I think there must be many thousands of parents up and down the country who are uncomfortable with their kids being exposed to gay characters and relationships.

They would argue that the kids should have their innocence.

I think you make the assumption based on your beliefs. When in Doctor Who has a gay relationship been so over-bearing that it became on the verge of indecency? Come to think of it, when has any relationship on Doctor Who been portrayed as such?

Doctor Who is a family show and I think you misunderstand the intelligence of children. Of course they are "not losing" their innocence by watching nothing happen on the show. Any sexual reference on the programme was written that it would fly over the heads of the very young and older children will just take it as a bit of light hearted banter....which it is.

Gay references on Torchwood are more explicit but that's because it's an adult show and it is up to parents to decide whether they feel it's suitable for their kids. If they have issues with the characters sexuality then they wont watch it anyway.

The important question is why.

RTD had clout from his Doctor Who connections so was able to parlay that into setting up a sci-fi show in his backyard.

Nothing wrong with that per se but it does smack of a vanity project which wouldn't have seen the light of day otherwise.

Interestingly Torchwood only got really good when RTD expanded its horizons from the Vale of Glamorgan with Children of Earth.

I will repeat RTD is from Swansea and lives in Manchester. Cardiff is convenient for Torchwood because of his involvement with Doctor Who so it isn't to do with him that TW is there but being cost effective and putting to two shows in the same place. Why would you film elsewhere when it was convenient to do it there?
And I come from the Vale that that you so disparage where a lot of CoE was filmed as well.

As a parent with 3 kids (7, 6, 3 ) it never bothered me that Captain Jack is omnisexual, or that their are gay references. They already know my gay friends it's the norm!

My husband is a Christian, not all Christian's have this intolerance to homosexuality only the fundamentalist nutters.

Back to Torchwood, Children of Earth was excellent even the horrible ending. The 1st 2 series were excellent.

Good evening. Thanks for summarising several posts with such positive words.

I would like to apologise in case you found a previous post of mine that referred to Christians offensive. It was not my intention to offend. It meant to imply **some** christians not all.

Yes, Torchwood CofE was absolutely spellbinding. The shocking conclusion was unexpected but sombre but nevertheless gripping. I hope the show does return in the future.

Just to add my two penneth into all this, any friends of mine who have kids have always been open with them from an early age about their two uncles.
The best explanation I heard was when my friend explained that their two uncles loved each other like mummy and daddy loved each other - the child who had asked just accepted this explanation without further question, and I think most kids are the same.
If you go on forums for the soaps the kids on there are usually rooting more for the gay couples to get together than the striaght couples! So to sum up, with all this understanding that seems to be there from an early age, I think kids would question more if there WASN'T gay people in the Doctor who universe

All brilliant posts and i agree with all of them...

Yes but it was Children of Earth not Children of Neath & that's an important distinction.

I'd just watched most of two rather boring series, couldn't be bothered after that. I'll get round to watching it at some point.

Digital Spy posters/members are not really representative of the British public at large though.

I think in another post it was hazarded that about 35-45% of all DS people are gay - about 9 times the national average.

Of course there is more tolerance on this website than there is in society as whole where there is much more scepticism and even hatred.

ABSOLUTE POPPYCOCK! I think you'll find the country is more concerned about the economy than gay people.
I think that again you are using your own prejudices to justify what you think is correct. Britain is one of the most tolerant nations on earth, and with 8-14 million people watching DW I think gay references (if they exist on the scale you suggest) do not bother one of them!

I hope you are correct.

However my own experiences and contacts have always suggested to me that there are far more homophobic people in Britain than there are homosexuals.

Can I just say however that I deplore all hatred and nasty prejudices where people are hurt etc.

So what are you saying then? that because there are some crazy people out there spreading such hatred, the minority groups should just give up, lock themselves in, and never be heard or seen? Just in case their existance offends a bigot? Life will stagnate....and you do know the Doctor would be the first to disaprove of such discrimination...so at least as a fan of the show, and of the character that is the Doctor....stop encouraging such discrimination by continuing to say that there is no such place for "gay" references in Who.

I deplore all discrimination.

So then you don't actually mind any type of gay references in Who and the like then? Well that is good to know

Not including gay references in Dr Who is not discrimination.

If that is the case then Eskimos have been discriminated against in 99% of Dr Who over the years.

Well that is reassuring but why have you posted so many negative comments about "how you don't want it on TV" or your suggestions that this country is homophobic gay people are hiding in caves incase of being stoned to death?

I don't for one minute believe homophobia doesnt exist. Of course it does. However I believe it exists mainly in the over 60's as younger people are more accepting nowadays. Society and time have moved on and I would hazard a guess that with every three people, one of them will have at least one gay friend. There have always been gay people, it's just nowadays gay people are more likely to declare their sexuality more openly. And they are proud of it. Bloody good for them too!

We are falling down the same trap again....

I didn't say that including gay references means that the show is there fore not discriminating against homosexuals...what i meant was that as you don't discriminate, then surely you won't have an issue with gay references in Who, after all I doubt you would complain that an Eskimo turned up in a bunch of stories.

(Blinkered?) opinion again. I'll explain below.

Of course Cardiff would have nothing at all to do with the small matter of BBC Wales being based there, Doctor Who production team being based there, many elements were already in place (production facilities, links with The Mill, etc), with a resultant sharing or reduction in costs. It is also far easier logistically and financially to film on the doorstep of the main studios (especially when the facilities are already in place for DW). The concept of the Rift had already been introduced in DW S1 . But hey, carry on ignoring the obvious if it bolsters your conspiracy theory.

And as I have stated in other threads, it's a pointless exercise trying to hold a sensible discussion with someone who holds a conspiracy theory dear to his heart, so I'll leave you to it.

I really don't get what this has got to do with my post.
I suppose you think I'm referring to the soap forums on DS, I'm actually not, I refering to many other soap forums all over the internet
Plus, as I said, its KIDS who are posting their wish for gay couples to get together in the soaps, not grown up gay adullts.
I've never really experienced any homophobia personally, except my own brother in law, but you do find that those who are strongly homophobic usually are hiding behind it as to not show the REAL person they are - and that includes my brother in law!

There's no conspiracy theory.

As you say there were synergies which enabled RTD's pet project Torchwood to exist.

It is a pet project though.

To believe otherwise is the real conspiracy theory.

I agree with you Jeff.

A vanity exercise really to make himself more powerful and influential at the BBC.

I have to say I don't understand what point you are trying to make. You have a problem with BBC Wales making programmes in Wales? You think it's some weird Russell T Davies quirk that a programme being made and funded by BBC Wales would be filmed in Wales? Do you think BBC Wales didn't make TV before RTD turned up? Or it's OK for BBC Wales to put up the knowhow and money and take the risk to make Dr Who and Torchwood but they should still be set in England because...?

I apologise if I'm misunderstanding you, I admit that I don't understand what point you are making and I know I'm writing in annoyance which is never sensible, but the fact that Dr Who and Torchwood were made in Wales means a lot to me and if that was RTD's 'vanity' then more power to him.

The point is that Torchwood would never have been made without RTD's influence on the BBC. You could even say he 'abused' his status to get this programme made.

If it was an orginal pitch by an unknown (with exactly the same sciptsand ideas it would nt have been made.