No, but it was a vaild one considering the comment I responded to.

Remains vaild regardless. Tone-deaf giving opinions on the subtle differences between flats and sharps is bound to lead to misinterpretation at the very least.

These threads really annoy me !

What do you want Cheryl to do? Lie and say everyone was fantastic just so nobody says 'how can she talk she's not the best singer'. It's called an opinion guys.

Get over it.

Oh wait...

You've just totally changed my opinion.

Thanks for that insight.

I'm afraid not. I'm a Danyl fan, and also a musician, and he was out of tune throughout most of the performance.

I fear he may be in the bottom 2 because of it.

You have no evidence that she is tone deaf. Based on tonight, it's pretty clear thats she isn't.

No but if one points out mistakes for one they should do it for all. Only Joe was note perfect tonight yet I remeber her giving everyone else bar danyl positive comments.

Perhaps this is what I had a problem with him, with regards him doing this song.

He did not sing the melody that we all know.

However, the melody he sang was in tune and true to the song.

But so did the other judges.

You're right.

Cheryl is a born musician and singer.

Danyl, on the other hand, has nothing in comparison.


We'll agree to differ. I'll buy music that is performed by those who can perform it. You buy music that is performed by the boys with the buttons in the back room.

Hey, we're all happy.

Do you have any idea how utterly ridiculous that statement is?

You can't have a different opinion of pitch, it either IS or ISN'T correct. Not an opinion!

The very fact that you don't understand that concept is very worrying.

Is black the new white in your opinion.

Hell what would I know having made a living from knowing what I'm doing for 30 years.

Crumbs... it really is funny how the senses are subjective and the manner/quality of audition is in the ear of the listener.

To me, Danyl's performance could've held it's head up well in an innovative and pared back acoustic live lounge setting... he may not have been entirely note-perfect... but there was an eloquence to all aspects within which he nailed it and a persuasiveness underlying the odd tonal glitch.

Fair play... as with each post in this thread - it is all just opinion and the above FMs obviously heard something which did not register with me to the same extent or, indeed, avoided my ears completely.

Good! A musician. Someone else who can hear pitch and call it as it is/was.

I wasn't posting as an anti-Danyl post either just a factual one.

Ironically, I'm with you on the live lounge idea.

I posted somewhere earlier in the week that the best thing that Danyl could do was perform with a single acoustic guitar (i'd gladly play it for him) and give a simple, emotional performance without the sweeping histrionics that we keep getting from him.

I rate him much higher than his general performances. He doesn't get how easily he could win this. Sometimes, less is more.

Yes, you can have different opinions of pitch and tone.

We do.

Your job does not make you any more justified in your opinion than I am mine.

Nor does it give you the right to condescend or attempt to belittle the opinion of anyone else.


If you were a more interesting and less angry person, I might be inclined to discuss this further. However, I don't log on to get myself wound up.


I loved Danyl's performance, I thought it was in tune and I will vote for him this week.

Sound engineers aren't nearly enough to challenge my opinion.

Cheryls job is to judge the contestants and she was spot on about Danyl - he was flat!

Whats she supposed to do? Lie just because she sometimes sings flat??

She praises Danyl when he is good and this week he wasn't.....simple as

Well that's 3+ people who know he was flat but apparently we are all wrong and one fan thinks that they are right.

I do wish people would listen to experienced, qualified people who goes out of their way to educate people if they would only listen!

But I now no what to say to the next PAYING singer who after many hours in my recording studio after they find they were off by a mile on one of the tracks and I didn't do a retake or tell them: I'll just say well that just an opinion!

And their opinion will be not to pay me for doing my job!

He is a victim (and I use the term loosely) of his own over-thinking and that of others... both negative and positive.

Amen to your last.

/maybe you ought to offer your services to SyCo

I defended you in a previous thread and please understand that I am by no means criticising your opinion, you are entitled to it as is everyone else but do you have to mention your musical background in every post you make? Its as if you believe it gives you more of an opinion than anyone else here which I feel is incredibly patronising.

With regards to the thread, I am a Danyl fan and thought his performance was good but not among his best. I have to give credit where its due and Joe was exceptional. By far the best, IMO.

So when she does offer proper musical criticism, i.e. truthfully telling Danyl that he was flat, she can't talk because "she can't sing herself so what does she know" . But when she says she likes someone's hair or costume she's STILL blasted for it because that ISN'T proper musical criticism. What do you lot want from her?
Simon,Louis and Dannii aren't exactly famed for their world-class singing either,yet Dannii especially is praised for pointing out tuning issues of people who are better singers than her. Plus unlike Danyl,Cheryl doesn't act like she's God's gift to music and has no delusions about her own level of talent.

Sorry and with respect, I can't answer that as you are stating as fact that what I have said it my opinion. It simply isn't, it's fact.

Therefore, your post can not be answered. (sorry)

Do I have to mention my musical background?: Yes as it backs up the statement above that it isn't just another opinion but a statement of fact and I qualify and back up that statement.

It doesn't make my opinion any more valid as it's not an opinion. (for completeness) it doesn't make the fact any more factual either it just remains fact.

Of course if people don't wish to acknowledge the facts there is little that can be done about that, but it still remains fact.

So you see I'm between a rock and a hard place: I give clear facts and back that up by stating my background.

People yelling "it's only an opinion" and making musical statements that are just nonsense from a factual stance seem to be just opinions from fans as they have nothing to back up what they say or any other proof.

If trying to educate comes across as patronising, then it shouldn't do as it is nothing more than facts being told to another. No one has to listen: But to try and correct fact because it clashes with hero worship is not going to work.

Do you not feel that telling me that all I have is an opinion (on this given subject) is not a tad patronising?

A small point to end with: I post 100s of posts a day on here and in about three threads only I have mentioned my music background and only to qualify what I have posted. So hardly "in every post" or even close.

Let's stick to the facts shall we, then we can all make progress!

Isn't it fact that not all sound engineers can have the perfect ear and may not be terribly good at their jobs... you're always going to get the odd dud in any field. Hell you only have to listen to the X Factor to realize that sound engineers don't always get it right.

Indeed, isn't a sound engineers' right still fairly subjective... and isn't it just mastery of bells and whistles that give some the confidence to state their 'right' as fact... ?

I know of lots of people who are very well qualified in many fields (I'm not exactly without talent and reputation myself)... I know of no-one who would be quite so categorical in their assertion on an area of their specialities which is even just a tad short of that which can be scientifically qualified and quantified beyond measurable doubt.

Maybe but not the right one unfortunately

she sounded better on her tour

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahu8pgDok-Y

Thank goodness we have an expert among us! He was flat at the beginning but picked up a bit later on.

I often tell my husband that someone is flat but he disagrees - the hearing aids probably autotune it for him!

I've read this whole thread and going to wade in with my summary views.

1. Whether someone is off tune or not is not a matter of opinion, it's measurable. As an example that is how electronic tuning forks work, it measures and goes green when you are in the range of the note you are aiming for.

2. Danyl was flat on several notes tonight. It must be hard to stay in tune in that kind of situation, hard to hear backing music etc, but that doesn't change the fact that his tuning was out tonight. For people with a musical ear there were some "ouch" moments.

3. Saying Cheryl is tone deaf is silly - tone deaf is an extreme situation where you really can't hear/hold a pitch. She may well not be the best singer in the world and go out of tune sometimes but to say she is tone deaf is taking it too far.

4. I've noticed that many of the acts have trouble with their tuning at the beginning of songs - I wonder if more couldn't be done to help them, giving cue notes or similar. It doesn't add to my viewing pleasure, I'd rather see them start strongly and show the best of their singing talent, whatever that is.

There, my views......