To bring back an old thread:

maybe Three's license is but I expect Vodaphone 3G to be in major demand for businesses wanting mobile fast net connections for laptops. No walled garden or fenced bathroom of whatever it is.

I think the expression "Pissed it up the wall" fits best!

I think a lot of it has probably gone to Iraq.

Vodafone have immediately noticed what will be the big driver for 3G - data for businesses. By using data to test and develop the network they can be sure to provide a fairly decent service. As I said earlier in the thread, if I need to connect back to the office from a location where there is no high speed internet connection then I am prepared to pay for it.

What Vodafone have also noticed is the complaints 3 are getting over voice calls. By running a data only service they can iron out the kinks in the network before launching the voice service later in the year. While businesses might complain about the data service dropping out, they will realise that it is a new thing and is prone to problems and will have the reliable GSM service to fall back on. If the business user was unable to make calls then there would be serious complaints about loss of business. It is a good move by Vodafone, one that 3 should have followed to get high spenders hooked.

Hopefully by the time the voice service is ready, along with some decent handsets, there will be enough business users with the data card who will want a phone as well so they are only carrying around one device.

I will be getting my hands on one of the Vodafone data cards in the next couple of weeks courtesy of a client who wants me to look at it for his sales staff. Hopefully I shall be very impressed.

On a different note - the term "Walled Garden" indicates an environment where the content is controlled. Within a walled garden you are limited on what you can see and where you can get out. If the "gates" to the garden are locked (as in 3) then you cannot get out. 3 decide what you can see and do.

Simon.

I find it hilarious to read that people thought 3G was going to be an amazing smash overnight and that they are now surprised that it hasn't been.

I also find it hilarious to read that people think 3G is going to "flop" and we are going to carry on using 15-year old technology (2G). You need to accept the fact that the consumer isn't driving the market, the industries are.

10 years ago there will have been a whole pile of people clutching their heavy 1G phones saying "What do I want one of those digital things for? I can do all I need to do on my analogue phone! Roaming? What use is that to me? I dont want to make calls when I'm on holiday! Text messages? What the bugger are they all about! 5p to send 160 letters? It's almost cheaper to write a letter!"

And now, with phones a fraction of the size and batteries lasting 10+ times longer, those same people are saying "What do I want one of those 3G things for? I can do all I want on my 2G phone! Videocalls? What do I want to see other people for? So what if I can access data on my mobile? I've got my PC for that!" Etc etc.

However one thing is for sure; the networks were idiots to bid so much money. But remember, at that time, if you were involved with mobile phones in the slightest you were a rich man. Why did it go a bit wrong? Well I suspect saturation point was one of the biggest factors. But there will always be a market for mobile phones. Most people I know don't keep a handset for much more than 2 years. Some change routinely every year.

As has been said several times, once the other networks are on board, 3 will start to become useful, and not just as a direct replacement to 2G but as an improvement with extra services which... YES... you will use! It will take time. But it will happen! I'll tell you one thing for free; you will not have a 2G phone in 7 years. Maybe even 4!

I'm thinking of changing networks next month. I've been on Vodafone since I was 12, and I am getting rather annoyed with the shoddy way they seem to treat me. My Vodafone liveried T610 that won't even browse the BBC site was the last straw.

I was going to go over to O2 but then we saw the 3G tarriifs and they do seem very reasonable. I know you only get double minutes during the first three months, but even when they return to normal, they seem very good value. The problem is, I don't know how good the coverage is, and how reliable it is. I also don't see any decent phones. I'm really not into video and stuff, mainly because there will be very few people I can exchange video calls with at the start, although I do accept it may come in a few years.

Sorry to quote your post selectively, but I've got to dash off to work in a sec....


My view is more that, because of the auction system that caused the telecoms companies to spend billions on licences instead of investment, it has not been as much of a success as it might otherwise have been. (I'm not quite as cynical as nobbynolan in believing that none of that licence money would have gone into investing in 3G.)


It's a two-way street. The industries won't act alone if it's going to lose them lots of money. The market is more of a donkey than an automobile, and doesn't always go the way industry might want it to.


I'm not so sure. There was a whole pile of people asking why they got so much "hiss" on a phone call, and not much later they were worried about their phone getting cloned. Okay, I didn't get a phone until 1997, but IIRC cloning was already known about then, and there was no question of my getting an analogue phone.


Unless they're planning on shutting down the 2G transmitters, I'll be surprised. 3G coverage is still patchy and the telecoms companies are too broke to achieve anything like the coverage of 2G in seven years, let alone four. My belief is that many customers will skip 3G altogether, and go on to whatever comes after that.

Looks like Voda have sorted the losing calls problem

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05...ne_3g_samsung/


I totally forgot about the walled garden of three, looks like we'll be trying the data card on Vodafone for our sales staff - better than 2.5G GPRS, and will save them carrying two handsets around

Well if you want to access the BBC website using 3 then you can just keep wanting its not going to happen. Ditto every other site. 3 have a walled garden which means you can only access the expensive content they supply.

I have no idea why your T610 wont access the site but maybe someone else will know. Post the question on this forum.

Thanks, but it doesn't matter about the T610 access problem because it will be going soon. I'm on my second T610 and neither can access many sites that my T68 can access, including the BBC.

Interesting what you say about walled access on 3G. That's enough to put me off completely. I will probably change to O2 when the SE K700 is released next month.

Yeah you may be right there, although when 2G first came along the coverage was significantly poorer than analogue, so it wasn't a total upgrade. Also, like DAB, when the signal is weak you may have got rid of hiss and crackles, but they're replaced with other quirky digital side-effects; the dalek voice effect etc.


That is exactly what they will do. 3G has been well thought out in that it can rely on 2G whilst the 3G network is still being built up. But there will be a time when handsets are just made to 3G standards and 2G wont be involved at all.

I don't pretend to know the exact timescales but you can be sure the government have their eyes on that section of the spectrum for something else in the not too distant future. Just like the old analogue spectrum! 2G will NOT exist alongside 3G for ever.

True, though as take-up of things like this generally starts in the cities, having good national coverage isn't absolutely essential to get the product off the ground. Having a good product is, however, and that's where I think 3G is not enjoying much success as things currently stand. And it's not hard to see why - if I were to go out and get the phone of my dreams, it'd be the Xda2. None of the 3G phones even approach my radar.


Sorry, I should have qualified my earlier statement - I should have added "very soon".


Fair point. Though given the lack of consumer interest, I would not be at all surprised if, by the time the industry was ready to phase out 2G, something else had already come along to replace 3G, and customers went straight to that and skipped 3G altogether.

Is that a Microsoft handset? If so then I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole! But that's a different issue.

True, it seems from what I read on here that 3G isn't really offering a great deal to attract the customers. A couple of the people I know who have 3G have only got it because their credit checks are less stringent! I don't totally understand how the data access works, but if there really is a walled garden as has been suggested here, then it's not going to appeal to the masses until they sort that.

The mobile operators are a bit too exploitative at the moment; all this Vodafone Live nonesense, £3 for ringtones, all this sort of thing. They're scared that if you give a user unrestricted access to the net they can stop screwing you. Imagine the impact running a peer-to-peer voicechat client on a phone will have.


Well it's a possibility, but I think unlikely. If you think about it, we only had a period of about 3 years between the switch off of 1G and the switch on of 3G. I'd expect something similar to happen here. Don't be too quick to judge it; give it another couple of years and when all the major manufacturers and all the networks are fully behind it you may find 3G more attractive.