Why do Torville and Dean choreograph for all the couples?

In SCD the Professional dancers do their own choreography, if the Professionals on DOI did too, perhaps the show would not be so samey? There are only so many different moves in different combinations 2 people can think up.

Also rather than shoe-horning the required element into a routine, the routine would naturally encompass it.

The judges could then critique the choreography fairly.

T&D would still be on hand for training as would Karen (NB why doesn't Nicky help?) - but the main ideas would be from elsewhere, and would give the show a boost.

Top idea Jude. The routines last night were all too similar - nothing stood out and nothing set me on fire.

After the initial few weeks that T & D could help with the pros should know the capabilties of their celebs well enough to competently choreograph a routine for them. We may get to know a little more about the pros that way too.

Having learnt to skate in the past I think it's probably that you need to learn the basics and technical aspects without having a partner in hold before you can then go on and learn dance routines. I'm not sure the timescale of the show would allow that natural progression, so the way they are doing it with someone else choreographing, and the pro partner focusing on the practise aspect, then the coach, choreographers and pro are able to dip in and out and help demonstrate as well as practise. In "floor"dance it's probably less of a faff because although they still have technique to perfect they haven't the ice and blades/edges to contend with (this is just my take and I only learnt to skate to a fairly basic standard and have never learnt to dance).

T&D choreograph them nearly all the same, they're formulaic.

Starts off with the totally naff 'dancing' element of the routine - usually involving line dancing moves or an attempt at contemporary arm movements. Naff.

A lift.

Required element, showboat.

Lift.

Every time!

I agree as often when the judges criticise the celebs they are actually criticising the routine, which isn't the celeb or their professional partners fault. For a start a professional partner wouldn't give their celeb something that was hit or miss as to whether they could do it, I'm sure Sinita only went out because of the lift, as she was actually a good skater. Some celebs seem to be favoured with the best routines. I mean why one week when T & D said Gary needed to get his personality out did they give him a slow boring routine?

I understand that - the Celebrities have to learn to skate first, but there is nothing stopping the Professionals choreographing the routine after the first couple of weeks, surely it would help them understand just how much "their" Celebrities are capable of.
Also, they have been practising for 3 - 4 months before the show?
They showed on Fridays show, that the music choice and costumes are already picked, so the choreography could be in place as far as the Professionals are concerned, ready to show the Celebs on Monday.

It's much harder I'd think for the pros to choregraph because unlike a dance studio there are no mirrors on the ice rink. You can't see what a move looks like. There is also greater risk and you need people on hand to assist with some moves and to help the couple see if they are skating together, in time, and what the problems are. I do couples ice dance and while it is sometimes possible to work out what is going wrong with a move between you it is not easy.

They probably also have far less experience of choregraphing than dancers do as in shows the choreography is usually done for them and most high level skaters would have a choreographer to work with them as well as a coach.

I've watched a beginner dancer learning a dance with a coach that the coach is choreographing and it is very hard for them to work without feedback.

I would imagine the pros have some input though and to be honest in the time they have there are limited moves they cna do.

Very few of the celebs can skate very well so they are limited to the same basic moves and the dancey bits where they are stationary and the lifts, are there because they don't have enough skating to actually fill a minute with.

If the pros did the routines what would the show need T&D for.

I do think some weeks they have got the choreography completely wrong. Sinitta for instance. If Andrei had a say on the routine he would have took that lift out as it wasn't consistant.

Didnt Frankie do the choreography for them the other week? I'm sure it was mentioned.

I think T&D do the majority, its why you see a lot of the same elements. Someone NOT doing a headbanger is more unlikely than that someone will.

I expect we will see some more before the end of the show.

Hi Jude

Torvill & Dean are so experienced that I think their programs are better than anything the other pros could offer - just think back to the Boleros that the couples have had to choreograph themselves and they aren't quite up to the same standard.

Also, whilst I agree that the routines we see are a bit repetitive, Torvill & Dean are quite restricted by what they can and can't include. The celebrities are all beginners so there are limits as to what they can cope with. It's inevitable that a lot of tricks and lifts will crop up again and again. The novelty has worn off slightly but I'm not sure the other pros would be able to fix that. They will face the same restrictions that T&D do...

Not all skaters are choreographers. Torvill and Dean were the exception to the rule, they choreographed their own routines. Most ice dancers and figure skaters rely on their coaches or a choreographer to help with their routines.

Torvill and Dean are experts, they know better than any of the professionals on the show what will work best choreographically. They can also work very quickly when it comes to putting a routine together. There's only a week to choreograph and learn a new routine and if the pro was responsible for doing that, it would cut back on a lot of rehearsal time. Yes you may see a lot of similar moves in the show but if you watch the Olympics next week you'll still see a lot of very familar moves which have been taken from Torvill and Dean's numerous routines over the last 30 years.

The professionals work with the celeb over the course of the week, as well as Karen and the choreography does get tweaked. Also the professionals and the celeb do get to choreograph the Bolero for the final.

Also, they have to work within the limits of the personality of the skaters. Kieron and Brianne's routine on Sunday was a fairly fun and interesting one, but it only worked because they had the personality to sell it. Give that to Gary and Maria, say, and you'd have had a total disaster - it's just not very them. That's always going to limit the sort of routines certain couples can do.

Whilst T&D do most of the choreography, I am sure the pros can have some input, even if it's limited. For example, from the VT this week it was Fred who was pushing for Emily to skate on her own.

Yes and even the contestants can have a little input too if they want to. Ray Quinn ceratinly had an input into his choreography.



I agree with some of the earlier comments that T&Ds choreography is a bit boring. I'm not enjoying this series as much as I have enjoyed DOI in the past. The standard just isn't as good IMO.

I've found the choreography in this series a bit irritating as well, lots of things do seem to be creeping in to multiple routines. T&D particularly seem keen on making them stand virtually still for the first section of the routine which never makes anyone look good, whether they can skate well or not. I've had occasional quibbles with choreography before this series though. I think sometimes contestants are just given such a bad routine it's impossible for them to look good doing it (when even the pro looks daft doing it you know it can't be good). It can be quite costly. They also allocate them strangely sometimes. A perfect example the week before last was Mikey being given the personality routine and Gary being given a boring one.

It would be nice if the pros had more input but it does have its difficulties. Don't the pros get to choreograph their partner's bolero though? (Though obviously only 3 of them get to do that!)

My favourite routines have always been Chris's Timewarp and Suzanne's Music. They both had such creative dance moves and felt like a breath of fresh air from some of the stale routines you get.