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Ricky Whittle AKA Lisa Snowden... |
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#26 |
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 90,778
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The judges want Ricky W and Ali in the final and they'll get them there by scoring one or the other top of the leaderboard each week and, mistakes or no mistakes, they'll start them off on a higher tariff than the others each week. Whether you agree with that or not, 'tis the way the cookie crumbles and nowt you can do about it till the final.
Basically, a flawless routine from a, say, Ricky G or a Phil Tuffnel is calibrated on a scale that equals a top mark of 8 ... which Ricky W or Ali will also get if one of them falls over. Presumably it's got to be something other than: because they're the best dancers. ![]() And what gives people the idea that marks are supposed to be only about errors. |
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#27 |
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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Sure, I didn't say the judges were wrong to start out like that. If it's the way they feel that Ricky W and Ali are way above anybody else, they're perfectly entitled if they want to mark them on a different tariff scale to others.
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Their problem - and the disconnect they get with a broad audience public of 8 million+ people - is that dance, like any of the arts, is a subjective thing, not an objective one. Folks at home can see someone not in the judge's good books do something they really liked with no obvious mistakes get an 8. Then on come Ricky W or Ali, maybe they trip up twice, don't dance it so great according to the judge's comments, then also get given an 8. At which point, they start chucking things at the telly, kicking the dog and shouting teacher's pets. But it's all part of the fun. All the 8 million need to know to avoid mistakenly thinking "teacher's pets" is to know the marks aren't only about errors.
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#28 |
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 225
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So what is the mysterious reason why the judges want Ricky W and Ali in the final?
Presumably it's got to be something other than: because they're the best dancers. ![]() And what gives people the idea that marks are supposed to be only about errors. Nothing underhand about it. They're entitled to do it, whether I agree with their selections or not. |
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#29 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 80,211
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I've got to say that the basic frame, the passion and command of the dance, were excellent. Ricky is very good.
He made a lot of mistakes though. Perhaps enough to put him on a par, or just below Jade. When he gets it right though, hes awfully good. And I don't really like him much. |
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#30 |
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 225
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Taking difficulty into account is not marking on a different tariff scale.
All the 8 million need to know to avoid mistakenly thinking "teacher's pets" is to know the marks aren't only about errors. Which is why the judges get to choose two finalists, and the public get to choose the other one. Technique will usually be enough to win - but not always. |
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#31 |
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Posts: n/a
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Hmmmmm
![]() Looks like we have a touch of the Lisa Snowdens again this year..... Ricky underperformed his Tango, you could see it in his eyes at the end. Not only did he make glaring mistakes he was also out of time with the music for most of it. Yet Len admitted glossing over them when he said "We're not gonna talk about that thing, I'll let someone else do that", then the other judges praised this flawed dance. Whilst Craig was summing up Len interrupted saying "you were out throughout"... then goes and gives him a NINE!!! ![]() ![]() How can a dance full of errors be awarded a 35?? This is FAVOURITISM, and the judges are idiots if they dont think the public will see it... Im sorry- Ricky can be very good, but he can also be lacklustre (salsa) and I dont think he's got the dreaded "J" word to win over the hearts of the public in this comp.. Im increasingly finding both Jade and Ali more interesting as dancers and I would be more than happy to see EITHER of these 2 lift the trophy... And both Ricky and Lisa never f*cked up their performances on more than one occasion., unlike your fav Matt D A, but he was taken through to the final because he was doing the tour, wasn't he?.
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#32 |
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 554
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Thought body shape much better but mistakes and lack of passion spoilt it for me. I had said to my partner that he could fall over and still score 8's. The judges did not seem to mark the dance they saw but gave marks on the basis of past performances and at the end of the day they're not doing him any favours with the public.
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#33 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 90
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rickys dance was good even though he made a few mistakes. the tango is quite a hard dance and to me it looked like one of the best eventhough he made errors.
want to talk about overmarking - lalia was way over marked that week after anton called her THAT name...conviently she was top of the leader board then.... |
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#34 |
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Join Date: Nov 2005
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The sad thing is that when Zoe and Ali were overmarked last week, both ended up in the dance off, but an overmarked hunk avoids it. I would love to have seen Ricky in the bottom two as a bit of a wake up call, and see him come back with a fantastic dance next week, as Ali did this week.
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#35 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,658
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I do hope Ricky Nipple is not this year's Lisa Snowdon. I really don't want to see him dressed in Bacofoil, crawling all over Brenda and flashing his gentleman parts
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#36 |
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Join Date: Feb 2009
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I do hope Ricky Nipple is not this year's Lisa Snowdon. I really don't want to see him dressed in Bacofoil, crawling all over Brenda and flashing his gentleman parts
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#37 |
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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How dare you compare Ricky to Lisa! I liked Lisa but Ricky is in a different league.
And both Ricky and Lisa never f*cked up their performances on more than one occasion., unlike your fav Matt D A, but he was taken through to the final because he was doing the tour, wasn't he?. ![]() Lisa didn't do a good job in the samba which in fairness the DO gave her a chance to raise her game and a lot of her latin was over-marked (Matt's jive was way better than hers despite been performed much early in the competition) I could switch it round that at least Matt gave us a geuninely amazing latin dance which I don't care if her ccc got 40 it didn't even get close to blowing me away and while we're in the domain of cheap shots - he did a decent showdance too. |
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#38 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
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Aye, and what the judges need to know is that appreciation for dance, like art or music, is subjective - no matter how much you try to make it objective. In the World Dance Championships, if two couples dance their dances technically perfectly to a same degree of difficulty, professional judges are gonna decide a winner ... They've got no pseudo-objective hat left to do that with, so what do they make their decision based on? Ta-da, back to subjective reasons.
Which is why the judges get to choose two finalists, and the public get to choose the other one. Technique will usually be enough to win - but not always.
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#39 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,922
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The sad thing is that when Zoe and Ali were overmarked last week, both ended up in the dance off, but an overmarked hunk avoids it. I would love to have seen Ricky in the bottom two as a bit of a wake up call, and see him come back with a fantastic dance next week, as Ali did this week.
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#40 |
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Join Date: Jul 2002
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I agree with this......I think he needs to realise that being naturally gifted and good looking is not enough. He is not putting in the hours and last night it showed, he was second on the board when in my view he should have been 4th behind Ali, Jade and Chris, he should have had 4 8's (32) which would have been 4th .
Being naturally gifted and good looking isn't enough and I too agree that his performance suffered because of lack of practice. However, even if his dance was marked so that he was fourth in the leader board there were still five couples who would have been worse than him and therefore should have been in the DO before him. Last night the correct couples were in the DO and the right one went. So Ricky's position on the leader board is now really a moot point. |
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#41 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
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I actually agree with your marks Jan2555*GG* but, does a score of 32 necessarily mean he would have been in the DO? I think after last week's "shock" result people would have been more inclined to pick up the phone and vote (I know I did). He also danced first this week which "should" have also gone against him and I for one wasn't sure he was safe.
Being naturally gifted and good looking isn't enough and I too agree that his performance suffered because of lack of practice. However, even if his dance was marked so that he was fourth in the leader board there were still five couples who would have been worse than him and therefore should have been in the DO before him. Last night the correct couples were in the DO and the right one went. So Ricky's position on the leader board is now really a moot point. |
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#42 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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I agree with this......I think he needs to realise that being naturally gifted and good looking is not enough. He is not putting in the hours and last night it showed, he was second on the board when in my view he should have been 4th behind Ali, Jade and Chris, he should have had 4 8's (32) which would have been 4th .
There was a good reason for that. He was in a car crash on tuesday. |
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#43 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Jade and Ian were in a car crash the week before and still pulled it out of the bag.....
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#44 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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I actually agree with your marks Jan2555*GG* but, does a score of 32 necessarily mean he would have been in the DO? I think after last week's "shock" result people would have been more inclined to pick up the phone and vote (I know I did). He also danced first this week which "should" have also gone against him and I for one wasn't sure he was safe.
Being naturally gifted and good looking isn't enough and I too agree that his performance suffered because of lack of practice. However, even if his dance was marked so that he was fourth in the leader board there were still five couples who would have been worse than him and therefore should have been in the DO before him. Last night the correct couples were in the DO and the right one went. So Ricky's position on the leader board is now really a moot point. |
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#45 |
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Join Date: May 2002
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Jade and Ian were in a car crash the week before and still pulled it out of the bag.....
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#46 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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And he is still doing full days filiming for Hollyaks
I KNOW he has a busy schedule but he knew this when he agreed to do strictly and he is doing amazingly considering the hours he has to train BUT that is no reason to give him 9s for a routine with mistakes in it. |
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#47 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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It was odd. There were lots of errors and he wasn't sharp enough stylistically either.
Four 8s would be plenty. |
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#48 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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Jade and Ian were in a car crash the week before and still pulled it out of the bag.....
But I forget, its Ricky W isnt it, so any reasonable issue that may affect his training (injury week previous, car crash, working a full-time job with long hours) isnt allowed on here. The man cannot do anything right in the eyes of some people on this forum. I thought, given the lack of training hours on his Tango, it was a really enjoyable dance and his storytelling had come on leaps and bounds. Yes, there were mistakes, but it was still one of the best dances of the night along with Ali, Chris and Jade and they are the 4 couples I cannot wait to see every week for the magic they can all bring to the floor. Bring on next week! |
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#49 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
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I must be being really thick or something but I've watched the routine again a few times and I'm clearly not seeing this mistake-ridden, error strewn out of time dance that everyone else can - ricky tinted spectacles possibly and my computer has its own staccato built in (stops every now and then!) but to me Ricky's dance is fast
, the choreography is advanced, the staccato movement is superb, the kicks are bob on, floorcraft is great and he's clearly leading.There's one bit towards the end where there seems to be slight hesitation and the last walk thingy side by side is not quite on the rhythm but he was marked down (Craig by 2 and the other judges by 1). The audience's reaction was enthusiastic and maybe if Ricky had been a better actor (worrying that this is his day job ) & covered up his disappointment better he might not have had such a flaming on here. To me that shows he's not fake though.As to his hours, I agree this week he didn't have much time due to Hollyoaks schedule and the whiplash from the car crash didn't help. I acknowledge he knew his day job might interfere when he signed up but nowhere on last night's show did he whine or moan. Also Jan (as one of the original Gethin girls) I'm sure you remember when Gethin struggled on one particular week when his Blue Peter schedule was full on - day jobs are day jobs. |
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#50 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Ricky's accident was reported in the papers and on the DS and on Twitter.......I was just trying to make the point that lack of training hours (no matter how good the reason) is not a good reason for overmarking a dance, that isnt Ricky's fault it was the judges that gave the marks.
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