Last two episodes are on I player, just watched em, but agree with you totally f.......d up the enjoyment, startted to watch it on HD , but got some other grotty show.

Well done BBC top standard broadcasting as usual.

Not sure you're correct on that point. I remember an episode of Dr Who & Torchwood being shown at different times on BBC1 & BBC HD.

Graham

But Heroes is nor Dr Who or Torchwood...the BBC own the rights to those two.

They can be shown later on HD but not before its shown on SD.

Just to clear this up- the problem of having to simulcast would only apply to acquired (bought in) programmes, such as Heroes. (It could also apply to something like Match of the Day- if that were made in HD.) For programmes the BBC had comissioned- whether thats in house (such as Doctor Who or Torchwood) or from independent production companies in the UK (like Ashes to Ashes) those restrictions aren't in place. I'm not totally sure about the SD version having to be shown at the same time or before the HD version- but it does ring a bell, because the BBC Trust didn't want the HD channel to become a way of premiering programmes.

Whether an imported programme has to be simulcast will vary from show to show, depending on the deal in place- and what the company sell the progamme would allow- its the same for Mad Men as it is for Heroes (because thats caused problems when theres been scheduling conflicts) but, as has been stated, there isn't the problem for Damages.

Willthetech- the BBCs restrictions on showing Heroes in HD wouldn't have anything to do with NBCs decision on whether to renew the show or not. NBC won't get anything from its sales abroad, they'll go straight to Universal. They'd pay very little (or no) interest to how it sells abroad- the one thing they might look is that it sells well on DVD / Blu-Ray and thats one of the things, along with NBCs lack of obvious replacements, that have helped keep it on air. They only connection that might be there is how much Universal might want to make the show- they might accept a bit less if it sells well abroad, but DVD / Blu-Ray sales will be just as, if not more, important in that calculation. Those might well be boosted by restricting HD rights.

When I checked the cached EPG on the HDR at 10:20 the EPG had been updated (I think Heroes was scheduled for 11:40) however no clock symbols were present indicating they were not set to record. Checking the schedule showed that the first Heroes was still set for 10:40. Pressing guide to do a full EPG refresh and schedule planner rebuild then indicated that Heroes was set to record at 11:40.

Again checking at 11:00 as the snooker was about to finish showed the cached EPG had been updated so Heroes was due to start at 12:05. Again these were not set to record and the schedule still showed 11:40. Pressing guide again rebuilt the planner and re-scheduled the first Heroes to record at 12:05. Both parts of Heroes then recorded fine.

I don't quite know what happens with the HDR when the EPG changes. It seems that if the change is made several hours in advance then the HDR will pick it up and adjust its schedule however if they happen at short notice (and I'm thinking here in the region of 2 hours or less) then from my experience it does not seem to adjust its schedule.

P.S. I use padding as I am not a fan of accurate recording as I seem to miss too many starts of programs. Can't quite get my head around the logic e.g. recording two programs on at the same time with padding the first one starts and then a couple of minutes before the second recording a conflict dialog box appears and the HDR switches over and records the second one as expected. With accurate record the first one starts right at the start of the program (as expected) but the HDR does not pop the conflict dialog up until it is the exact time the second one is due to start. By the time it turns itself over to record the second one it normally has already started. Surely it should switch over a few minutes before and look for the start signal or am I missing something?

Good point jeffersbnl regarding BD sales. With regard to premiering on BBC HD, whatever the programmme, isn't the HD channel a stand alone channel now? Isn't it a flagship demo of the furure of broadcasting? Perhaps not then, especially as the BBC are obsessed it seems with the internet as the future, rather than as just another broadcast medium, with it's poor quality definition and even worse audio quality.

As for updates to the EPG and timers, it would seem essential the the viewer is on hand to ensure the PVR start on time etc; seems to me to defeat the object of such recordings, that is you can't be there to watch so you set a recording timer. Last minute changes are the objective of such control. I'm obviously missing something here.

Regarding simulcasts, this does not actually take place since the HD version of a broadcast is always a few seconds different to the SD version, as far as I have observed the HD is slightly later than the SD (not just on the BBC). Not relevant I know but...
And many many years ago there was legal argument regarding copyright, ownership and the 'right' of viewers to record programmes, wher it was decide that "live" broadcasts (notwithstanding delays caused by the electronic circuits) had no specific protection but a delay in transmission by recording and then playout even if only by seconds had full protection. And law is rarely repealed even if often ignored.

Am I remembering this correctly, but in the very early series of Heroes, didn't BBC HD show two episodes back-to-back so that the second episode was the same as the next week's SD version?

Or perhaps I'm being confused by something similar...

Geoff

BBC HD is its own channel, but there were a number of conditions put on it by the BBC trust when it launched full time after its trial- particuarly with regard to how much of its content could be films or sport- to avoid any accusation it was trying to compete with premium film or sport channels (ie Sky). There may also have been a condition about not premiering programmes- I'd suggest having a look through the different service licenses that have been issued by the BBC Trust- I haven't got time to read through them! The reason would be to avoid accusations of those who can afford HD benefiting beyond the technical advantages.

I think you've answered your own question about simulcasts- a difference of a few seconds would classed be a delay caused by the transmission path. I'm not quite sure what you're getting at with the rest of your point- that would be a protection for people at home recording programmes. It wouldn't apply to broadcasters- they'd have to abide by the terms set out in the rights document- which, it seems, allows for only a few seconds difference (or they can get away with a few seconds difference) between BBC 2 and BBC HD- and not any more than that.

All that happened to me was that I was a trifle irked that the final episode failed to record on the Saturday, because I knew it was repeated on Sunday. No biggie!

Mine recorded fine, Humax HDR on series record no padding, but it didn't stop recording.
I ended up with the two episodes back to back and eight and a half hours of BBC HD preview. I happened to notice it was still recording the day after, and stopped it before all my other recordings were deleted.

It was the same on SKY. Fortunately I decided to stay up and watch "live". I ended up with most of the preceding programme recorded as the 1st ep and only part of the 2nd. Had to manual record on Freeview.

I'm in South Yorkshire area and my HDR recorded both episodes of Heroes back to back just fine. I'm presuming we're talking the chapter 6 ending "New Dawn (or beginning)" (I forget exactly which).

I also hardly ever update my epg only ever when I come to scroll through the epg and find it blank to the right. other than that, I leave mine alone and it seems to update itself in the main.

I know thats not much help, but it does perhaps indicate that there may be some kind of regional marker issue going on if some boxes recorded it and others didn't.

What a load of useless drunks, drinking all our "gun to the head" TV tax money - sack the lot of them - as unfortunately, we can't string them up from lamp posts, like they deserve!

Normal TV overan (which took them completely by surprise, as a live sporting event - who'd have thought that would ever happen - especially with snooker??????????). so what did the incompetents do? Ran a filler programme about Rock, so all we got of Heroes was the "Previously on Heroes..." reminder for the first of the final two episodes of a major TV series, that people actually watch! Great to see you've got your priorities right, you useless bunch of incompetents!!!

Sack the lot of them!

Sack the lot of them!

Sack the lot of them!

Sack the lot of them!

Sack the lot of them!

Yes, I have only just tried to watch the two episodes I had recorded amd found out (too late), that they were being repeated the following Friday, after they were deliberately obliterated!

BBC and no advertising, totally unbiased, etc., etc.,etc. - the biggest lies in the Universe - they've done the same before - must be agreements to ruin the end of popular series, to boost the disc sales afterwards!

Did any one else like me try to catch the last two episodes on BBC3 Saturday morning due not getting the HD ones the week before? If so did you miss the last 15 minutes of the last episode because they were running 15 minutes late? Thanks BBC.

Yes. Just so cheesed off I can't be bothered to complain again, especially after the 'usual reply' to the complaint I made to the Beeb.
If asked today about the license fee, I would point out if it had been Sky, I could cancel my sub, if it were Blockbuster I could never again darken their doors. May not make a great difference in the global scale of things, but trade used to be about keeping the customer happy and each and every customer was important (and right). But if they've got your money upfront and you've no choice but to pay it what can you do?
Oh yes, the election. yes possibly more important than a TV series. But by then there was nothing much left to say but I forget! Even more important were the "experts" with their "unique" insights. How would we manage without Newsnight.

I don't know whether the people at the Beeb actually read complaints or glance at them to get the gist, then send out the 'usual reply' relating to that programme.
I got the"usual reply" (patronising) regarding simulcasts.
But they don't seem to realise that (not for the first time) I was asking why the EPG information hadn't been changed.

What is needed is a way to emphasise points on their pages

I successfully recorded the (early) Saturday morning repeats on BBC2, but I didn't trust them so I created a manual timer starting 10 minutes early and finishing 45 minutes late. So the 15 minute delay didn't catch me out.

I too, logged a complaint on the BBC website on 3rd May. They promise to reply within 10 days but I've heard nothing yet.

Geoff

(Sorry I meant BBC2 not 3) But yes, I too have given up complaining. If I moaned about every BBC scheduling issue that had caught me out I would be sending at least one email per week. Whatever happened to the good old days when programmes were on the same day, same time, every week until the series ended?...or am I just starting to sound old now...!