As I saw people on the forums constantly criticisng RTDs writing (which is personal opinion, and everyone's perfectly entitled to think what they want)...I just wanted to mention perhaps, in my humble opinion, one of the greatest new doctor who stories, if not THE greatest.

The writing is unbelievable well thought out, clever and very well planned. You really feel connected to Donna and it is extremely emotional throught the second episode.

Just thought I'd mention that, after watching it just now. It's probably the 10th time I have watched it - and it still makes me sob every single time.

Bye bye RTD...I will probably miss you

Personally i felt let down by them, it just felt like RTD was trying to get every character in to one place so you had for the first episode the Doctor in three places: the TARDIS, the shadow proclamation and a street where he ran to Rose and the second was mainly based in Davros's part of the crucible so, and for me it never really got going at all the only really good part about the episodes was Donnas ending which had me in tears.

So i am hopeing for alot more this Christmas and New Year.

It was a fantastic cliffhanger, that's for sure that captured the imagination of the nation. Well the nation of Doctor Who fans at any rate.

Sometimes I feel it was a missed opportunity though. What a great regeneration it would have been. I remember watching DT's hand glow for the first time in the TARDIS and I couldn't actually get my head round it. Was he actually going to do it. Did RTD have a secret man in already to play Doc 11? And if he was, wouldn't we have heard it by now. And then to leave the episode in the full process of regenerating was amazing stuff and it had us all talking.

Still that said... he didn't regenerate and transferred it all to his hand, leaving me wondering if he is actually in his 11th life already as Doc 10 and all that goes with that.

I just thought that DT regenerating in that moment would have made more sense. I didn't like the Doc 10.5 moments. I don't know about anyone else but I really don't think anyone who has worked tirelessly to get back to their own universe to be with the one you love and then just get shoved back into the world you were previously trapped in is going to be happy with that. I wouldn't have it. If The Doctor really wanted Rose to live with 10.5 did they really have to do that in Pete's World?

Somehow. to me, having The Doctor regenerate would have justified the ending to Journeys End as well as the whole regeneration cliffhanger.

Yes, OK, the regeneration bit was a bit...well, I don't know how to say it.

Also, as Rose I wouldn't be able to accept Doctor 10.5 as it's not really the Doctor.

I agree it would have been better for the Doctor to fully regenerate...but I don't think that David Tennant would appreciated being booted out before he wants to go - RTD couldn't exactly replace him when DT wanted to stay.

I see where you are coming from. 100%

RTD's writing isn't to everyone's tastes...but IMO I think RTD is a great writer that really catches the wacther's attention. If it wasn't for RTD - Doctor Who would probably never have been revived.

I am expecting the Christmas Specials to be 10x better because we have been STARVED of DW this year (cruel bastards ) and if they can't match up to the end of series 4 - they can hardly be called 'Specials' now can they ?

The Stolen Earth is my favorite episode of the RTD era. Great stuff!

I think Journey's End has it's flaws, but it's an epic nonetheless.

He can grow old with her, and more importantly, love her, which is something The Original Doctor could never do....

He's not REALLY the Doctor, from Rose's point of view, he's better.

I like most of RTDs episodes but just not them two but for me i think it was Turn left that set the bar high for the episodes so they never really gave what i wanted.

If I say I've watched both episodes within the last seven days 3 times you can work out that I love these episodes. I get to see everyone together for the last time from DW and TW.

In series 4, from Midnight through to The Stolen Earth you had three examples of DW at it's finest in totally different ways.

It's interesting cause you had a similar great run in series 3 from Human Nature through to Utopia of three great stories as well.

eta: thats a bit of a cheat because Utopia/TSE are actually part of the series 3/4 finales, but other than that the point stands!

It was a bit... meh!

I think DT might have been fine with it if the script was right and he'd been told soon enough by RTD what the plans were. And it wasn't too long after TSE/JE that he's announced he was stepping down anyway.

I think we all have things we'd have done differently if we were in RTD's hotseat and having DT regenerate then is certainly what I would have done.

But you could tell that Rose was still struggling with the idea of living with a different Doctor. Even after the kiss, Doc 10 left them behind and she's still left with a different person to the man she loves in an entirely different universe. I think you can be forgiven for feeling let down at the end of all that.

If we had been going straight in to series 5 the following year. I may have agreed with you, but given the circumstances at hand I don't think it would have been a smart move. A series of stories spread out across the year simply is not the best way to introduce a new doctor to the wider audience.

But I understand what you mean, it would have been quite thrilling to have the regeneration there and then have a new doctor be dealing with the events of JE. Plus of course it would have meant that the BBc would have pulled off a huge coup in terms of keeping such a thing secret.

However I was not disappointed by the lack of a regeneration myself since I didn't expect there to be one, and the same I think was true for most of the people on this forum. Also, I think the AI of 91 does rule out the possiblity that the wider audience felt let down by it as well...

I've always been a big defender of these episodes. True enough the resolution and destruction of the Daleks is overshadowed by so many other things. The stories are a little overloaded, but are very enjoyable. I felt the same about the series 3 finale. There are always elements I could do without, but overall I found them extremely entertaining.

I do agree with you here. Both LOTTL and JE had some magnificent moments.

By the same token, Rose also "struggled" with the regeneration of 9 into 10. For about 10 minutes. And by New Earth it was pretty clear which version she preferred.

If she could still love a Doctor with the same memories, a radically different appearance and a somewhat different personality, I can't see her having much of a problem loving a Doctor with the same memories, same appearance, same personality and willing to shag her on a regular basis.

10.5, on the other hand, I imagine will have killed himself within the first six months of life with Rose and Jackie.

Ah, but we're all forgetting is that Doc 10.5 is a combination of Doc 10 and Donna. And Donna likes blokes. So by that rationale, there's a chance that Doc 10.5 will realise he preferred Captain Jack rather than Rose, and they'll split up....

He's only got a little bit of Donna in him though. That seemed to come through in his language and his temper, a bit.

At least he'll be able to hold his own against Jackie.

I think RTD is one of this countries finest writers, but acknowledge that it is all a matter of personal taste.

Midnight, Turn Left, Stolen Earth and Journey's End are a string of magnificent episodes. I could watch them all on a
regular basis and still derive immense enjoyment from them.

But then it all went horribly wrong with The Next Doctor and Planet of the Dead which I don't especially care for.

I have found that The Next Doctor has rather grown on me actually. Jackson Lake is one of the best developed one off characters in the shows history for me. I think it's the Cyber King element that lets it down a bit.

Maybe I'll give it another go - I think its on BBC3 later this week.

I actually like both of them, I would have rather seen the stories say just feature say Rose, Jack with Torchwood and Sarah Jane with Luke (and then keeping Gwen and Ianto stuck in the hub and Luke staying with Mr Smith) I guess he wanted to make something memorable for fans but I think may have gone slightly over the top with having Martha, Jackie, Harriot Jones, Martha's mum included.

I just watched these two episodes again. I had forgotten how superb they were (that bit where Davros recognises Sarah!).

RTD will have to go some to beat these two episodes.

I love that nod to the old series it always brings a massive smile to my face.

Well we shale find out in five days regarding part one.

Again, I love the story of Jackson Lake...a man so traumatised by the loss of his family he hides in the first thing he finds, the personality of The Doctor...
The revelation about what sent him that way was very well done and the moment where you realise the boy is his son was a simultanious jaw dropper and throat-lumper all at once!

I can understand if people got caught up in the idea of The Doctor meeting his future self and were dissapointed with the revelation he was just a human with a mind-wipe, but underneath all that is a beautiful story, imo.

Plus I grew up on Robot Wars, I think the Cyber King is one of coolest thing I've ever seen.
If only the Cybermen had that around in Doomsday, swatting Daleks out of the Sky in a techonological re-make of the climatic scenes of King Kong!

A great bit of Christmas Day spectacle, IMO.