Rage against the machine is a fab choice... especially with afghanistan going on.... they were fantastic the first time round and still are. Hope they get the top slot.

That's exactly how I feel; what's the diffference between being told what to buy by Simon Cowell or being told what to buy by a Facebook group?

Ofcourse, the whole campaign also buys into music snobbery of the most annoying nature.

The fun of pointing out that they're on Sony for me is nothing to do with Simon Cowell, but with the fact that they're supposedly this rebel band, raging against the 'machine' but signed to the biggest record label in the world

I've bought KITN 5 times already. My older sister bought The Climb so needed to cancel her out

I think what this shows, above all- as if it needed proofing- is the power of the internet... In particular social media.

It has turned out to be equaly of powerful as that of a tv show that is being watched by an average of 15 million viewers a week....

Simon Cowell has created a commercial frenzy with tv radio internet and press all feeding off it and as a result relentlessly plugging his show.
RATM is the first real sign of a backlash against the brand and the perceived stranglehold that Cowell seemingly has over British music at the moment. XF and Britains Got Talent will no doubt throw up even more chart dominance over the coming years and we may just see a chart influenced by the two shows all year round. What a prospect!
Personally I think it will be a miracle if Joe M is not number one as everybodies elderly mother or aunt is going to storm down to Tesco and get the CD single, but at least there is a little bit of interest rather than a simple coronation as usually happens.

But the motives are just the same, if not worse in the RATM case.

Are people buying The Climb because they love the song? In most cases, no. They're buying it because they supported Joe through the competition, or in some cases just because it's the song from X Factor.

Are people buying RATM because they like the song and/or the band? In most cases, no. I would bet in many cases they haven't even heard the song before, and are doing so as a protest against X Factor in response to a Facebook campaign.

Yes, it makes a point about 'new' media and its influence, but it doesn't bring back any genuine competition to the Christmas chart. It's not like three or four big singles are released that week and there's genuine excitement about which one will top the chart. Both are completely manufactured campaigns that involve the vast majority of participants buying a song that they don't necessarily like.

Perhaps if it's successful in breaking the XFactor stranglehold on the Xmas chart, it might encourage other acts to compete in future years.

Why would a decent chart act (and there are some, I'm a big fan of quality pop) even bother to invest in a Christmas single when they know SyCo have it all sewn up?

A chink in the Cowell armour might give them a glimmer of hope.

I don't agree with that; it was a very well known song in rock circles in the 90's.

Well, I think you've proved my point more than your own there. It was a very well known song 'in rock circles in the 90's.' This Facebook group doesn't primarily appeal to RATM fans, otherwise the impact would be fairly minor (I'm not trying to disparage the group or song by making that statement, you understand).

I don't doubt that some people, when hearing about the campaign, thought the song was a worthy number 1 and bought it on those terms. But the reason it's had such a massive impact is because people want to protest against X Factor. Will most genuine RATM fans not already own the song? And why are people downloading it multiple times if the aim isn't solely to beat X Factor to the top?

It's a campaign that's gathered tremendous pace and been hugely successful, but it's no more real than the alternative.

Absolutely. In many respects a track had to be found that would appeal accross the generations and reaching back 17 years to this track has done that. go to any music festival and you will find peopel of most ages in the crowd. The music scene in the Uk was very much roughly divided between the dance/rave scene and the rock/indie scene. RATM came out along wit hthe likes of nirvana and you couldnt really go many places playing indi/rock music without hearing it.

Most of us have friends that liek a particular type of music different to our own and therefore you cant easily avoid the popular tracks in any genre. you drag your mates to places they will hear your preferred music and visa versa. So many people hear, danced or in some cases gritted their teeth to this track. Because moshing was popular whether you liked the track or not chances are you got bashed about on a dance floor somewhere to it and these are treasured memories.


The fact it can still appeal to current younger rock/metail fans is indicative of where it has come from and bands it helped to influence.

latest itunes sales chart ....looks like a 3:1 on itunes...

http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/9148/chart7.jpg

It's in the interests of both artists and record companies to keep this competition for Christmas number 1 going. After all, the stiffer the competition, the more music buyers are going to get out there and buy or download their favourite to get it to number 1, and the more money the artists and record companies make.

Rage Against The Machine and Sony would have made a miniscule amount of money out of the song this month had it not been for this campaign, because the song would have languished in their back-catalogue.

Equally, while there was always going to be a song released for Christmas by the X factor winner, the competition with Rage Against The Machine has more than likely prompted extra sales from those people buying extra copies to try and 'beat' Rage Against The Machine to number 1. Those sales may not have happened otherwise. So even if it does not make number 1 there's every chance it will have sold more copies and made more money for Joe McElderry than without Rage Against The Machine.

This is true, but you're looking at this years chart in isolation. The whole point of getting behind this track is to get Cowell to vacate his quest for christmas number ones to make future charts more unpredictable. If that happens there is no need for a campaign like this. The X Factor song is Xmas number one year on year on year, and this is a way of, perhaps the only way of trying to change that.