers, enough to push the normally dominant Seven News into second place.

Demo wise FlashForward is still performing reasonably well, winning in both 18-49 and 25-54. But unless it picks up relatively soon then it probably won't stay there much longer as Seven value total viewers more than decent demos in that timeslot. A move to newly launched digital channel 7TWO is one option available, to become one of its flagship programmes alongside the likes of Lost and Heroes.

An interesting article about X Factor and how it's become the 'British Superbowl' in terms of advertising revenues :

http://entertainment.timesonline.co....cle6911693.ece

My big hope is that The X Factor and Britain's Got Talent build up ITV's revenue so they can start being more eceletic at the moment. While recovering from the doldrums of 2008 they're not quite right yet.

Saying that, great figures for Collision last night, and only Tonight really hit the channel. Interesting - when ITV1 have a great night BBC1 usually holds up. When BBC1 has a great night, ITV1 usually crumbles.

Low for the hanging of Gary Glitter. I thought it'd do better personally, but then it was up against tough competition. Flashforward and Life dipped but not majorly.

Is the Superbowl fixed though?

That's an interesting article. There's a similar article here, which is very interesting as it says that it's effectively irrelevant how many viewers The X Factor gets outside of the 16-34 age range.

That's because ITV are asking advertisers to pay just based on the number of 16-34s watching, which is £35-52 per thousand viewers aged 16-34 for a 30 second spot.

To put that into perspective, it normally costs advertisers about £5 to reach a thousand viewers of any age on average. So that's a huge boost if you think about it.

With an estimated 3.6-5 million viewers aged 16-34 tuning in for The X Factor final, 30-sec advertising spots are reported to cost as high as £260,000 which is massive!

It would be interesting to know what shows are the commericial broadcasters highest show earners, for Channel 4 it is probably Big Brother and I would assume for Five it's the CSI Franchise although I imagine FlashForward is pulling a young audience in comparison to their other shows and also The Gadget Show.