Apart from being pleasently suprised about how un annoying she was...... She actually came across very well On Saturday.

Anyway that aside, what is the time difference between SITL and TOA? I thought SITL was a long way in the future? Im finding it hard to join Rivers TimeLine up?

I think she's a time traveller as well as The Doctor. They're both well aware that never meet each other in the right order so both their timelines are irrelevant

We havent had anything to suggest she travels time tho have we?

Also point to bring up.... Ood mentioning your Song is coming to an end...

river SONG?

That's true, the River being a time traveller was just a theory of mine. I tend to look at River as being the "Time Travellers Wife".

As for the Ood, I think that just meant the Doctor's 10th life.

I dont have the same thoughts about River...... Altho I do see the relationship... good book but terrible film!

I think there maybe more in the ood thingy......

River Song IS Any Pond
Where do i caim my £5

Nah not for me... cant see that one being true!

Didn't River and Amy touch during ToA? That's a definite no-no in Doctor Who paradox terms.

No direct contact with earlier/future versions of yourself.

I thought this episode would be where he meets River for the first time so i was shocked when River said "so have we done this" while going through her book..

I wonder what her role will be in the two part finale. I've found people like Captain jack who have returned for the finale (like the season 3 one) rather useless.

So far there is nothing to suggest that she dabbles in the old bit of time travel, however as its the 51st century, she could be a time agent etc, remember Jack had his watch that allowed him to travel, she could have something similar.

I also believe that the Ood "your song is coming to an end" meant that the Doctor would be regenerating, i.e. the Tenth doctors song would be ending, but a new one has begun in the eleventh doctor.

According to a SM interview (don't know which) she IS a time-traveler.
And she is meeting the Doctor on her terms.

SitL is in the 51st Century
ToA should be before this, but I don't when.

Not just touch, but "River, you hug Amy. I'm busy."

It's things like that quote that make you understand how Elizabeth I came to hate him.

Ghastly thought.... River Song = Captain Jack! (Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey and all that stuff)

I believe Alex Kingston described herself as a time travelling Indiana Jones but I don't recall SM ever saying River time travelled (apart from with the Doctor when they went to the end of the Universe).

ToA also takes place in the 51st Century. Exactly how many years before the Library it is for River we don't know.

As Humans in the 51st Century may well have the ability to slow aging (they had it in the 29th Century as seen in the Beast Below) it may have been 20 or 30 years between ToA and SitL for River but she hasn't aged as such.

My understanding is that she is a time traveller only in so much that she travels with the Doctor at some point, not that she time travels independently of The Doctor. But time will tell.

So far she hasn't let on to the Doctor that she time travels, comments about her meeting various incarnations of The Doctor out of sequence suggests to me she just lives a linear life.

It would certainly complicate the story if she is somehow time travelling to manipulate The Doctor, but it would be interesting.

So far she has been to prison (an event I assume happened before SIL/TTOA), meets the Doctor in his future, then meets earlier versions. But she doesn't seem to know they are earlier versions at first. However, if she is a time traveller, perhaps she hasn't yet been to prison and is trying to manipulate events to change her future and ensure she doesn't go to prison.

Right, so.....

If she first meets the Doctor in the Library (according to his timeline) and then talks about spoilers etc, but then dies (in her timeline) then when he meets her this time round it must be an earlier version of her, as the events of the library brought about her death, so how come this time she's talking as if she is aware of their meeting in the library, mentioning spoilers etc.

Apologies if I've got this wrong, but it is pretty confusing!

When does she mention the Library?

When shes talking about Spoilers it's to repremind the Doctor when he lets it slip that she becomes a Professor, something she did not know as it was in her future and therefore a spoiler.

It's not that she references the library, but the way she casually shouts "spoilers" as if they've already had the conversation about her diary and spoilers, when although they have had that conversation in his timeline, they haven't had it in her timeline.

Maybe they have had it in her past as well, so in the Doctors future she would be mentioning 'spoilers' for the first time, although I have to admit in SitL she sounds likes she has never said it before- I dont think we should get caught up in that though, its probably that Moffat hadn't planned to put in the whole 'spoilers' thing should River Song ever return. That said, it could also be that River said it like she had never said it before as she knew that Ten was the youngest incarnation of the Doc she had ever met and he would be unfamiliar with her little catchphrase

She's been encountering the Doctor for years in goodness knows what order I would think they have the Spoiler conversation (either him or her saying it) pretty much every time they meet.

Apart from her knowing how to pilot the Tardis. That alone pretty much guarantees she's done a bit of time travelling.

It's the other way around. All the previous meetings are in her timeline. So far we've seen the first two meetings in the Doctors timeline. From the Doctors point of view that's it. From her point of view she has a book (diary) full of meetings previous to these two.

Transform one of your books into a diary like River Song's! The ideal place to keep spoilers...

River Song's Diary Dust Jacket

“Submitted for your approval”

Reasons Amy could be River:

First discount the “no touching” rule since it may not apply if you allow for either alternate reality selves or clones.

Now the possible reasons:

1) Amy’s hair is red, River’s is strawberry blonde in TOA/FAS and Auburn in SITL/FOTD (both related to red hair in a younger person)

2) hard to see but their eyes appear the same colour

3) pond is a small body of water, river is a larger (older) one

4) Amelia is a SONG by Joni Mitchell that has applicable references
a) “it scrambles time and seasons if it gets thru to you” in VOV there is comment on time travel with the Doctor making it hard to go back to normal life
b)”people will tell you where they’ve gone, They’ll tell you where to go, But till you get there yourself you’ll never really know” in FAS River comments on the story not being told, it has to be lived.

If you look further in the song you can easily find other lines that could have bearing

5) Lastly and I think most tellingly…….near the end of FAS River holds up her cuffed hands and says “You……Me…..handcuffs…..must it always end this way?”. Her timeline has not entered SITL/FOTD where she knocked out the Doctor with a punch and handcuffed him so she could sacrifice herself, but Amy did knock out the Doctor with a cricket bat and handcuff him to a radiator. Will we see another set of handcuffs “when the Pandorica opens”?

“reality? Possibility? Fairytales?, or just another set of questions that draw us into
The Doctor Who Zone ?”