This is a question for the skaters please!

When Hayley has done her spin, both last night and in the Slumdog Millionaire performance, she is clearly spotting, as a dancer would be taught to maintain balance.

I seem to remember last year Ray specifically being told not to spot, as spinning on ice is too fast compared to on a dancefloor, and spotting interrupts the spin. It looks clear to me that Hayley is suffering from doing this, you can see with every revolution when she looks to the front she is interrupting the spin and slowing down, and looks increasingly unstable by the 3rd and 4th revolution.

Surely if Ray was told not to do this, Hayley has too? I think she is the best of the bunch this year, but she seems to be missing a trick here, what do you skaters think?

Thanks,
Tangos

Bonnie and Zaraah both spotted during spins, but if you spin as fast as Ray, Chris or Jess it's too fast to spot.

I've often wondered, how do they not get dizzy and fall over if they can't spot?

This is probably a stupid question, but what is spotting

You shouldn't try to spot a spin in skating - there is simply no time for it but I think dancers find it hard not to try.

For Pigs might fly spotting in a spin is where you look at a point and then as you spin you turn your head quickly back to look at that point (or spot). It is supposed to help counteract dizziness I think.

On ice you simply get used to the motion. I never really had a problem with dizziness in spins - maybe because it took me a long time to get more than 3 revs.

Now I can do 12-16 or more revs and not really be dizzy afterwards or at least it's gone by the time I've done the exit edge.

I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong someone) it's when you pick a spot in the distance and each time you spin as your head comes round you focus on that spot - to keep orientated about where you are.

Wow I fall over when I turn around to look at the back of my chair. You must have a good ballance centre.

It really is just practice!

The hard part is not dizziness but learning to centre a spin. I think Hayley's dance training would have helped her with this bit as she centred hers well which is why she could get 4 revs without doing the back crossover windup entry. if you can get the spin centred on the sweet spot of the blade then you can spin as long as you can maintain the balance on the sweet spot and have enough momentum going in which comes from pulling in tightly.

She was also good at 'pulling up' and lengthening her body which helps to keep momentum going.

I assure you I could not spin, but I know it has something to do with my vestibular system. I'm always impressed when I see the professionals do all the spinning. Thanks for the info by the way, it's really interesting.

Do you think her spins are suffering from the spotting though Icedragon?

I am attempting to learn to spot for latin dancing, and just doing 1 rev for a spiral or spin is hard on my rather ropey sense of balance! Can't imagine a 12 rev spin That's just Crazy

duplicate post oops!
Last edited by icedragon : 23-03-2010 at 13:16

She seems to be doing pretty well with her spin but you can't keep the momentum going if you don't do the proper windup entry so that the free leg can give you the momentum to keep the spin going so her spin suffers more from her not being able to do a momentum generating entry yet.

What she is doing is centreing herself first while still and using her dance spin skills to get her 4 revs, although she still travelled a bit on the one she did on Sunday.

Gary got some momentum into his spin by going into it with speed and bringing his free leg round which helps to keep the momentum going but it's much harder to centre it this way which is why his also travelled.

Ideally you want to generate momentum (usually by swinging the free leg around), centre yourself (so weight is over the sweet spot of the blade) and then bring the leg and arms in tight to speed up the spin and get lots of rotations. Then you can also do a nice exit edge rather than simply running out of steam.

I think the world record upright spin is 115 revs! And the fastest recorded was spinning at 308 RPM!

My personal record is 16 revs but I'm proudest of the ones I do that are perfectly centred so you leave a tracing on the ice of tiny circles all on top of each other no bigger than a small dinner plate (preferably smaller) - only then you can't count them

I bet the record for the number of revs and the fastest spins are held by swiss skaters?.

I think Lucinda Ruh (Swiss) still has the most number of spins but the fastest is actually a Russian.

My award for most amazing spins definitely goes to a Swiss guy though - Lambiel. Love his skating.

Blimey, but they had the decency to at least fall over afterwards surely?!

Thanks for the detailed answer Icedragon, really interesting!

Tangos

Just checked and yes the fastest spin was by a Russian lady. I agree with Lambiel, he is one hell of a spinner. A lot of Swiss skaters seem to be very good at spinning, must be something in the water
I remember Lucinda Ruh as well

'Spotting' in generally more tricky on the ice...as you should be 'flowing' so Hayley has been really impressing me by doing this. Perhaps she finds it easier, I dunno.

Thanks guys

He's fantastic isn't he? Did you see his performance in the gala at the Olympics ( and the European championships) to "Ne me quitte pas"? - stunning! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7g45BHERjfs

Just to jump in on the convo () I adored his gala program this year. It makes me swoon. I'm sad that he's retired for good now.

Yes, it's supposed to; but the turning quickly back part makes me wonder about that theory. I find that somewhat unpleasant in itself.

I absolutely love him; both his exhibition programme and his competition ones...i'm so gutted he's really retired now! His spins are unbelievably amazing!

Finding the sweet spot on your blade (and keeping yourself there) is the hard part. Once you can consistently get that, then you can up the number of revs. I find it impossible to even try and spot when spinning, you've really just gotta go with the momentum.

I would think it's habit - lots of dancers do it when they start skating but it doesn't help on ice. You should be looking in the direction of the spin and keep looking that way. You can't really do it if you go in to the spin with flow but Hayley stops and centres first then does a dance spin on ice.