They all get in someone to help them it happens every week. Try and get over it

The 6 year old would be a beginner skater too!

Hayleys dancing skills indeed seemed better than Dan's. But she wouldn't compare if she was having to do all the stuff they did stationary, while moving on ice, which Dan probably could.

I understand your point but there really wasn't a lot of skating (in terms of edge control and turns which is what distinguishes the better skaters) in Hayley's routine.

It's a different style and one which most people seem to like and most of the ones that arent' that impressed seem to be those that skate and compete (albeit at low levels) themselves.

Actually they usually go somewhere and I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a time they have actually brought in a specialised (not a general chorographer since I think Kevin came to the rink) choreographer for a particular style of dance to the rink iself.

Anyone?

From the results they got perhaps they should do it more often and it would get over the 'same old, same old' problem people are complaining about with DOI in general this year.

I don't understand what difference it makes, whether they come to the rink or the skaters go to them. Maybe the choreographer preferred to go to the rink?

The difference would be that when they've gone somewhere it has been to a general line dance, or ballet, or whatever class. Not specific to their routine or specific to a routine on ice.

When the choreographer came to the rink she gave them specific moves for the routine they were about to perform. They could coordinate them with whatever they were doing with their feet. It made for a great routine and like I said elsewhere maybe it's something they should do more for all of them as it it allows for more variety.

Well they could have watched a video to get the specific moves?

I dont think that would allow it to be tailored to a routine on ice though. The beneft of having someone there is the feedback - what they can do, what works, what suits the routine and their music. It wasnt' a case of just picking a few moves - it was a beautifully crafted routine.

I'd better stop or I'll be talking myself into liking it

It was a good routine - it just didnt' have much skating

I cannot tell you how many people have told me how much they enjoyed the routine, people of all ages, male and female. You can criticise and say Hayley doesn't do much skating and I will always disagree. Everything about that performance was sensational and only Hayley out of them all of them could have done that because she is the only one good enough. She was graceful, everything she did was perfection, every little beat, every little movement was perfect. Her landings were soft, she was fluent, flowing from one movement to the next. Beautiful. Unbeatable, in this series anyway.

Didn't Daniella have a specialised choreographer for her Tango? Does it matter whether they went to the choreographer went to them?

I can't help it if as a skater I will always want to see more skating. I've never said the routine isn't good - it was and Hayley is obviously an excellent dancer and performer (I'd go so far as to say the best dancer and performer in this series) but in this show she is not my favourite because I like the ones that do more (or rather better technically) skating.

I also know in the context of this show more skating is not necessarily a winning formula or even appreciated by most people as it is difficult to tell the difference between what is hard and what is easy unless you've done it and different things are harder for different people.

As ever my complaint such as it is for Hayley is that I think she probably is capable of much better technical skating but the powers that be concentrate on the flashy toepick stuff because it looks good on the show and that's what they want.

I'm not even agin them bringing in the choreographer for her but trying to explain why it makes a difference. You asked, I answered.

Possibly - I can't remember that far back! I dont' recall seeing a choreographer on the ice with them but I may be wrong.

I've explained above why it makes a difference. Being able to tailor something specific to the routine and get feedback on what's suitable on ice.

Otherwise you might as well say why don't Jayne and Chris just send in a video of what they want the skaters to do for their routine and have them copy it. I think most people can see why that wouldn't work and the same applies to any other specific choreography.

But the pro skater would know what would work on ice and what wouldn't. I would think that would have more to do with being convenient that giving Hayley extra help.

But the pro skater is not the choreographer. In the case of Dan he was learning the routine from the choreographer as much as Hayley was - and not quite as well as Hayley it would seem. So the two of them were able to give direct feedback to the choreographer.

They all had help one way or another did they not? Bringing in the choreographer is nothing new...they send the celebs all over the place, and bring in other people to help them out.

May I politely suggest you read the thread posts above - I think this has all been gone over and I'm not saying it all again.

She didn't write their routine.
If you watch the VT again, you can hear Chris saying WE choreographed the routine, but to give it more authenticity, we decided to ask the help of ......

Unless you think he's exaggerating or distorting the truth.

As far as I can tell, Chris and Jayne are paid to do the series of DOI, which is about teaching celebs to dance on ice - incorporating a certain number of skating techniques. They probably have contracts, setting out what they are to do. The ice panel probably do too - they are there to judge, comment on skating skills/performance and give each contestant marks out of 6.
I can see no reason for Jayne and Chris to favour one celeb over the others, give them easier routines/nicer music/extra special help/a nicer partner etc etc. They are trying to push all of them to improve, but yet not so much that they can't do it and make fools of themselves.

With everything that's been in the news over the years about "fixing" phone polls or the results of competitions, ITV'd be daft to try anything that gave one contestant preferential treatment.
And the celebraties would be daft to make claims that could easily be disproved in these days of Google, and so on. You'd only need one disgruntled boy/girlfriend, family member or former teacher to speak up and say "it wasn't like that, they've had loads of skating lessons", or whatever; and they'd soon be discredited and all their hard work undone.

So why the posts saying "Hayley gets special treatment because she's the favourite"? If people appear to be gushing over her, it's because she works hard, puts in the hours, will have a go at anything - oh, and happens to be a good performer. Something which is improved because she puts in the hours, etc.

Sorry...I was commenting before I really read the posts. My apologies.

I'm a bit late I know but totally agree. A totally brilliant performance from Hayley & Dan

Presuming you are referring to the choreographer you can watch the VT and clearly see her on ice drilling Hayley and Dan in the routine movements at the start of the routine exactly as it was performed. They aren't going to pay a choreographer to come in and simply do what they've already done, so it was the choreographer that did that. And would be the choreographer who added much of the other movements that Hayley and Dan performed so well.

I have no idea why so many people on this thread seem so keen to try and claim otherwise unless you all think that that would give Hayley some advantage - but that would be your interpretation.

As I said, I don't have a problem with them doing that. I queried whether they'd ever done it before - nobody seems to be able to come up with an example where they have.

It had a great effect on the routine and again as stated I think they should do it for more routines as it's obviously effective.

What ITV (and since they are employed by them presumably J & C) want is a great show and they've achieved that. I don't expect it to be a level playing field.

All I ever say is that I personally prefer the routines where there is more technically difficult skating and that Hayley is not my favourite.

Woohoo fred - nice to see you here.

(Terence has set a sod of a cryptic clue on the sports forum)

deleted - no point.

Icedragon, I've been reading your posts with interest. When you talk about technical ability, who do you think is best out of the current crop? Do you think that Hayley is better or worse technically than Claire or Suzanne?
( sorry if this has been discussed before but the way the thread was going it just seemed a good time to ask )

Is Haley really not putting in much skating or is it that she makes it look to easy that it appears that she isn't doing much.
I watched the show a few days late and after reading comments on here and it looked to me like she did lots of skating and technical stuff. Especially compared to Daniella who seemed to be lifted throughout her set.
My opinion is Hayley is head and shoulders above everyone. I do normally go for the underdog but I am really enjoying watching her and for once want the best one to win rather than the 'journey' person.
I do think though that Hayley would not be streets ahead in other years - this year the standard is a lot lower. Hasn't stopped it being enjoyable though

To some extent it depends on your perspective. From what we have seen Hayley is the best of this year's lot at doing the dancing on toepicks stuff, which not everyone can do but if you can do it (and she showed us right from the start it was easy for her) then it's a handy way to incorporate dance moves. I did defend her against this very charge at the start but I'm still waiting to see much else, so it seems this has been developed at the expense of learning to use edges and turns and using her arms while moving over the ice. Those things (edges, turns) are the ones that to me show a better technical mastery of skating *Gets flak jacket ready for inevitable flurry of Hayley defender's missiles*

The reason I would put Gary as the best skater technically this year is because he skates using the edges and shows that he can skate with power and control. His strokes are cleaner (less toepushing) and his crosstrokes cross better. He gets down in the knees and makes what he is doing look easier than it is. (Probably why on this programme he gets labelled as dull unfortunately for him). His moves flow nicely so for me he gets top marks for the skating skills, edges, turns etc and also looks very steady and confident lifting his partner - confident enough to be able to do a rotating lift rather than a straight line lift.

My favourite though is still Kieron - it wasn't at the start but he seems to have come a long way and I've enjoyed watching his skating confidence blossom and the relationship with Brianne develop. He injects a lot of fun in to what are now quite technically difficult routines. Wasn't so thrilled by the daft half axels but he's a young lad and that's a show off move

I honestly don't remember much about Claire's skating but don't remember being that impressed. She was good in the lifts and had a pleasing style.

The one that did impress me was Suzanne. In my view she was more versatile than Hayley in that she could do it all, the toepick dancing, the edges, the turns, the presentation, the musical interpretation, the lifts etc etc. and hers are still the routines that have wowed me the most of any of them. She had beautiful lines and extension, could use her edges and use her arms while turning and could hold edges after moves rather than having to quickly put other foot down or change foot.

Having said that Ray was probably the best ever technically and had the most natural talent as well as the skills from rollerblading and dancing. Although in that series I adored Donal and loved his hydroglide which is a technically very difficult move that very few adults in particular can do at all well and he was a natural at it. And Chris F impressed me in that he can now do twizzles (very difficult!) although he couldn't while on the show (but he did have the best spin ever on the show).

Very good post. I agree with you on everything!! I think sometimes and understandably of course people get blown away by things that look impressive and fail to notice the actually quite difficult things that a good skater can make look easy, such as the way Suzanne holds an edge. I'm not saying that what Hayley does is easy, she's a good enough skater, but she lags behind technically. Her performance is great though.