I know it sounds like a daft question...but surely his regeneration would only be upsetting for the people *around* him, not the Doctor himself...and that wouldn't apply for this regeneration because he's already parted from all the significant companions.

It's not like in TCI when we saw the devastation and confusion of Rose and co, having to come to terms with his changed appearance. But for the Doctor himself, surely the change of body isn't such a loss as he's still the same person in his mind, memory etc isn't he?

Of course, I realise RTD was reflecting the sadness of the viewers re losing DT, and I totally understand why he had to present that sadness through 10 as there was no companion this time to react to the transformation...but it seemed to distort the significance of the regeneration: by presenting it as a tragedy for the Doctor himself, it took the emphasis away from the really important thing, i.e. the fact that he will still be the same person.

"Who he is" dies as well and it's like someone new walks out, according to his very own conversation with Wilf in the previous episode.

It suggests that to a certain extent his personality changes, which I think happened in classic Who a few times (particularly after the grumpy Hartnell version) and he didn't want to let go of who he currently was. That and he was a hit with the ladies

When CE regenerated DT, he was simply let go. He got over what had happened, however as DT he got use to being like that. Although does look out of place considering there has been many other regenerations. Perhaps he doesn't want to believe in fate.

Did you not see the bit where Ten explained why in part 1?

I think it's clear that he retains the same memories but inside he has different personality traits etc.

Yes that's true. Also, I just remembered what he said at the end of TCI "It's all new to me...I've never seen it...not through these eyes, anyway." So I guess that answers my question in my OP...he is losing something important after all.

The converstaion of part 1 was only there try to make the actual regeneration seem more dramatic, which it didnt need to be. RTD's ego at work again.

Yep, although they carry the memories of the previous incarnations, the personality changes, and the persona is different. Got to imagine, if you like who you are, being forced to change is probably pretty upsetting.

Ten said something along the lines of the 11th Doctor being a new man in the End of Time pt 1, that he does actually die. This also seems odd to me compared to 9 who seemed to be emotional but less angry and more accepting which is why I thought they were also the same man. In fact doesn't Ten say that Rose after he regenerates? I mean he remembered Rose so he must not be completely reborn.

I thought he didn't know he would regenerate this time as it isn't certain to happen.

I am not a Dr Who nerd, but isn't it the case if he dies before he regenerates then he actually dies? With all the prophecies I assumed he himself expected to die.

I have to say I thought it dwelt far too much on an "ending" for the Doctor. Of course it isn't, and I didn't care for all the upset and crying. I like my Doctor going out fighting. Loved Eccleston's regeneration, for example. Simple, funny, and still utterly heart-wrenching in the end.

A good episode though, but I just felt RTD tried too much to underline the fact that he and DT were leaving, and that was sad really. Too much trying to upset the audience. The Doctor doesn't die, well certainly not here anyway, and the series goes on. I half expect the usual Who audience will be rather confused when the new series starts up this year, having cried all the way through his regen and missed Matt Smith altogether!

Can't stop watching the new trailer. Need help. It looks absolutely fantastic.

Does the new trailer mean that the Tardis changes outside and inside - it didn't look like it but sounded the same?

Yes, that was what I was thinking too. With CE there was some sadness, but mainly a positive and onward-looking atmosphere; you kind of got the feeling it was an exciting adventure, the end of one chapter and the start of a new one...which of course it was, and should be. But surely tonight's regeneration should have been that way too. Otherwise it just becomes all about what we're losing--RTD and DT, instead of what we're moving on to.

I think the reason why Doc 9 was so accepting of his death, is because Doc 9 had been an angry man(see episode Dalek), and he saw his regeneration, or death of his personality, as a chance for him to start with a clean slate, none of that anger holding him back.

Well he actually said it FEELS like dying. I mean it must REALLY hurt.

Exactly. And you've hit the nail on the head there. I can't escape the feeling that that's what RTD wanted to leave behind. It's a shame, really.

It was Tennants inner fan boy not wanting to give up , we'd all be the same.
Also , is this the first time a Doctor has been born screaming

I think it's probably a bit like Dax in Star Trek Deep Space Nine.
Same entity or soul, but a completely different person. Somebody else who has memories of the previous person.

I'm confused how it can be said he changes his personality and yet is the same person? If anything makes a person who they are it's surely their personality? Would a person be friends or have relationships with the same people ( or at least the same kind) if they had a different personality. It seems unlikely because it is to a large extent what makes someone who they are. The Doctor seems to retain certain aspects through most regenerations but if TCI is taken as gospel that could be seen as a fluke as he seemed to list everything from sense of humour to sexiness as something that could change. I think I'd be a little terrified as well. He doesn't know who he's going to be. Also although Doctor Ten doesn't seem to have had a lot of luck in some respects he did seem to find a new zest for life (though I know there were some episodes that contradicted this) and I think that would be the most terrifying thing to lose.

Also I think Doctor Nine's face hinted he might be a lot more scared/nervous than he was letting at the time - he had to make it more acceptable for Rose? Plus having a companion who cares for you and who you care for by your side would make it more easy to accept? I think it reflects the different stages of the show at the time - Doctor Nine had only been there for one year/series and it felt more like we'd only just got to know him, and it seemed at the time like the viewer's closer link was to Rose, so although it was sad it was more of an adventure through Rose's eyes. Whereas with Doctor Ten it does feel like losing someone we've come to know over the last few years and watch escape danger so many times so it warrants a stronger level of end of era feeling.

[/quote]

Nine didn't get to spend months or years thinking about it.

It's like being told you have cancer that won't respond to treatment and all they can do is make you comfortable, or being told you need a heart bypass and if you don't quit smoking and change your diet and exercise habits you're going to die in a couple of years.

In one, all you can do is accept the inevitable and make peace with yourself. In the other, you fight as hard as you can to stay alive.

I don't understand why people are having such a hard time understanding why he wouldn't want to change every cell in his body, the way he feels, the way he looks, his entire personality. Who would?

I think it was more for the audience's benefit as they/we have invested a lot more time and affection in DT than CE.

Maybe because no other Doctor has whined and gone on and on and on and on about it so much before. And no other Doctor has ever said any of that stuff about dying and pain and all the stuff Ten said to Wilf.

I knew there was some reason for it, now we know it was just so that Ten could take a half hour to go. It just got too self-indulgent (for RTD and DT).

Well we've seen the Doctor's relationship with companions change due to regeneration before. Pertwee to Baker offered a very different relationship with Sarah Jane, for example. As Pertwee, the Doctor was far closer to Sarah Jane, whereas Baker's doctor was more critical of her.

The Doctor has always changed as a person when he regenerates. This is the first time, however, the this point has actually been acknowledged and considered by the character (that I can remember). I think its a long overdue issue and its emotional significance is well in keeping with the developed history and completely fitting of whay you would expect someone to feel.

After all, if the Doctor's personality changes so signifantly when he regenerates, it would be as good as dying as an individual. Even moreso, he would have plenty of experience of what this was like. He wasn't scared of death like we are. We are scared of the unknown. The Doctor knows EXACTLY what is coming and that is what scares him. He knows what he's going to lose.

As for why previous Doctor's haven't reacted the same, that could be put down to exactly the same point. Each Doctor is a different personality. Perhaps Tennant's Doctor was either more scared or more vocal about his fear than previous personalities.

The Doctor was happy with how he was now... didnt he refer to that after the false 'hand' regeneration in The Stolen Earth/Journey's End? Something like "Why would I want to change?" or something like that.

That, coupled with his emotional conversation (best scene of Part One) in the cafe with Wilf explains why he didnt want to regenerate.

Wow.